Hainsey wasn't! brought in for top 4 dman, but Rosen has elite skating, but Borgman! He's the guy to keep an eye on! Get out Rosen/Borgman highlight videos! The scouting reports coaches fans in Sweden! Borgman just won best rookie of the year award! What a score to grab these two!
- MR.Hunter

I agree. Not sure if they will be ready for this year, but Borgman looks like a score. 10 points in 14 play off games on the championship team. Thanks Ari Vuori

Don't kid yourself: Hainsey will start the season in the top 4 with Gardiner, Rielly, Zaitsev and him for minute leaders.

Wouldn't be surprised if we see him and Rielly together, with Rielly playing the right side.

It's obviously not ideal, but he'll be in the top 4 until (hopefully) somebody pushes him down to 5 (Carrick, Dermott, or Rosen).
- gravyface

Ok I won't kid myself!

Oh
- Corn_Logg

I hope I'm not interrupting, been reading the dialogue about state of leafs D you guys have been having. I have to agree that LL is in no hurry here. After training camp someone already here could turn out to be the next Zaitsev...and then the D doesn't seem to be as big an issue. They're not expecting a Lidstrom/Pronger type Dman out of the bunch but what if a guy turns out to be a Manson clone? And if no one does then look at making a move.

I really hope the patient path is what they take...worked out so far.
- reefguy69

Ideally I think they'd like to have all the kids seasoned one more year! But hopefully one can steal the show and push Ron franking Hainsey to to bottom pairing where the franker should be! ...have a great night fellas!

Ideally I think they'd like to have all the kids seasoned one more year! But hopefully one can steal the show and push Ron franking Hainsey to to bottom pairing where the franker should be! ...have a great night fellas!
- MR.Hunter

Eemeli Rasanen is a large presence on the ice. Standing at an astounding 6’7’’ tall and weighing in at 214 pounds, he’s a literal mountain on skates. He loves to play physically, and with his body type, that’s a scary force to have patrolling a blue line.
With a frame like his it’s not hard to see why Rasanen enjoys the physical play. He has the ability to shut down opposing forwards entering the zone with clean hits.

“I like to hit people a lot.”

That's what I'm saying: Rielly and Gardiner were horses in the playoffs, with Zaitsev right behind them once he started feeling better.

A 2nd pairing guy is really not out of the realm of possibility with Rosen, Carrick or Dermott (not to mention Liljegren year after next potentially), so why lose a Brown or Kapanen and picks for a Manson or Vatanen right now?
- gravyface

I don't think we see Liljegrin for at least 2 years personally just because I think they want him as ready for the big show as possible. But you're perspective on this matter I believe is the best way to approach it. If JVR/Bozak get traded or walk away it's not the end of the world. They're both valuable as bait but equally or more valuable actually playing for this team. I don't think Brown gets traded either unless it's a lopsided deal for the leafs. Having those three lines as dangerous as they are is a real threat and opposing coaches have to consider this. The kids are eventually going to be better as well. They're in good shape and in even better shape if just one of the new guys makes the team

[quote=winsix]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZCiAQ7AG6vU

Kid looks great. Actually produces offense. Quarterbacked the PP for the Frontenacs all year.

What about a Gardiner, Rychel/sosh package of some kind for a top dman. It's taking a gamble one of dermott Rosen borgman will be ready ths season. And that carrick still progresses. Hainseys warming up lilegrens spot. Wpuld you guys do that? I like gards but I also like all our young forwards and hate to lose a kapanen or brown even for a dman. And I like jvr sticking around

Not sure how you rate Tanev higher than Zaitsev - I respectfully disagree.
- winsix

Meh, Zaistev was awful last half of the season or so and looked completely lost in his own end. Im not very high on Zaistev, hes alright. If healthy id take Tanev over Zaistev no question personally.

JMO but I think waiting til at least the end of camp is the right move here. Gards is a serviceable player for this team. Just rather not give up assets until they know what they have.

What about a Gardiner, Rychel/sosh package of some kind for a top dman. It's taking a gamble one of dermott Rosen borgman will be ready ths season. And that carrick still progresses. Hainseys warming up lilegrens spot. Wpuld you guys do that? I like gards but I also like all our young forwards and hate to lose a kapanen or brown even for a dman. And I like jvr sticking around
- TonkaPhaneuf

Not sure, Gardiner was the leafs best dman last year. Depends on the dman coming back i suppose but hard to say how much better a player then gardiner youre getting by adding Rychel or Sosh. It kind of sounds like Dermott is going to be given every chance to make the team.

Not sure, Gardiner was the leafs best dman last year. Depends on the dman coming back i suppose but hard to say how much better a player then gardiner youre getting by adding Rychel or Sosh. It kind of sounds like Dermott is going to be given every chance to make the team.
- ClarksonDavid

The swedes as well. All gonna get long looks at camp I'm sure. Like I said earlier, if even one of those guys ends up having a year like Zaitsev did last year they're in ok shape. Not close to Nashville or Calgary depth wise on D but definitely improved over last year.

Have a good night

What about a Gardiner, Rychel/sosh package of some kind for a top dman. It's taking a gamble one of dermott Rosen borgman will be ready ths season. And that carrick still progresses. Hainseys warming up lilegrens spot. Wpuld you guys do that? I like gards but I also like all our young forwards and hate to lose a kapanen or brown even for a dman. And I like jvr sticking around
- TonkaPhaneuf

Gardiner is a top defenseman. Even if you found a marginal upgrade (using mediocre guys from the AHL?) it doesn't help the depth situation.

The swedes as well. All gonna get long looks at camp I'm sure. Like I said earlier, if even one of those guys ends up having a year like Zaitsev did last year they're in ok shape. Not close to Nashville or Calgary depth wise on D but definitely improved over last year.

Have a good night
- reefguy69

Expecting anyone to have a year like Zaitsev is beyond unreasonable I'd say. Zaitsev was actually highly touted. 36 points, top pair duties with Rielly and was 9 seconds short of leading the team in ice time.

Meh, Zaistev was awful last half of the season or so and looked completely lost in his own end. Im not very high on Zaistev, hes alright. If healthy id take Tanev over Zaistev no question personally.
- ClarksonDavid

Zaitsev matched up against every top LW in the East practically all season. Without a doubt the most consistent and all-situations capable pairing last season was Rielly-Zaitsev.

There were times the pair was overworked and seemed out of sync particularly around and after Rielly's injury but to say he looked completely lost is a big stretch.

Zaitsev is a quality top 4.

Zaitsev matched up against every top LW in the East practically all season. Without a doubt the most consistent and all-situations capable pairing last season was Rielly-Zaitsev.

There were times the pair was overworked and seemed out of sync particularly around and after Rielly's injury but to say he looked completely lost is a big stretch.

Zaitsev is a quality top 4.
- Blazed

Zaistev was completely out matched in those minutes. Stats, eye test everything showed it. He was talked about lots on these threads about his struggles. I still think hes a quality second pairing guy but he cant play those minutes like last year very well imo

- winsix

fake, not even a good fake.

I think the asking price for a #4 is just out of whack, as Lou and Co. found out over the two drafts leading up to July 1st.

Hainsey isn't an ideal solution, but the difference between a 4/5 is really not that huge. Do I want to see him in our top pairing? Not at all, but him a 4/5 as a known commodity with a handful of young guys fighting for 4/5/6/7 isn't terrible either.

Particularly with Rosen, who Leino was saying is the best skater he's ever played with, has a bomb of a shot, reminds him of Lidstrom, etc. Take it for what it's worth, but that's somebody that may very well find himself on the team and moving up the depth chart by mid-season.

We had no idea if Zaitsev was even going to stick last year and he had a solid season, particularly towards the end once him and Rielly settled down.

And then there's Dermott, another kid who's going to compete hard in camp, and could stick, surprise the team, pushing Marchenko and Marincin down and out... who themselves may have better seasons, like Marincin did in 2015-16, when he was healthier.

To sum it up, let's not get carried away with loading up for a dynasty and maybe ground our expectations a little bit and see what shakes loose with our youth.
- gravyface

Great post.

Now I'm off the KFC for some fries and gravy......face!

I don't think we see Liljegrin for at least 2 years personally just because I think they want him as ready for the big show as possible. But you're perspective on this matter I believe is the best way to approach it. If JVR/Bozak get traded or walk away it's not the end of the world. They're both valuable as bait but equally or more valuable actually playing for this team. I don't think Brown gets traded either unless it's a lopsided deal for the leafs. Having those three lines as dangerous as they are is a real threat and opposing coaches have to consider this. The kids are eventually going to be better as well. They're in good shape and in even better shape if just one of the new guys makes the team
- reefguy69

I agree. I think Liljegren starts the year in Sweden. Needs to have a big year to be the guy and get his confidence back. If he played with the Marlies he'd probably be bottom pairing playing behind Dermott Holl Rosen and Borgman. Maybe even behind Nielsen and Valiev. If he dominates in sweden then bring him over after xmas if it looks like he might be ready in a years time.

I think the asking price for a #4 is just out of whack, as Lou and Co. found out over the two drafts leading up to July 1st.

Hainsey isn't an ideal solution, but the difference between a 4/5 is really not that huge. Do I want to see him in our top pairing? Not at all, but him a 4/5 as a known commodity with a handful of young guys fighting for 4/5/6/7 isn't terrible either.

Particularly with Rosen, who Leino was saying is the best skater he's ever played with, has a bomb of a shot, reminds him of Lidstrom, etc. Take it for what it's worth, but that's somebody that may very well find himself on the team and moving up the depth chart by mid-season.

We had no idea if Zaitsev was even going to stick last year and he had a solid season, particularly towards the end once him and Rielly settled down.

And then there's Dermott, another kid who's going to compete hard in camp, and could stick, surprise the team, pushing Marchenko and Marincin down and out... who themselves may have better seasons, like Marincin did in 2015-16, when he was healthier.

To sum it up, let's not get carried away with loading up for a dynasty and maybe ground our expectations a little bit and see what shakes loose with our youth.
- gravyface

I think Rosen has the best chance of pulling a Zaitsev. Was considered one of the top D in the swedish league all year long. Probably unlikely he has the impact Zaitsev had but he'd be my bet for the 5-6 slot with Carrick.

Zaistev was completely out matched in those minutes. Stats, eye test everything showed it. He was talked about lots on these threads about his struggles. I still think hes a quality second pairing guy but he cant play those minutes like last year very well imo
- ClarksonDavid

In a position to fail in the top pairing tbh.
I like Zaitsev.
Play Zaitsev in the the 2nd pairing & let him excel.
There is no getting around the need for a top 2 D & playing other D won't be the answer. Trade for one or ride it out are the options nothing else.

fake, not even a good fake.
- Aetherial

That cheeziness is what makes it humorous

I think the asking price for a #4 is just out of whack, as Lou and Co. found out over the two drafts leading up to July 1st.

Hainsey isn't an ideal solution, but the difference between a 4/5 is really not that huge. Do I want to see him in our top pairing? Not at all, but him a 4/5 as a known commodity with a handful of young guys fighting for 4/5/6/7 isn't terrible either.

Particularly with Rosen, who Leino was saying is the best skater he's ever played with, has a bomb of a shot, reminds him of Lidstrom, etc. Take it for what it's worth, but that's somebody that may very well find himself on the team and moving up the depth chart by mid-season.

We had no idea if Zaitsev was even going to stick last year and he had a solid season, particularly towards the end once him and Rielly settled down.

And then there's Dermott, another kid who's going to compete hard in camp, and could stick, surprise the team, pushing Marchenko and Marincin down and out... who themselves may have better seasons, like Marincin did in 2015-16, when he was healthier.

To sum it up, let's not get carried away with loading up for a dynasty and maybe ground our expectations a little bit and see what shakes loose with our youth.
- gravyface

If all else fails just sigh Franson.

Like him or not he's capable of playing tougher mins and he can surpress shots and has a good shot for the PP

sure he's not super fast but that's why he isn't getting 5x5

If all else fails just sigh Franson.

Like him or not he's capable of playing tougher mins and he can surpress shots and has a good shot for the PP

sure he's not super fast but that's why he isn't getting 5x5
- Santo_44

Not really keen on Franson, had him before, was so so and would probably want more term than the Leafs would want to give. Stick with the plan and if a reasonable RHD can be had for a decent price ok. Especailly stay away from middle of the road d-men from bottom five teams.

Reilly Zaitsev
Gardiner Hainsey
Dermott Carrick
?

Would you be willing to do Bozak for Marc Staal and two 2nds? We'll even eat $2M of his salary.

...please??

I have the papers right here.
- Tonybere

How many years left for Staal?