I don't see any upside to trading Panarin. Seriously....I need help understanding this concept as to how the Hawks get better dealing him......
- SteveRain

they don't. but if the cap remains at $73 the team will forced to deal at least 2 quality forwards. Panarin would be one of the easier guys to deal and would bring back the biggest return.

I do recall us debating back in the fall about the 16-17 Hawks cup chances as the roster constructed. As far as your Nashville comment goes, I saw a very quick Nashville team that was relentless on the fore check and came in waves. So much so that their team speed caught the Hawks off guard and had some Hawks defenders retreating back below the circles on zone entries. Were they instructed to avoid being beaten high? Unsure, but the Nasvhille team speed was evident.

The Hawks unwillingness to engage in 50/50 battles also was a defining detriment.

My best guess is a cap around 75.2 million. That is a 3% escalator with the NHLPA included, as I dont' see them raising it a full 5% just like they didn't last year.

Point to all these postings is very simple......to get cap compliant AND change a few things up you will be essentially from one strength to plug a weakness, but in doing so you are creating another weakness. You trade a Hammer or Seabrook to plug a 1 lw, you create a hole on your back end.....and I respectfully disagree any solution to plugging those new holes resides in the organization. Kempny is a project, TVR at best is a #4 in the nHL, and the Hawks young bucks still have a ways to go to provide the necessary depth options this team needs to be legit cup contenders.

I agree 100% on Hartman. That's only going to get worse, and out of all the rookies in the playoffs, he was by far the most disappointing.
- SteveRain

I still believe the HAWKS ran into a perfect storm in the Preds ,a team playing their best hockey of the year .Deep fast and a hot goalie ,they were completely healthy . They defeated ST.L and ANA dealing with significant injuries

HAWKS will need to make moves or move this off season for Cap reasons ,what's new . Their real top pieces other then Towes and Kane to bring anything back and save some cap space would be Panarin or Hammer .They may want to move one or both .Maybe they could move both for a solid player like Kane Duchene Landerskog Drouin and a top prospect or pick . Then they would have some cap space ,could sign a decent D man K Russel or someone of that irk .And play Kempny and Frosling .

I really believe in a lot of the kids that the HAWKS have ,and think that the coaching staff has to be a little more involved in teaching them the big league game . That is were I think Dineen would be a better fit . As for Hartman I felt he had a great season ,and played very under control .As for his playoff I think he was injured and had a cast on his wrist after the playoffs were over . Curtsy of C Perry .His flare up in the playoff was out of character for what he accomplished during the season .

and who picks up his goal scoring production?
- SteveRain

That is a fair point, and I do not have a good answer. 30 goals is tough to make up, but would you rather have a 30 goal scorer or a defenseman capable of perhaps taking over for Keith or Seabrook as they age? How does one make that value judgment?

Maybe you can find another 20-30 goals in a separate trade, free agent signing or in a combination of a maturing Nick Schmaltz, and a rookie scorer (don't know who that is either). Calling Toews for a few more goals? My guess is that they could find enough additional offense to make up the difference, but there is risk here.

Scott Powers @ByScottPowers 5m

#Blackhawks draft pick Robin Press to sign AHL deal with Rockford IceHogs for next season, agent says theathletic.com/64084/2017/05/…

they don't. but if the cap remains at $73 the team will forced to deal at least 2 quality forwards. Panarin would be one of the easier guys to deal and would bring back the biggest return.
- DarthKane

Oh I don't disagree.......that's the issue that Bowman and company has created. They dont' have a ton of wiggle room and the fact that it's being reported to ship Kruger off and NOT take back salary, assuming Vegas doesn't want him, you need to include a pick OR prospect just goes to show you how off kiltered some of these salaries being paid by Hawks management truly are viewed around the league.

What about from the other blue line back to his goalie?

Does he have the defensive "ability" (which means
- StLBravesFan[to me] more of a mind set than a skill) to be an effective top-6 center there?

He is a willing and capable back-checker, but I think last year he would have had a lot of problems doing the hard work down low and in between the circles against bigger center men.

they don't. but if the cap remains at $73 the team will forced to deal at least 2 quality forwards. Panarin would be one of the easier guys to deal and would bring back the biggest return.
- DarthKane

...and now for the silly trade of the day based on Ek's rumor and grumblings in the DC area:

Panarin, Anisimov (or Kruger), and TVR for Ovechkin and draft picks. Salary balances out (give or take). We get our LW. Washington is able to plug the holes that Ovechkin leaves. TVR can fill in the likely defensive holes that the Caps have with the probable departures of Alzner, Shattenkirk, and Orpik. PR splash for McDonough...everyone wins!

Imagine a top line of Ovechkin, Toews, Panik (or Hossa). Yikes...and now back to the Kool-Aid.

Oh I don't disagree.......that's the issue that Bowman and company has created. They dont' have a ton of wiggle room and the fact that it's being reported to ship Kruger off and NOT take back salary, assuming Vegas doesn't want him, you need to include a pick OR prospect just goes to show you how off kiltered some of these salaries being paid by Hawks management truly are viewed around the league.
- SteveRain

If the cap is flat and Vegas takes Kruger then the Hawks are still around $1.5 over. Other contract needs to go and Panarin wouldn't be my first choice (or second or third) but if there is a solid hockey deal then why not consider it?

I still believe the HAWKS ran into a perfect storm in the Preds ,a team playing their best hockey of the year .Deep fast and a hot goalie ,they were completely healthy . They defeated ST.L and ANA dealing with significant injuries

HAWKS will need to make moves or move this off season for Cap reasons ,what's new . Their real top pieces other then Towes and Kane to bring anything back and save some cap space would be Panarin or Hammer .They may want to move one or both .Maybe they could move both for a solid player like Kane Duchene Landerskog Drouin and a top prospect or pick . Then they would have some cap space ,could sign a decent D man K Russel or someone of that irk .And play Kempny and Frosling .

I really believe in a lot of the kids that the HAWKS have ,and think that the coaching staff has to be a little more involved in teaching them the big league game . That is were I think Dineen would be a better fit . As for Hartman I felt he had a great season ,and played very under control .As for his playoff I think he was injured and had a cast on his wrist after the playoffs were over . Curtsy of C Perry .His flare up in the playoff was out of character for what he accomplished during the season .
- oldduffman

Here's the thing....and the moving target nobody here knows for sure is the cap....at 73 million they are currently 4.5 million OVER per cap friendly.

I get their 2 biggest trading chips where they get some actual return, don't have to include prospect(s) or pick(s) to ensure they dont' take on salary are 4 and 72. Others would be 88,19, and 2 but those probably aren't being moved.

I just don't see them making that sort of HUGE move as that signals a minor rebuild.......

I'm not saying I don't agree with your assessment just stating that the ability to retool on the fly is going to be on hell on wheels for this management team

...and now for the silly trade of the day based on Ek's rumor and grumblings in the DC area:

Panarin, Anisimov (or Kruger), and TVR for Ovechkin and draft picks. Salary balances out (give or take). We get our LW. Washington is able to plug the holes that Ovechkin leaves. TVR can fill in the likely defensive holes that the Caps have with the probable departures of Alzner, Shattenkirk, and Orpik. PR splash for McDonough...everyone wins!

Imagine a top line of Ovechkin, Toews, Panik (or Hossa). Yikes...and now back to the Kool-Aid.
- hpk90

And add blazing speed on Kanes line - you may have something.

That is a fair point, and I do not have a good answer. 30 goals is tough to make up, but would you rather have a 30 goal scorer or a defenseman capable of perhaps taking over for Keith or Seabrook as they age? How does one make that value judgment?

Maybe you can find another 20-30 goals in a separate trade, free agent signing or in a combination of a maturing Nick Schmaltz, and a rookie scorer (don't know who that is either). Calling Toews for a few more goals? My guess is that they could find enough additional offense to make up the difference, but there is risk here.
- hpk90

To accomplish that they would have to resort back to what the Ducks were.....When Ryan-Getzlaf-Perry all skated together. You would have to put Toews-kane and yoru next best player and create a super line.

I agree on restocking on defense, but playing devils advocate here I hope people realize that when you are subtracting these sorts of players, given how deep they are in "cap hell" as of today, they are in deeper trouble then the casual fan realizes.

If the cap is flat and Vegas takes Kruger then the Hawks are still around $1.5 over. Other contract needs to go and Panarin wouldn't be my first choice (or second or third) but if there is a solid hockey deal then why not consider it?
- DarthKane

Don't disagree.

You trade somebody like that and you essentially are signaling a rebuild and IF you are doing that.....then I reach out to Hossa and see if he wants to go east to chase 1 last cup.

Trading any of 4,7,19,88,2,72 to me signals a rebuild
Trading 15 or 81 is cap relief and while I don't like it, I understand it.
I am fully on board that 16 has to go, and I think people are going to be very surprised if Vegas doesnt' take him how much extra Bowman has to throw to clear that salary.

...and now for the silly trade of the day based on Ek's rumor and grumblings in the DC area:

Panarin, Anisimov (or Kruger), and TVR for Ovechkin and draft picks. Salary balances out (give or take). We get our LW. Washington is able to plug the holes that Ovechkin leaves. TVR can fill in the likely defensive holes that the Caps have with the probable departures of Alzner, Shattenkirk, and Orpik. PR splash for McDonough...everyone wins!

Imagine a top line of Ovechkin, Toews, Panik (or Hossa). Yikes...and now back to the Kool-Aid.
- hpk90

Like the idea....but it would take more then panarin, tvr and 15 or 16. You may need to include a high pick or prospect.

To accomplish that they would have to resort back to what the Ducks were.....When Ryan-Getzlaf-Perry all skated together. You would have to put Toews-kane and yoru next best player and create a super line.

I agree on restocking on defense, but playing devils advocate here I hope people realize that when you are subtracting these sorts of players, given how deep they are in "cap hell" as of today, they are in deeper trouble then the casual fan realizes.
- SteveRain

Yes, they are in deep cap trouble. No question. It seems to me that many deals have to have equal or near equal money going back and forth, or that they are high risk high reward. That's hard for many casual fans to accept.

Kings Name Dave Lowry As Assistant Coach.

Don't disagree.

You trade somebody like that and you essentially are signaling a rebuild and IF you are doing that.....then I reach out to Hossa and see if he wants to go east to chase 1 last cup.

Trading any of 4,7,19,88,2,72 to me signals a rebuild
Trading 15 or 81 is cap relief and while I don't like it, I understand it.
I am fully on board that 16 has to go, and I think people are going to be very surprised if Vegas doesnt' take him how much extra Bowman has to throw to clear that salary.
- SteveRain

It's highly unlikely Hossa gets traded because of the recapture penalty. Trading Anisimov before Panarin makes more sense, but it all depends on how the deals look.

Here's the thing....and the moving target nobody here knows for sure is the cap....at 73 million they are currently 4.5 million OVER per cap friendly.

I get their 2 biggest trading chips where they get some actual return, don't have to include prospect(s) or pick(s) to ensure they dont' take on salary are 4 and 72. Others would be 88,19, and 2 but those probably aren't being moved.

I just don't see them making that sort of HUGE move as that signals a minor rebuild.......

I'm not saying I don't agree with your assessment just stating that the ability to retool on the fly is going to be on hell on wheels for this management team
- SteveRain

I don't think that 4 gets moved. At his $4mil cap hit not enough bang for the buck, i.e. cap relief. Anisimov gets you slightly more relief and can probably be replaced in the lineup much easier than Hjalmarsson. Trading #15 may cost you a Hinostroza or the like, but it makes more sense than dumping #4.

Like the idea....but it would take more then panarin, tvr and 15 or 16. You may need to include a high pick or prospect.
- SteveRain

I would throw picks and/or prospects in. I do not love Ovi as much as many others do, but he fills a lot of holes for the Hawks. He is only 31 with mileage. Chicago is one of the few markets that could handle him for endorsements even though he has a face only a mother could love...

I don't think that 4 gets moved. At his $4mil cap hit not enough bang for the buck, i.e. cap relief. Anisimov gets you slightly more relief and can probably be replaced in the lineup much easier than Hjalmarsson. Trading #15 may cost you a Hinostroza or the like, but it makes more sense than dumping #4.
- TheTrob

You could trade Kruger and Anisimov and while the team's depth at centre takes a big hit there are option to replace them. If #4 or #7 are dealt who replaces their minutes?

I don't see any upside to trading Panarin. Seriously....I need help understanding this concept as to how the Hawks get better dealing him......
- SteveRain

If it is for someone like Duchene or another C/W with similar or equal numbers to Panarin (which is very few and far between), it does not necessarily make them better, but the versatility of the forward definitely helps. So it seems to be a draw trade or a no win trade if that happens.

I don't see any upside to trading Panarin. Seriously....I need help understanding this concept as to how the Hawks get better dealing him......
- SteveRain

1.5 million in cap space when youre up against it can sign a veteran with NHL experience who can fill out the lower lines.

...and now for the silly trade of the day based on Ek's rumor and grumblings in the DC area:

Panarin, Anisimov (or Kruger), and TVR for Ovechkin and draft picks. Salary balances out (give or take). We get our LW. Washington is able to plug the holes that Ovechkin leaves. TVR can fill in the likely defensive holes that the Caps have with the probable departures of Alzner, Shattenkirk, and Orpik. PR splash for McDonough...everyone wins!

Imagine a top line of Ovechkin, Toews, Panik (or Hossa). Yikes...and now back to the Kool-Aid.
- hpk90

No way he's worthy of Leddy's/Schmaltz's number...and we'd lose him during the Winter Olympics!

1.5 million in cap space when youre up against it can sign a veteran with NHL experience who can fill out the lower lines.
- fattybeef

Right you are essentially a worst off team then last year.

that doesn't make any sense.

You could trade Kruger and Anisimov and while the team's depth at centre takes a big hit there are option to replace them. If #4 or #7 are dealt who replaces their minutes?
- DarthKane

Exactly....that's the debate.....you could make a case for 72/4/15/7 as to who replaces their production (72), their slot (15), or their minutes (4/7)

81 BTW if he plays out his deal in a say a more European Canadian city then the recapture penalty thing becomes a mute point. With all the crap that goes on with LTIR I doubt we will ever see the day a recapture comes back to bite a team. Othewise Pronger, or Savard would have done so by now.

I don't see any upside to trading Panarin. Seriously....I need help understanding this concept as to how the Hawks get better dealing him......
- SteveRain

Totally agree with SR.....we finally have a young, highly skilled, speedy sniper and everbody wants to move him. Trading him straight up for Patch makes no sense if you're trying to improve your team and help the cap. Stan's boat for sure. He has to unload Kruger and another big contract to be able to make some moves.