I'd forget these big name players in trade and look at shoring up the bottom end of the Hawks roster - a big nasty forward or 2 like Austin Watson is what's necessary. That was painfully obvious in the series with Nashville.
- RickJ

Ugh...hate that guy, but agree with your post. He'd be better in a bottom six role than say a Jurco or Moose.

I wouldn't mind if Panarin was traded for something that helped balance the lineup but I do think continued development from some of the yutes from this past season will help that as well...along with a Duck Dynasty extra like Watson.

eehhh what the hell...my trade:

dump 88 and 19 for a bunch of picks maybe 8 mildo in salary back and let er rip...

beats the heartbreak of missing the playoffs or getting bounced early with them...

eehhh what the hell...my trade:

dump 88 and 19 for a bunch of picks maybe 8 mildo in salary back and let er rip...

beats the heartbreak of missing the playoffs or getting bounced early with them...


- bogiedoc

I don't know...I like Darth's idea of moving the franchise better.

The Pens better not win the SC this year - I would hate to have to hang #87 up in the rafters also.

Wasn't Kruger tried at 2C several years ago - failing pretty clearly?
- StLBravesFan

I think failing is a bit harsh. They tried him there for a while. Hossa actuially had a pretty good season on his right wing. It was also his first full pro season in North America.

As I said earlier, if I had to bet, Kruger's not around this fall.

But to me it is also not the "foregone conclusion" that some think it is. And furthermore, he is not nearly the "useless, hands of stone" player the message board lemming narrative portrays him as.

And the Hawks are going to have to get very creative this summer, so wait and see.

Listening and watching, thinking what is going on here. What the heck. It is a debacle. And i dig how you were able to use "modicum" btw.

In a small way McDonough feels the brunt of the collapse; after all it was his lieutenants whom were pummeled. But rather than the knee jerk response - and who knows how much Dineen spilling the beans really mattered in the chief not changing his guard - yes it is now not "what have you done for me lately." Rather it is what can you do going forward.
I would bet that McDonough is not going to be gun shy about anyone being fired. I do believe, however, that he will be fair and somewhat patient. Looking for answers, or another way of doing things on the ice which appear promising is very nice. Yet McDonough knows results is what matters.....as in "W" and "L."

They're on the clock, both Q and Stan. Scotty might say something interesting which may result in McDonough calling time out to re-think IF by New Year we are struggling say hoovering around .500. But a new coach, be it Dineen or even Ulfie, will not steer a coarse much better.

No sir. The team has to at least be somewhat rebuilt. Stan should choose that route and try to fill in with AHL help, waiver pick ups, etc al. He should scour expansion team choices and figure if there is a deal or two before and or after the Expansion and Entry drafts.

Whatever route Bowman (or possibly a predessesor) goes, someone better realize that gazing into the crystal ball Stan's old battle plan is tattered and ruinous. He needs fast, larger players. Not a complete overhaul but bring in at least one on offense and defense. Hayden sticks. Maybe Baun can pound some bodies and score a few as an energy player..For cripes sake, you want to become a puck control team again. Then you better get tougher too. And win more at the dot.
- jhawk59

"Collapse?" More of a sag, and a sag that they didn't anticipate for at least a couple more years.

That's why the salary structure is so bollocksed up—they're stuck unless they do some more significant re-engineering this summer. And IMO, they have to or it's just a facade til the actual rebuild begins in the next couple of years.

Good news is, as I've maintained, it's doable, there is still a LOT of talent on this club, but it will require the FO to be more bold and creative in how it moves on players than it has been the past several summers. And a sacred cow or two (players and/or prospects) will be sacrificed.

I will say it loud and clear: they quit. Because they were not willing to take a pounding. A greater pounding than if we had the puck more...like Cup winning teams.

Moreover, some of our best previously were among our worse this time. Injury? Never rounded into shape? I think some players tried, but they knew they were outclassed. And they know it going into the summer vacation.

So Stan and Joel better be proactive.You can sugarcoat the collapse, you can put another spin on it. But i will not believe you. We were just too soft for playoff hockey. Thanks for three Cups. The glory is worn off now. What the future holds i am uncertain. I think McDonough is uncertain too. But he is giving the coach and GM another chance. I do not say either one will not succeed, but i will say i will not be surprised if the rug gets pulled out from undeneath them. Better not make mistakes, though, or you become headlights. Don't let the door hit you on the way out.
- jhawk59

Just gonna add, broken record time:

- too many players force fit into the wrong roles, and too many inexperienced players force fit
- very weak on faceoffs
- forward depth weak
- slow, small team (relatively speaking)

Wasn't Kruger tried at 2C several years ago - failing pretty clearly?
- StLBravesFan

With Kane and Panarin on his two wings, don't think so.

Again, just saying, he played well on the second line for team Sweden, and I believe that team Sweden would beat the Hawks.

using logic that's all.

Very REALISTIC and of course that would equal an early tee time!
- nickmo2699

Yep, this roster has 1st round exit and then complete rebuild written ALL over it

Hawks will be treading water this fall as Rainman and a couple others mention...when you look at some of the projected lineups and the early teetimes its pretty realistic. Everyone is talking about moving guys who have no trade/no movers or recapture penalties.

Bowman the great capologist has handcuffed this team with continued bad trades and bloated contracts. Bowman's out over his skis and should be gone, but he's McD's pet and isn't going anywhere. His drafting record over his tenure here hasn't been that stellar either. I would refer to some homework done by Tommyhawk I believe a few blogs back in regard to this.

What's Q's shelf life...he's won 3 cups here? I think we'd all like to see this team have more of an edge to it and play with more physicality and bite. The 2010 team which Dale molded had that style to it. The stick check ballet continues at this point for the Hawks. This team seams soft and was forced to the perimeter when the games counted. Meanwhile dreadful special teams at both ends of the ice killed this team. As soon as Panarin got his bonus he couldn't seem to find the net on that one timer play which we all saw Sharp do during his time here. Meanwhile the pk box continued to do little and Stan in his moment of glory and power fired kitch.

Bottom line - Q will easily find another coaching gig when his time here is done - Bowman well I can't imagine another club wanting him as their GM.

As far as this team quitting this spring - they were outplayed by a team who's now in the Finals. Full marks to the Preds who even after losing their top two centers are still on autopilot and look like they can bring home the hardware. The Hawks had too many rookies trumpeted by the front office and a bunch of vets who have a lot of miles on those tires. The Preds have a ton of young talent especially on the backend and finally added some offense to that. The Hawks looked old and slow.
- DK002

Too many players against Nashville did not have the desire to match the Pred's rough play likely due to a lack of teammates whom desired to play that way. Can i just say it this way: they lacked the gumption to compete in the same way Nashville took it to them. Therefore they endured a browbeating of the physical nature. The team just was not going to naturally ascribe to thus style of hockey and then, too, they took a look at their teamattes and saw injured players as well as slower skating teamattes than what the Pred's were showing. It was about as much fun and desire to work hard as compared to being blown out, beaten back soundly. So they basicly quit. Coach Q had no answer for this lackluster crew.

All the Doom and gloom around here is really overboard .HAWKS lost to a very good team . HAWKS also won the West with a team full of young players ,learning the ropes . Sure some moves will be made , but hopefully not any of the young players .
I would move Panarin and Jhammer for one solid player like a Taylor Hall or Landerrskog or Drouin ,maybe get a decent pick also or prospect .And of course some big cap space ... GO HAWKS !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ...and preds !!
- oldduffman

Not about who we lost to. All about how we lost. Other than Game 1, the compete level was lackluster. No reason you should be SWEPT by that team. Lose in 6 or 7 then that's one thing.

Not about who we lost to. All about how we lost. Other than Game 1, the compete level was lackluster. No reason you should be SWEPT by that team. Lose in 6 or 7 then that's one thing.
- nickmo2699

But when he was asked whether some of the veteran players are getting complacent and have lost their hunger after winning multiple Stanley Cups, Bowman bristled.

‘‘I don’t know if I buy that,’’ he said. ‘‘And if that’s the case, then we’re going to get rid of those people. Because the only reason we come here is to win the Cup.’’

Words are easy action is another thing!

Listening and watching, thinking what is going on here. What the heck. It is a debacle. And i dig how you were able to use "modicum" btw.

In a small way McDonough feels the brunt of the collapse; after all it was his lieutenants whom were pummeled. But rather than the knee jerk response - and who knows how much Dineen spilling the beans really mattered in the chief not changing his guard - yes it is now not "what have you done for me lately." Rather it is what can you do going forward.
I would bet that McDonough is not going to be gun shy about anyone being fired. I do believe, however, that he will be fair and somewhat patient. Looking for answers, or another way of doing things on the ice which appear promising is very nice. Yet McDonough knows results is what matters.....as in "W" and "L."

They're on the clock, both Q and Stan. Scotty might say something interesting which may result in McDonough calling time out to re-think IF by New Year we are struggling say hoovering around .500. But a new coach, be it Dineen or even Ulfie, will not steer a coarse much better.

No sir. The team has to at least be somewhat rebuilt. Stan should choose that route and try to fill in with AHL help, waiver pick ups, etc al. He should scour expansion team choices and figure if there is a deal or two before and or after the Expansion and Entry drafts.

Whatever route Bowman (or possibly a predessesor) goes, someone better realize that gazing into the crystal ball Stan's old battle plan is tattered and ruinous. He needs fast, larger players. Not a complete overhaul but bring in at least one on offense and defense. Hayden sticks. Maybe Baun can pound some bodies and score a few as an energy player..For cripes sake, you want to become a puck control team again. Then you better get tougher too. And win more at the dot.
- jhawk59

And herein lies the problem - a non-hockey guy running things. An unecessary tier of management where a bobblehead and t-shirt salesman has authority over those making hockey decisions.

It is really simple - winning creates the buzz, the season ticket wait list and the merchandise dollars - nothing else but winning matters to keep butts in the seats and the booze and merch flowing.

As for the hockey on the farm side:

Baun - no hands
Hayden - too slow
Hinostroza - not tough enough
Schmaltz - floater that avoids contact
Forsling - turnover machine

They can't draft well stuck in 25-30th position, and the late nature of these picks devalues any trade these picks might be included in.


I could be wrong, but the Hawks appear to have a coach frustrated with the lack of depth to work with who plays only the guys who best fit his vision, a GM now boxed in by his deals given to the core players with no room to move who must resort to finding cheap contracts in the form of players from other leagues and reclamation projects with a whiff of lightning left in the bottle, and a "CEO" that has no hockey background running the whole show.

The Tallon coattails have not proven to be long enough, and unless and until hockey-based decision making exclusively drives management of the roster with all parties on the same page, it is going to be a while before the team can be a serious contender again.

It's too bad they are going into the finals without Johansen. They'll miss him.
- pdx2ord

If they don't get Fisher back, I don't see the Final going more than 5 games, assuming the Pens finish off the Sens.

But when he was asked whether some of the veteran players are getting complacent and have lost their hunger after winning multiple Stanley Cups, Bowman bristled.

‘‘I don’t know if I buy that,’’ he said. ‘‘And if that’s the case, then we’re going to get rid of those people. Because the only reason we come here is to win the Cup.’’

Words are easy action is another thing!
- walleyeb1

Not a very convincing statement by Bowman.


Just have to say that to me, this team has limited options to really improve for next year. NTC, NMC and the cap have literally cemented this team to a stand still. I'm not saying its impossible, just unlikely and we will end up with pretty much the same team as last year. I believe results will be predicated on motivation, training, and coaching. If those improve, we have a chance.

Not a very convincing statement by Bowman.


Just have to say that to me, this team has limited options to really improve for next year. NTC, NMC and the cap have literally cemented this team to a stand still. I'm not saying its impossible, just unlikely and we will end up with pretty much the same team as last year. I believe results will be predicated on motivation, training, and coaching. If those improve, we have a chance.
- Lido_Shuffle

Get a new voice behind that bench who will preach "Get After It!". Q might be frustrated by lack of depth? Oh fn well. You are paid to coach my friend. If you cant play the race horse style you like, then alter your scheme to maximize what you have. Forecheck and hammer opposing D. Tell your D that nobody stands in front of our net. Finish your damn checks!!!

Ugh...hate that guy, but agree with your post. He'd be better in a bottom six role than say a Jurco or Moose.

I wouldn't mind if Panarin was traded for something that helped balance the lineup but I do think continued development from some of the yutes from this past season will help that as well...along with a Duck Dynasty extra like Watson.
- HawkintheD

So would you agree - with regret and a painful sounding tone of voice - rather move Still untapped offensive capable Panarin than see Hjalmarsson go. For none other than the reasoning whence Kempny and Forsling develop better with three experienced, good mates helping them out among the blueline crew.

Get a new voice behind that bench who will preach "Get After It!". Q might be frustrated by lack of depth? Oh fn well. You are paid to coach my friend. If you cant play the race horse style you like, then alter your scheme to maximize what you have. Forecheck and hammer opposing D. Tell your D that nobody stands in front of our net. Finish your damn checks!!!
- z1990z

Someone couldvstart a pray vigul over this! Seriously need to see it happen. Probably the same or similar thoughts on McDonough's mind! On Q's mind? Bowman devise the same? Let's all take a deep breath, exhale .....i hope so

Or regurgitate over same old same old next season

And herein lies the problem - a non-hockey guy running things. An unecessary tier of management where a bobblehead and t-shirt salesman has authority over those making hockey decisions.

It is really simple - winning creates the buzz, the season ticket wait list and the merchandise dollars - nothing else but winning matters to keep butts in the seats and the booze and merch flowing.

As for the hockey on the farm side:

Baun - no hands
Hayden - too slow
Hinostroza - not tough enough
Schmaltz - floater that avoids contact
Forsling - turnover machine

They can't draft well stuck in 25-30th position, and the late nature of these picks devalues any trade these picks might be included in.


I could be wrong, but the Hawks appear to have a coach frustrated with the lack of depth to work with who plays only the guys who best fit his vision, a GM now boxed in by his deals given to the core players with no room to move who must resort to finding cheap contracts in the form of players from other leagues and reclamation projects with a whiff of lightning left in the bottle, and a "CEO" that has no hockey background running the whole show.

The Tallon coattails have not proven to be long enough, and unless and until hockey-based decision making exclusively drives management of the roster with all parties on the same page, it is going to be a while before the team can be a serious contender again.
- Return of the Roar

And you are positive of this after:
Baun 5 games in NHL
Hayden 12 games in NHL
Forsling 38 games in NHL
Hino 56 games in NHL
Schmaltz 61 games in NHL
*regular season games
I have a higher opinion of them and will give them a chance to develop.

I am surprised the sun rises and sets in Chicago with Dale Tallon not being there to command it and eliminate any clouds.

Wirtz is making ownership decisions. McDonough is making business decisions. Bowman(s) is making hockey decisions. Q is making coaching decisions. They each have done pretty well and are well respected throughout the league. I am sure they each influence each other, more so from the top down. They have made some mistakes, but to suggest that these guys are idiots is laughable.

So would you agree - with regret and a painful sounding tone of voice - rather move Still untapped offensive capable Panarin than see Hjalmarsson go. For none other than the reasoning whence Kempny and Forsling develop better with three experienced, good mates helping them out among the blueline crew.
- jhawk59

If you're looking to trade and change the mix, depending on what comes back I would consider trading both Panarin and Hammer.

Both would arguably give you the biggest return in independent deals. Maybe Panarin gets you a young up and coming blue liner and Hammer nets you a good forward that can play with Toews.

I recognize there are a number of NMC's and most of the guys that have them, if moved, to me would signal a rebuild...just don't believe the team is as handcuffed as I'm reading in some of the posts.

Someone couldvstart a pray vigul over this! Seriously need to see it happen. Probably the same or similar thoughts on McDonough's mind! On Q's mind? Bowman devuse the same? Let's all take a deep breath, exhale .....i hope so

Or regurgitate over same old same old next season
- jhawk59

First and foremost we need to see what Stan can get done this summer. Cannot go status quo. If a Q favorite gets moved say someone like Hammer? How will Q handle that? Teams needs some balance. No easy choices trade wise. We need a speed/skilled LW for the Toews line.

If you're looking to trade and change the mix, depending on what comes back I would consider trading both Panarin and Hammer.

Both would arguably give you the biggest return in independent deals. Maybe Panarin gets you a young up and coming blue liner and Hammer nets you a good forward that can play with Toews.

I recognize there are a number of NMC's and most of the guys that have them, if moved, to me would signal a rebuild...just don't believe the team is as handcuffed as I'm reading in some of the posts.
- HawkintheD

Yes, agree with that. Hammer is the easiest of the D to move and will bring back a solid return. Panarin as well. Have to give to get.

And herein lies the problem - a non-hockey guy running things. An unecessary tier of management where a bobblehead and t-shirt salesman has authority over those making hockey decisions.

It is really simple - winning creates the buzz, the season ticket wait list and the merchandise dollars - nothing else but winning matters to keep butts in the seats and the booze and merch flowing.

As for the hockey on the farm side:

Baun - no hands
Hayden - too slow
Hinostroza - not tough enough
Schmaltz - floater that avoids contact
Forsling - turnover machine

They can't draft well stuck in 25-30th position, and the late nature of these picks devalues any trade these picks might be included in.


I could be wrong, but the Hawks appear to have a coach frustrated with the lack of depth to work with who plays only the guys who best fit his vision, a GM now boxed in by his deals given to the core players with no room to move who must resort to finding cheap contracts in the form of players from other leagues and reclamation projects with a whiff of lightning left in the bottle, and a "CEO" that has no hockey background running the whole show.

The Tallon coattails have not proven to be long enough, and unless and until hockey-based decision making exclusively drives management of the roster with all parties on the same page, it is going to be a while before the team can be a serious contender again.
- Return of the Roar

Geez i can see how you arrived at the rating for the youngsters. It might be a tad too harsh just yet. Similar judgment could befallen most prospects all teams in their earliest professional year(s). Doesn't necessarily mean they are not useful parts on the team. Core players. Not.

Yet i am prone to want to argue against the Forsling remark. He is only 20, played NHL early. Would be special if a former dman like Kitchen or Q himself took him under wing. It takes repitition in practice and games sometimes for years, sometimes not too long.....to become automatic reading and reacting properly in a split second, not several seconds.

See Ellis, Nashville. First camp he didn't know how to turn and retrieve puck on a dump in on his goaltender. Ellis was carefully trained and protected (courtesy B Trotz and minimal AHL time). Now he is a core piece in only a couple or so years.

I said all this just because i like his shot and other qualities. Can he become special? I have hope he might please in a few years actually become a second pair Blackhawk

I hope your prognostication is premature.

And now this:

DeBrincat = De Brin Can. Yes i can. Make the Blackhawks. I believe! What year is that i believe?

And herein lies the problem - a non-hockey guy running things. An unecessary tier of management where a bobblehead and t-shirt salesman has authority over those making hockey decisions.

It is really simple - winning creates the buzz, the season ticket wait list and the merchandise dollars - nothing else but winning matters to keep butts in the seats and the booze and merch flowing.

As for the hockey on the farm side:

Baun - no hands
Hayden - too slow
Hinostroza - not tough enough
Schmaltz - floater that avoids contact
Forsling - turnover machine

They can't draft well stuck in 25-30th position, and the late nature of these picks devalues any trade these picks might be included in.


I could be wrong, but the Hawks appear to have a coach frustrated with the lack of depth to work with who plays only the guys who best fit his vision, a GM now boxed in by his deals given to the core players with no room to move who must resort to finding cheap contracts in the form of players from other leagues and reclamation projects with a whiff of lightning left in the bottle, and a "CEO" that has no hockey background running the whole show.

The Tallon coattails have not proven to be long enough, and unless and until hockey-based decision making exclusively drives management of the roster with all parties on the same page, it is going to be a while before the team can be a serious contender again.
- Return of the Roar

Sounds like this team is primed for a quick decline into the lottery zone. No help form the prospects, a GM that can't make a deal, a frustrated coach, and an inept CEO.

Geez i can see how you arrived at the rating for the youngsters. It might ne a tad too harsh just yet. Similar judgment could befallen mist prosoects all teams in their earliest professional year(s). Doesn't necessarily mean they are not useful parts on the team. Core players. Not.

Yet i am prone to want to argue against the Forsling remark. He is only 20, played NHL early. Would be special if a former dman like Kitchen or Q himself took him under wing. It takes repitition in practice and games sometimes for years, sometimes not too long.....to become automatic reading and rracting properly in a spli second, not several seconds. All this just because i like his shot and other qualities. Can he become special? I have hope he might please in a few years actually become a second pair Blackhawk

I hope your prognostication is premature.

And now this:

DeBrincat = De Brin Can. Yes i can. Make the Blackhawks. I believe! What year is that i believe?
- jhawk59

Not an immediate fix but, it will be interesting to see how the firing of Dent and hiring of Colliton works out. Could be that move was long overdue.

Powers had a good piece in the Friday insider on Colliton:


https://theathletic.com/6...bs-and-the-end-of-an-era/