I'm sure the jets players are thrilled. Hurray for the Sestitos and Steckels and torres, and so forth and so on.
- ChrisMS

Steckels? and why would anyone around here care what jets players think. Pens should keep calling up goons score 7 goals and leave a trail of destruction.

right? Dude's post was comical lol
- j.boyd919

Boyd you're a jagoff... Always think you know everything. I know Gretzky was special but I grew up when he played and also know Edmonton employed some of the toughest goon's for a reason. They kept him healthy. If you think for a second that he was to quick to be hit then that's assinine!!!

I will also say as a Ranger fan who absolutely despises the cheap crap Malkin pulls on the ice, I 1000% respect his ability as a player and I was both shocked and impressed with him dropping the gloves with Wheeler. Basically saying, ok I got you last time get your shots in, and lets move on. I tip my cap to him for that.
- MiloslavHorava

I was worried you wouldn't approve

Boyd you're a jagoff... Always think you know everything. I know Gretzky was special but I grew up when he played and also know Edmonton employed some of the toughest goon's for a reason. They kept him healthy. If you think for a second that he was to quick to be hit then that's assinine!!!
- lloyd095

hahahaha

Gretzky is what he is because he played the game 2 seconds ahead of everyone else. He never put himself in positions to get hit, he left a second or two early and showed up in another spot a second or two before the puck would wind up there. THAT is why Gretzky is what he is.

Your comment "Gretzky is what he is" is assinine

Where their guys on his team specifically there to protect him? Absolutely, but that is a GM protecting his best asset. Those guys did not make him who he was, that is laughable.

Watch a smaller player today like Kane play, how often does he put himself in a position to get hit? He doesn't because he has learned to play the game that best suits his skill and body type (small) and avoid putting himself in bad spots.
- MiloslavHorava

Meaning he had a healthy career because he wasn't touched. No I don't actually think Semenko made him a better player but he did keep him healthy

hahahaha
- j.boyd919

What are you 12? Back to ignoring you.

Boyd you're a jagoff... Always think you know everything. I know Gretzky was special but I grew up when he played and also know Edmonton employed some of the toughest goon's for a reason. They kept him healthy. If you think for a second that he was to quick to be hit then that's assinine!!!
- lloyd095

Not worth arguing with that guy....you will be here all day. It's like bashing your head into a cement wall. I'm with you on Wayne. It's been widely known that he was protected and the threat alone of getting your face smashed in was enough to keep ppl off of Gretzky. Of course it seemed the opposite was true for Mario. Because of his size I feel ppl took liberties with him and the league allowed it. Lindross had that issue as well. Not all Stars were allowed the freedoms of the great one that is for sure.

What are you 12? Back to ignoring you.
- lloyd095

Nah, not 12, but I do realize the game is very different today than it was in the 80s and early 90s. That game is far gone now. I dig fighting out of emotion in the game, staged fights are retarded. Enforcers who are brought up to "deter" don't deter anything, if they did, Malkin shouldn't have to fight. Also, if Malkin had been suspended by the NHL, like he should have been for a hit to the head, Wheeler may not have asked to fight (maybe he still would have, who knows). IF the game is how you say it is, shouldn't Sestito been there to take the fight instead of Malkin?

Not worth arguing with that guy....you will be here all day. It's like bashing your head into a cement wall. I'm with you on Wayne. It's been widely known that he was protected and the threat alone of getting your face smashed in was enough to keep ppl off of Gretzky. Of course it seemed the opposite was true for Mario. Because of his size I feel ppl took liberties with him and the league allowed it. Lindross had that issue as well. Not all Stars were allowed the freedoms of the great one that is for sure.
- taleisyreXIII

Yes Gretzky and Mario had completely different protection. No offense to Caufield or Loney but neither was feared.

Not worth arguing with that guy....you will be here all day. It's like bashing your head into a cement wall. I'm with you on Wayne. It's been widely known that he was protected and the threat alone of getting your face smashed in was enough to keep ppl off of Gretzky. Of course it seemed the opposite was true for Mario. Because of his size I feel ppl took liberties with him and the league allowed it. Lindross had that issue as well. Not all Stars were allowed the freedoms of the great one that is for sure.
- taleisyreXIII

The number one of these aforementioned myths is that "Gretzky was protected". As a die hard Bruins fan of course I hated him, lol. But that did not prevent me from marveling at him.

The silliest part of the "protected" myth is that very few men in history have come into the league with a bigger target on them.

At every level Gretzky was called too small, as a 9 year old playing against 15 year old's; as an 17 year old playing against 25 year old's, etc. etc. etc. The solution to stopping him was simply going to be "to hit him". Gretzky himself has pointed out that this is how he learned to roll with hits and/or avoid them. But upon his entry into the NHL, "this was going to be the exception".

Now no one would say the Wayne was tough, lol. And he wasn't one who would "take the hit to make the play"....But that wasn't necessary.
Quote:
"The uncanny playmaking of Wayne seem to stem from his ability to see into the future. Wayne knew where everyone, and the puck, was; and where they were all going to be. Interestingly, it was this same ability that seemed to make it impossible to "line him up" for a monster hit. Something that everyone who called him "protected", failed to understand. He was elusive.
Every team in the league took their runs at him. That is not a protected guy. What would 'protected' even mean? Do people think that a memo went around the league; "Hey guys, don't hit Gretz too hard, ok?" I've known a few NHLer's over the years, and trust me, if you felt someone was 'protected' that would only serve to make them an even bigger target, lol. This is 'The Big Show" we're talking about here.

Occasionally, (rarely though it was), someone would catch him with his head down.

Witness: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=72oxwUo1T9E&NR=1

Again, not too tough, lol. But definitely not protected.

When/if Gretz had seen that coming he certainly would have peeled off and moved the pucked. Not "thrown it away" like many "soft players" through the years (I'm looking at you Craig Janney!). He was neither "soft", nor "protected", what he was was "not physical".

And for the most part, confronting a non-physical player with physicality not only failed but hurt your own team. An example of this tactic was to put a shadow on him, someone who would hit him as soon as the puck touched his stick, Gretz came up with all sorts of ways to make this tactic hurt you, he would go stand right next to another player on your team and you would be double teaming him, leaving teammates of his open...on and on and on.

Gretzky notoriously "under-performed" at the old Boston Garden (except in the '88 finals....tragically for me), in part because of it's small confines which gave him much less room to do his usual peel and turn away from hits, and also in part because of Steve Kasper, the only successful Gretzky "shadow" (again, except for the '88 finals ).

If you are still one of those who believes in the "protected" myth, do yourself a favor and catch a few games on ESPN Classic or the NHL network if you can. If you have a lick of Hockey sense you'll find it to be an enlightening experience, trust me....we all did back then and nothing has changed.

Took this from another forum of a guy who watched Gretzky throughout his entire career, seems to go against the grain of everyone who thinks Gretzky was protected. I wonder who's right?

Nah, not 12, but I do realize the game is very different today than it was in the 80s and early 90s. That game is far gone now. I dig fighting out of emotion in the game, staged fights are retarded. Enforcers who are brought up to "deter" don't deter anything, if they did, Malkin shouldn't have to fight. Also, if Malkin had been suspended by the NHL, like he should have been for a hit to the head, Wheeler may not have asked to fight (maybe he still would have, who knows). IF the game is how you say it is, shouldn't Sestito been there to take the fight instead of Malkin?
- j.boyd919

In the 80s and 90s coaches used tough guys in a way they could do their jobs. Sestito would have been on the Malkins line to start the game and would have been in Wheelers ear the whole time. No instigator helped too. I really could care less if they actualky deter anything anymore they add fun and chaos to the game.

Sestito was up not to fight for Geno but to handle the rest of the bs that when on from the first game.....namely big buff. Wheeler is of no consequence really. Malkin is a big man that can handle the likes of wheeler just fine. But Sestito was there to send a message to the Jets regarding the other running around that was done in the prior game. He even offered big buff a chance to go right before he smashed enstrom. Buff didn't answer the call that Geno did...what's that tell you really. As for the suspension....bs. total bs. Even the Bobfather MacKenzie said he didn't think the hit was that bad. Enstrom has to take responsibility for wussing out on the check.

You're misinterpreting what he's trying to say, I think. I think he's trying to say that Gretzky wouldn't have put up as many numbers as he did without the insurance policy he had on his team. He's not saying that's what made Gretzky who he was or attributed that to his playing style.
- rbaurle51

No, I think it was understood that's what he was trying to say, and that he's wrong. He "is what he is" because he was the smartest player to ever play the game. Yeah, he had Semenko/McSorely there if someone took liberties with him, but players rarely could because they could never catch him.

Edit: I guess Gretzky only scored 300+ goals as an 11-year-old because he had other tough 11-year-olds fighting the other 11-year-olds for him.

Sestito was up not to fight for Geno but to handle the rest of the bs that when on from the first game.....namely big buff. Wheeler is of no consequence really. Malkin is a big man that can handle the likes of wheeler just fine. But Sestito was there to send a message to the Jets regarding the other running around that was done in the prior game. He even offered big buff a chance to go right before he smashed enstrom. Buff didn't answer the call that Geno did...what's that tell you really. As for the suspension....bs. total bs. Even the Bobfather MacKenzie said he didn't think the hit was that bad. Enstrom has to take responsibility for wussing out on the check.
- taleisyreXIII

what did Buff do in the first game? A routine rub against the boards that resulted in an injury?

No, I think it was understood that's what he was trying to say, and that he's wrong. He "is what he is" because he was the smartest player to ever play the game. Yeah, he had Semenko/McSorely there if someone took liberties with him, but players rarely could because they could never catch him.
- jmatchett383

OR did players not explicitly try to run Gretzky because of the fear factor. It's the chicken or the egg arguements. Wayne was the best and smartest to ever play the game no doubt. But you cannot underestimate the effect of his protection.

No, I think it was understood that's what he was trying to say, and that he's wrong. He "is what he is" because he was the smartest player to ever play the game. Yeah, he had Semenko/McSorely there if someone took liberties with him, but players rarely could because they could never catch him.
- jmatchett383

That is what I remember from watching Gretzky, although I was just a kid in those days. But I've watched enough games on ESPN classic to recall that Gretzky was LIGHT YEARS above everyone in every aspect of the game.

Geno was a f ucking anmal last game. Malkamania runnig wild brother!

OR did players not explicitly try to run Gretzky because of the fear factor. It's the chicken or the egg arguements. Wayne was the best and smartest to ever play the game no doubt. But you cannot underestimate the effect of his protection.
- taleisyreXIII

I do think that players knew that they'd have to answer if they took liberties with him. At the same time, he was so damn elusive that players would have a hard time taking liberties with him short of pulling a Hunter on Turgeon-type move.

what did Buff do in the first game? A routine rub against the boards that resulted in an injury?
- j.boyd919

Well clearly the pens organization didn't consider that a routine rub that resulted in a concussion. His marching orders were understood...he clearly offers buff to answer the call. The "rub" on Schultz was absolutely a penalty. Lowery running around was absolutely unacceptable. Sestito was absolutely not up to save malkin lol.

Is it true Gretz asked for Mcsorley tto be traded with him? I'm just asking I heard that before.

OR did players not explicitly try to run Gretzky because of the fear factor. It's the chicken or the egg arguements. Wayne was the best and smartest to ever play the game no doubt. But you cannot underestimate the effect of his protection.
- taleisyreXIII

Yeah, they were all so scared to hit Gretzky

Well clearly the pens organization didn't consider that a routine rub that resulted in a concussion. His marching orders were understood...he clearly offers buff to answer the call. The "rub" on Schultz was absolutely a penalty. Lowery running around was absolutely unacceptable. Sestito was absolutely not up to save malkin lol.
- taleisyreXIII

Was it a penalty when Letang did the exact same thing to Laine towards the end of the 3rd?

I do think that players knew that they'd have to answer if they took liberties with him. At the same time, he was so damn elusive that players would have a hard time taking liberties with him short of pulling a Hunter on Turgeon-type move.
- jmatchett383

Which happens all the time in the game now...I think that is the jist of why ppl are kinda on edge about this whole thing.

Was it a penalty when Letang did the exact same thing to Laine towards the end of the 3rd?
- j.boyd919

Yup

Nah, not 12, but I do realize the game is very different today than it was in the 80s and early 90s. That game is far gone now. I dig fighting out of emotion in the game, staged fights are retarded. Enforcers who are brought up to "deter" don't deter anything, if they did, Malkin shouldn't have to fight. Also, if Malkin had been suspended by the NHL, like he should have been for a hit to the head, Wheeler may not have asked to fight (maybe he still would have, who knows). IF the game is how you say it is, shouldn't Sestito been there to take the fight instead of Malkin?
- j.boyd919

If Pens have to put Malkin on the ice first then yes Winnipeg can throw Wheeler out. Wheeler asked Malkin and he fought out of respect even though he never really fought at all. However if Sestito is on the ice do you think Malkin fights? Then Sestito steps out for Byfuglien and Winnipeg throws Thorburn out to protect him with last change. It's exactly how it went down. It wasn't staged Sestito wanted Byfuglien not Thorburn.

I'm not the head coach of the Pens but apparently he felt that Winnipeg was taking liberties in the previous game too and still sees a use for goons. Which btw Sestito isn't Jay Caufield he can actually skate a shift if needed.