- Flyers Time[/img]

???

The #1 issue this year has been the goaltending. So many points have been lost based on pretty piss-poor goaltending. That, along with Ghost and Giroux having down years, is the difference. That has nothing to do with coaching.
- jmatchett383

Not sure if your point about Giroux and Ghost having down years having nothing to do with coaching is sarcasm or not. I think coaching plays a huge role in a player's performance.

I wonder if Patriots fans think that Bill Bellichick makes no difference in players performance. They just won a Super Bowl with 3 starting WR's one was drafted in the 7th round as a QB, another was a lacrosse player from Monmouth University, and the other was undrafted.

- Flyers Time[/img]

wtf

I would argue he didn't come in and play like a number one. Remember he did have some struggles early. So couldn't coaching be a big reason for his development from game 1 to now?
- J35Bacher

But at the same time, it could be argued it was a typical junior player making a transition to the NHL. Provy was viewed as a dman that would have an impact on our team even last season in Juniors as well. Pierre and Mackenzie every time they mentioned flyers they would throw in Provy is NHL ready now.

Not sure if your point about Giroux and Ghost having down years having nothing to do with coaching is sarcasm or not. I think coaching plays a huge role in a player's performance.

I wonder if Patriots fans think that Bill Bellichick makes no difference in players performance. They just won a Super Bowl with 3 starting WR's one was drafted in the 7th round as a QB, another was a lacrosse player from Monmouth University, and the other was undrafted.
- PLindbergh31

So why did they have good/great years with his coaching last year and down years this year?

But at the same time, it could be argued it was a typical junior player making a transition to the NHL. Provy was viewed as a dman that would have an impact on our team even last season in Juniors as well. Pierre and Mackenzie every time they mentioned flyers they would throw in Provy is NHL ready now.
- arichardson22

I'm gonna go ahead and say that, if Myers makes the team next year, he'll have grown as well.

Well that is if a coach uses him. We've heard the stories in the past about a certain available coach and his run ins with young talented players.

Hakstol and Hextall are doing a slow build but won't hold back someone who's earned the shot. I'm all for that style of learning. I mean how many Janne Niinamaa's can we burn out before they belong in the NHL?
- dragonoffrost

Yeah good points, but could your honest self not put Provorov with the Flyers or in the starting 6 looking at our other dmen on the roster? My main point of playing the Devils advocate for this argument: Provorov is a poor choice to say he's grown under Haks due to 1. Our terrible d core 2. His talent 3. The league wide knowledge he was going to step in for the Flyers and impact our team positively.

Not sure if your point about Giroux and Ghost having down years having nothing to do with coaching is sarcasm or not. I think coaching plays a huge role in a player's performance.

I wonder if Patriots fans think that Bill Bellichick makes no difference in players performance. They just won a Super Bowl with 3 starting WR's one was drafted in the 7th round as a QB, another was a lacrosse player from Monmouth University, and the other was undrafted.
- PLindbergh31

You could've been taken seriously with the Belichick reference if you had mentioned defensive players. He plays little to no role in the offense and honestly those scrub receivers looking goog has much more to do with Brady than with the coaching.

I know this is hard for some fans, but try using reason instead of emotion. Before the season it was pretty much agreed this team at best would be a 7 or 8 seed again. Right now they're meeting those expectations. Trade talk is fine, depending on how absurd the proposed trade offers are, but blaming the coach for exactly meeting expectations with this low ceiling roster is going a bit far.

Yeah good points, but could your honest self not put Provorov with the Flyers or in the starting 6 looking at our other dmen on the roster? My main point of playing the Devils advocate for this argument: Provorov is a poor choice to say he's grown under Haks due to 1. Our terrible d core 2. His talent 3. The league wide knowledge he was going to step in for the Flyers and impact our team positively.
- arichardson22

Also, as a rookie, you would expect him to get better as the season went along simply because he's never played in the NHL before, and he would have struggles early. That's true of almost every single player in NHL history regardless of coaching.

The #1 issue this year has been the goaltending. So many points have been lost based on pretty piss-poor goaltending. That, along with Ghost and Giroux having down years, is the difference. That has nothing to do with coaching.
- jmatchett383

I disagree.. I think the biggest problem by far is the commitment to consistent play. Too many times the goalies have been hung out to dry. Too many times team defense has been non-existent. Too many times the offense has gone invisible.

We are a team that struggles mightily with consistency in our approach and execution.

Yeah good points, but could your honest self not put Provorov with the Flyers or in the starting 6 looking at our other dmen on the roster? My main point of playing the Devils advocate for this argument: Provorov is a poor choice to say he's grown under Haks due to 1. Our terrible d core 2. His talent 3. The league wide knowledge he was going to step in for the Flyers and impact our team positively.
- arichardson22

He was going to step in yes. But take over like he did I don't think so. Hakstol and Hextall sitting him down after the disaster in Chicago had to help him.

So why did they have good/great years with his coaching last year and down years this year?
- jmatchett383

I wish I knew. It is why I proposed the question. If Giroux is really starting to fall of a cliff at age 29 this team has huge problems. They will make the Pronger situation look like small potatoes. Pronger was on the back 9 of his career when his injury occurred. and while he was still a very good player his shelf life wasn't long. If Giroux is going to be nothing more than a PP specialist/faceoff guy going forward with what is left on his contract it is a disaster.

You could've been taken seriously with the Belichick reference if you had mentioned defensive players. He plays little to no role in the offense and honestly those scrub receivers looking goog has much more to do with Brady than with the coaching.

I know this is hard for some fans, but try using reason instead of emotion. Before the season it was pretty much agreed this team at best would be a 7 or 8 seed again. Right now they're meeting those expectations. Trade talk is fine, depending on how absurd the proposed trade offers are, but blaming the coach for exactly meeting expectations with this low ceiling roster is going a bit far.
- EducatedOpinion

I blame him for a number of things, fairly or not, but you are right that their current place in the standings is about right. However, the way that they've gotten there is a bit worrisome.

New blog.

Bill just pooped all over every idiot in this thread......

7-11-4 since the 10 game win steak. Next 7 games are really going to tell the story of this team for Hextall. Pretty damn difficult stretch of hockey as well. I would bet that many are going to get their wish and see an influx of youth on this team after the trade deadline. I'm all for a miracle but the Flyers are looking like sellers to me. However, this does seems to be a classic improbable time for the Flyers to turn around the season.

I disagree.. I think the biggest problem by far is the commitment to consistent play. Too many times the goalies have been hung out to dry. Too many times team defense has been non-existent. Too many times the offense has gone invisible.

We are a team that struggles mightily with consistency in our approach and execution.
- jak521

Yes which is on the players and the coaches. Moreso on the players because a coach can only talk them up and show them what he thinks needs to be done. The players need to go execute it.

I wish I knew. It is why I proposed the question. If Giroux is really starting to fall of a cliff at age 29 this team has huge problems. They will make the Pronger situation look like small potatoes. Pronger was on the back 9 of his career when his injury occurred. and while he was still a very good player his shelf life wasn't long. If Giroux is going to be nothing more than a PP specialist/faceoff guy going forward with what is left on his contract it is a disaster.
- PLindbergh31

I don't disagree with that. However, that wasn't the point of contention. Hakstol has made some choices this season in both personell management and systems play that I don't agree with. But so far this season, I lay more blame on several players than him.

He was going to step in yes. But take over like he did I don't think so. Hakstol and Hextall sitting him down after the disaster in Chicago had to help him.
- dragonoffrost

Yeah but that sit down talk happens regardless of who the coach is. Trust me, I'm not saying we should fire Haks and I'm not in a rush to, but when the argument of saying x player has grown under Haks we should keep him for the growth, I don't think Provorov should be some anchor point / reason to keep Haks as the coach like it has been said the past couple of days/games.

You could've been taken seriously with the Belichick reference if you had mentioned defensive players. He plays little to no role in the offense and honestly those scrub receivers looking goog has much more to do with Brady than with the coaching.

I know this is hard for some fans, but try using reason instead of emotion. Before the season it was pretty much agreed this team at best would be a 7 or 8 seed again. Right now they're meeting those expectations. Trade talk is fine, depending on how absurd the proposed trade offers are, but blaming the coach for exactly meeting expectations with this low ceiling roster is going a bit far.
- EducatedOpinion

Oh ok. Bellichick has zero to do with the drafting/signing of offensive players? Got it.

How many super bowls did Brady win when he had hall of famer Randy Moss at WR? I guess he couldn't make a scrub like Moss look good?

Also, as a rookie, you would expect him to get better as the season went along simply because he's never played in the NHL before, and he would have struggles early. That's true of almost every single player in NHL history regardless of coaching.
- jmatchett383

Yup! Even why fans give rookies a little bit of a cushion for mistakes because it's expected any rookie will have growing pains / struggles. Or to have more patience since over time thy will grow.

I MISS THE OLD GIROUX
- Flyers Time

I miss Eric Wellwood

I blame him for a number of things, fairly or not, but you are right that their current place in the standings is about right. However, the way that they've gotten there is a bit worrisome.
- jmatchett383

I agree he's made mistakes as a coach and their play over the last month+ has been worrisome, but as others have noted we've seen this same core of players struggle to play the coach's system over long stretches under 3 separate coaches. Also, if Hak's mistakes have cost them any games I'd put the number below 5. This is all on the players and has been for a while. Until the roster changes significantly I'd advise everyone to expect more of the same.

#1 D man for years to come has been found. I'd say that is a facet/phase of the team improved.
- dragonoffrost

at #7 no less...I am sure everyone saw that coming...

Oh ok. Bellichick has zero to do with the drafting/signing of offensive players? Got it.

How many super bowls did Brady win when he had hall of famer Randy Moss at WR? I guess he couldn't make a scrub like Moss look good?
- PLindbergh31

Not going to respond further than this, because based on your history you're a lost cause, but you brought up Belichick in comparison to Hakstol, which would imply you were comparing their coaching abilities. As Hakstol has no GM experience, comparing Belichick's role as GM to Hakstol's as a coach is a mindless comparison.

But at the same time, it could be argued it was a typical junior player making a transition to the NHL. Provy was viewed as a dman that would have an impact on our team even last season in Juniors as well. Pierre and Mackenzie every time they mentioned flyers they would throw in Provy is NHL ready now.
- arichardson22

On the plus side, those same guys are saying Myers is ready to step in next season.

I know that has nothing to do with your back and forth but it might be good news in our current down turn.