Honestly, I agree with a lot of your points Lefty, I just don't think this season is the time to do it with the lack of top end lotto draftees and the expansion draft looming. Not to mention, until it's Bo's team and the Sedins gracefully exit stage right, a rebuild won't be able to gain traction.

I also question whether the market could handle a tear-down style rebuild with how close the organization has come to being moribund due to empty areas during the periods where the team has been horrible. I just don't see FA being that patient with all the losing and seeing the fans stay away in droves.
- DariusKnight

Problem is, nobody can control when the decline begins.
You either have a good roster or you don't.

This roster blows, with or without the venerated Vets.
To think that a GM, any GM, can mitigate a sub-par product and thus, decide 'when' is best to address it is not within the realm of reality.

All the teams that 'tanked' (selling off assets and driving for last) were already on that path anyways. They simply rationalized that attempting to get a 1st overall pick is better then a 4th overall pick.

I don't believe that at all. In fact I have posted many times how everyone's view should be respected. We can argue which is part of the point of being here. We can discuss and exchange ideas too; building up a view. We can chide each other as well which all is in good fun. But I don't look for fights or start them. Especially personal attacks.

The problem is you are talking to Golfing and Marwood two of the most obtuse hecklers and troublemakers ever. They have not stopped from day one to attack everything and anything I post. I have applied various strategies over the months. Ignore, make light of myself, defend and shame. They don't stop their personal attacks and always counter whatever I post. Even if it's exactly what they want to hear. Or when they think I'm not online they start up like now. It's like they have nothing better to do. Then they blame it all on me as if I started up something. Some others join in and there you go. Rinse and repeat.

I don't care. I expect it from them. It's okay. They can keep going on or not. I am not going anywhere. Nor do I believe my BS is any better then anyone else's. We can all picnic in HB and have fun with the food fights or share the meal. Whatever is the soup de jour of the day.
- Nuck4U

The problem isn't US (ie: the hardcore smart fan who understands what it takes to win and the necessity for having a down cycle in order to build back for success), we'd follow the team regardless and be patient as they build back to being a contender. The problem is that we're a minority in the market, we're only around 20 to about 35 percent of the actual fanbase and for the most part we aren't the ones who spend the most money on the team via tickets and merchandising. It's the casual fan that's the problem, they make up most of the rest of percentage of the fanbase (corporations and sponsors taking up what's left) and they just want a winner. Those are the fans that pay the major money to be at the arena, buy all the gear and line FA's pockets. They'd stay away the minute (and are already) we start to be bad.
- DariusKnight

Pretty much and it's even more with other fan bases as well. But the stakes can be less in smaller market shares so Owners can spend less or continue with a subpar product because they have peeked with their market share of fans. Only a champion would make some inroads which is a longer cycle for some. That's when certain resources are committed to do more.

- RealityChecker

good one.

good one.
- Nuck4U

Serious as a heart attack.

I don't believe that at all. In fact I have posted many times how everyone's view should be respected. We can argue which is part of the point of being here. We can discuss and exchange ideas too; building up a view. We can chide each other as well which all is in good fun. But I don't look for fights or start them. Especially personal attacks.

The problem is you are talking to Golfing and Marwood two of the most obtuse hecklers and troublemakers ever. They have not stopped from day one to attack everything and anything I post. I have applied various strategies over the months. Ignore, make light of myself, defend and shame. They don't stop their personal attacks and always counter whatever I post. Even if it's exactly what they want to hear. Or when they think I'm not online they start up like now. It's like they have nothing better to do. Then they blame it all on me as if I started up something. Some others join in and there you go. Rinse and repeat.

I don't care. I expect it from them. It's okay. They can keep going on or not. I am not going anywhere. Nor do I believe my BS is any better then anyone else's. We can all picnic in HB and have fun with the food fights or share the meal. Whatever is the soup de jour of the day.
- Nuck4U

Again I think how you post, may not be malicious in your intent, comes across differently to other readers. I think most people have stated in the past that some of your posts may not make sense to them and there might be the disconnect. I think all in all, you provide good hockey posts and ideas, but I think people misinterpret your posts as argumentative or defensive when they don't really warrant such a reaction. I am not trying to take sides, or be a peace keeper, I am just stating what I think is the problem. I am not sure what to suggest that will fix this.

Well, at some point in the cycle, you need to be at least making the playoffs regularily and doing damage in them and threatening to be a contender. Otherwise you're going to be wasting all the early and cheap years you have with the talent you drafted. In a cap world, you can't keep everybody, eventually your talent is going to want to get paid.

Not to mention that without success over time, eventually your GM is going to get fired and the new GM is going to want to put his own plan for respectability in place, which may mean that a house cleaning of talent the old GM collected. Which is why I said that the idea of just drafting well and amassing draft picks isn't always the best idea and you need to be able to trade for and sign UFAs that can help you make that jump from also-rans to respectable and then finally to being contenders.

It doesn't always work out that way of course, all the shrewd moves and proper drafting can end up not working out for various reasons like injuries, problems with chemistry, underperformance and inability to install a winning culture in the locker room. That's why being bad and using that as a rebuild strategy is very dangerous, the regular season is such a grind that it requires a massive amount of mental fortitude to get through it. Players by nature are extremely competitive and want to win, but if you're constantly selling off veterans for draft picks and stripping the team of leadership and experience in order to rebuild, it's easy for players to become disengaged at a certain point and maybe not exactly stop playing as hard as they can, but at least worry more about themselves and their next contract. When that happens year after year, it becomes ingrained and it's very hard to get out of the mindset of "Well it's another lost season" when inevitably slumps happen.

Playoff performers don't accept slumps and kill themselves to help get their team out of it. That lifts the rest of the guys who might more out for themselves and make them more willing to sacrifice themselves, raising their level of play. It's the whole question of leadership and the experience of those who've been there as compared to youth who've experienced nothing but success in minor hockey through junior and then are faced with no longer having that same success and experiencing adversity that might go on for years.

tl;dr rebuilding teams can't rely solely on drafting and draft picks to become playoff teams, they need to be willing to sell off some of that talent and spend money to get players who can help install the culture needed to win in the regular season and then in the playoffs.
- DariusKnight

Good read. Nice points.

Serious as a heart attack.
- RealityChecker

YES Life can be. This just gets the blood pumping.

Agreed....it's something the/an owner would have accept knowing it's for the greater good. Their pockets are deep, as a general statement, thus I think an owner, in our case the Aquilini family, could suffer though some poor attendance years to have ten years worth of a seriously competitive team.
- LeftCoaster

Competitive team which makes them a s-tonne of money*
Any good economist will tell you: it's really hard to get people on board for making money 4-5 years in the future when they know there's a chance to get some profit now. Ie/1:lets build up and get oil going again, make some money! 2: well the world market is shifting away from oil, and our oil is inefficient. Maybe we should invest in infrastructure to sell resources that will be worth more in the future like water and wood? 1: shut up hippy, this is about making money! 2:sigh

I am thinking that after the Boston game on Saturday morning, in which we will have gone 0-3 on road trip, Tanev will be sticking around as the newest member of the Bruins.
Bruins desperate to make push for playoffs, but sorely need defensive help.
Jeremy Lauzon plus a 1st?

I am thinking that after the Boston game on Saturday morning, in which we will have gone 0-3 on road trip, Tanev will be sticking around as the newest member of the Bruins.
Bruins desperate to make push for playoffs, but sorely need defensive help.
Jeremy Lauzon plus a 1st?
- Reubenkincade

I think people are going to be disappointed when nobody gets moved.

I think people are going tojustify the lack of moves when nobody gets moved.
- golfingsince

Fixed that for you.

I think people are going to be disappointed when nobody gets moved.
- golfingsince

expectations vs reality.

I think the Canucks are going to be VERY QUIET this year.

I think people are going to be disappointed when nobody gets moved.
- golfingsince

if this happens, people will be disappointed. I will be one of said people. After the TL interview last week, I think some moves might happen though. He genuinely didnt seem to see this as a playoff team, which is the most reassuring thing I've seen/heard this year from this management.

I think people are going to be disappointed when nobody gets moved.
- golfingsince

Some will. I don't expect a lot of movement from any teams, although some tweaking trades will happen.
Also I like to live in fantasy land.Helps during this transitional period of extremely boring and slow hockey.

Again I think how you post, may not be malicious in your intent, comes across differently to other readers. I think most people have stated in the past that some of your posts may not make sense to them and there might be the disconnect. I think all in all, you provide good hockey posts and ideas, but I think people misinterpret your posts as argumentative or defensive when they don't really warrant such a reaction. I am not trying to take sides, or be a peace keeper, I am just stating what I think is the problem. I am not sure what to suggest that will fix this.
- Codes1087

I have come to the conclusion for some it's not what's posted or how. It doesn't matter if nothing is posted either. They are like a dog with a bone. No fix there other then they move on to acceptance or keep flogging a dead horse. It's all good.

expectations vs reality.

I think the Canucks are going to be VERY QUIET this year.
- Codes1087

THE signs are there. Won't it be a great surprise if something happened

Fixed that for you.
- RealityChecker

Yes, there's that too.

I have come to the conclusion for some it's not what's posted or how. It doesn't matter if nothing is posted either. They are like a dog with a bone. No fix there other then they move on to acceptance or keep flogging a dead horse. It's all good.
- Nuck4U

That's not true. If you stopped posting it would matter greatly.

if this happens, people will be disappointed. I will be one of said people. After the TL interview last week, I think some moves might happen though. He genuinely didnt seem to see this as a playoff team, which is the most reassuring thing I've seen/heard this year from this management.
- neem55

It's pretty hard to come out and suggest they're a playoff team considering their standing and how they did last year. I don't see a whole lot of pieces they can move, although there are a few.

It's pretty hard to come out and suggest they're a playoff team considering their standing and how they did last year. I don't see a whole lot of pieces they can move, although there are a few.
- golfingsince

However many or few, they have to move assets while in a rebuilding window. This notion that they don't want to upset guys with NTC's by asking them to move is complete bollocks!!! (I'm working beside/with a young English engineer)

How many hours a night do you sleep?
- CanuckDon

I'm an AI program.

However many or few, they have to move assets while in a rebuilding window. This notion that they don't want to upset guys with NTC's by asking them to move is complete bollocks!!! (I'm working beside/with a young English engineer)
- LeftCoaster

Yeah, hanging on for perceived value can be a colossal mistake. I think they should trade a half dozen people and sign some players in the offseason.

I think people are going to be disappointed when nobody gets moved.
- golfingsince

I don't think nobody will get moved. Just the parts Van doesn't need. Probably not Tanev. The only real top pairing D man they have.

I'm an AI program.
- Nuck4U

Then you need to be debugged as version 1.0 seems to be all A with no I in the program.