The Pens should stop using Malkin and Crosby on the PP and save them the wear and tear and start using Bonino and Cullen more. Since there is a slight difference in the basic skills of players, and all they need is more opportunity.
- MJL

It actually isn't a bad idea to keep all your best players fresh and use your lesser players on the special teams. It'd be interesting to see how such a strategy worked.

It actually isn't a bad idea to keep all your best players fresh and use your lesser players on the special teams. It'd be interesting to see how such a strategy worked.
- james_tanner1

On the PK sure, but not on the PP. The results on the PP would be obvious.

On the PK sure, but not on the PP. The results on the PP would be obvious.
- MJL

I think you'd be surprised. I mean, I don't know, but it seems like a sound theory. I think a group of NHL 3rd and 4th liners could produce around the same 20% everyone else does.

I think you'd be surprised. I mean, I don't know, but it seems like a sound theory. I think a group of NHL 3rd and 4th liners could produce around the same 20% everyone else does.
- james_tanner1

I wouldn't be surprised. I seriously doubt that a group of 3rd and 4th liners could produce the same on the PP. There is a significant difference in puck skills between the grinders and the top skill level players on teams, despite your beliefs.

I wouldn't be surprised. I seriously doubt that a group of 3rd and 4th liners could produce the same on the PP. There is a significant difference in puck skills between the grinders and the top skill level players on teams, despite your beliefs.
- MJL

Though powerplays are generally more successful when they stick to a series of set plays.

You could, in theory, give a bunch of grinders the same set of plays, not to mention a lot more space, and I don't know that you'd necessarily see a significant drop in production.

That said, I do think that if you have that extra time and space, it makes sense that you would want your skilled guys to have it.

Though powerplays are generally more successful when they stick to a series of set plays.

You could, in theory, give a bunch of grinders the same set of plays, not to mention a lot more space, and I don't know that you'd necessarily see a significant drop in production.

That said, I do think that if you have that extra time and space, it makes sense that you would want your skilled guys to have it.
- BINGO!

They don't have the skill-set to pull off set plays, therein lies the problem. The Canucks PP sucks because they have a team full of bottom six players....case in point.

Though powerplays are generally more successful when they stick to a series of set plays.

You could, in theory, give a bunch of grinders the same set of plays, not to mention a lot more space, and I don't know that you'd necessarily see a significant drop in production.

That said, I do think that if you have that extra time and space, it makes sense that you would want your skilled guys to have it.
- BINGO!

There is a lot more improvisation that there is set plays on the PP. I don't think you could in theory or in reality.

On the PK sure, but not on the PP. The results on the PP would be obvious.
- MJL

Actually better players have a bigger impact on the PK than they do on the PP or evens.

Actually better players have a bigger impact on the PK than they do on the PP or evens.
- Feds91Stammer

http://stats.hockeyanalys...id=0&type=goals&sort=A60&

They don't have the skill-set to pull off set plays, therein lies the problem. The Canucks PP sucks because they have a team full of bottom six players....case in point.
- LeftCoaster

But they do have the skillset. If you saw the worst player in the NHL up close in real life it would blow your mind how good he is. What's hard in the NHL is getting room on the ice in a real game. Literally everyone in the league is an above average shooter and passer.

This isn't to say Crosby et.al don't do that better, it's just to say that there are guys who are way worse than Crosby but probably shoot and pass better than he does, but who just don't have the ability/instinct/intelligence/agility whatever, do get open ice in the NHL.

http://stats.hockeyanalysis.com/ratings.php?disp=1&db=201617&sit=4v5&pos=forwards&minutes=50&teamid=0&type=goals&sort=A60&
- MJL

Yeah look at what names you see at the top of the list for 4v5 RelCA60

But they do have the skillset. If you saw the worst player in the NHL up close in real life it would blow your mind how good he is. What's hard in the NHL is getting room on the ice in a real game. Literally everyone in the league is an above average shooter and passer.

This isn't to say Crosby et.al don't do that better, it's just to say that there are guys who are way worse than Crosby but probably shoot and pass better than he does, but who just don't have the ability/instinct/intelligence/agility whatever, do get open ice in the NHL.
- james_tanner1

They don't have the skillset. The flaw in your thinking is comparing an NHL player to a regular joe that might play in a beer league, and what me might think. There is a significant difference between the top skilled players and the grinders and pluggers. They don't play on the PP because they don't have the skill set. Once in a while you might see a player placed in the front of the net role, because he is a big body to take away the goalies eyes.

Yeah look at what names you see at the top of the list for 4v5 RelCA60
- Feds91Stammer

You're a man down, shots are going to happen. Goals against are all that matters when shorthanded. There's a difference between puck skills on the PP, and the skills that are needed on the PP. 4th line players are frequently among the best PKers on a team, but are rarely among the best on the PP.

They don't have the skill-set to pull off set plays, therein lies the problem. The Canucks PP sucks because they have a team full of bottom six players....case in point.
- LeftCoaster

So DET PP is even worse but they obviously have more skill. Is that because of the god awful PP system or what?

You're a man down, shots are going to happen. Goals against are all that matters when shorthanded.
- MJL

The goal is to reduce shots as no player can impact on ice save percentages.

The goal is to reduce shots as no player can impact on ice save percentages.
- Feds91Stammer

I understand what you're saying but the ultimate goal is not give one up.

The Pens should stop using Malkin and Crosby on the PP and save them the wear and tear and start using Bonino and Cullen more. Since there is a slight difference in the basic skills of players, and all they need is more opportunity.
- MJL

There's more than a "slight" difference between those players. Bones and Cullen are nice players, but not on the same planet as Sid and Malkin. I don't see any coach ever sitting their superstars on the PP just to get them rest. PK on the other hand, hell yes.

By the way, both Sid and Malkin are getting under 20 mins a game so they're not being over-used. Sullivan isn't afraid to use his 4th line because they're competent.

I understand what you're saying but the ultimate goal is not give one up.
- MJL

Sure, but how do you do that? Probably by reducing shots against...

Ask the guys running the top PK in the league what their focus is on.

There's more than a "slight" difference between those players. Bones and Cullen are nice players, but not on the same planet as Sid and Malkin. I don't see any coach ever sitting their superstars on the PP just to get them rest. PK on the other hand, hell yes.

By the way, both Sid and Malkin are getting under 20 mins a game so they're not being over-used. Sullivan isn't afraid to use his 4th line because they're competent.
- madmike71

My post was sarcasm.

Sure, but how do you do that? Probably by reducing shots against...

Ask the guys running the top PK in the league what their focus is on.
- BINGO!

Agreed.

But they do have the skillset. If you saw the worst player in the NHL up close in real life it would blow your mind how good he is. What's hard in the NHL is getting room on the ice in a real game. Literally everyone in the league is an above average shooter and passer.

This isn't to say Crosby et.al don't do that better, it's just to say that there are guys who are way worse than Crosby but probably shoot and pass better than he does, but who just don't have the ability/instinct/intelligence/agility whatever, do get open ice in the NHL.
- james_tanner1

No. They don't.
The fact that you can watch Crosby play and not recognise that his skills are superior to EVERY player in the NHL (and therefore the world) is very hard to comprehend given how much time and energy you spend on the game. And yes, I said every player. McDavid will be the best player in the world soon, and may even be the best SCORER right now, but Crosby is still the best all-around player.

Sure, but how do you do that? Probably by reducing shots against...

Ask the guys running the top PK in the league what their focus is on.
- BINGO!

Eric Tulsky FTW

No. They don't.
The fact that you can watch Crosby play and not recognise that his skills are superior to EVERY player in the NHL (and therefore the world) is very hard to comprehend given how much time and energy you spend on the game. And yes, I said every player. McDavid will be the best player in the world soon, and may even be the best SCORER right now, but Crosby is still the best all-around player.
- Tonybere

You have completely missed the point. It was just an interesting idea anyways, I am not interested in arguing about it.

We now have a second unit and the time is fairly equally split. It's actually helped.

No. They don't.
The fact that you can watch Crosby play and not recognise that his skills are superior to EVERY player in the NHL (and therefore the world) is very hard to comprehend given how much time and energy you spend on the game. And yes, I said every player. McDavid will be the best player in the world soon, and may even be the best SCORER right now, but Crosby is still the best all-around player.
- Tonybere

I agree completely. Crosby is still the best player in the NHL.