I said draisaitl was on McD line & you admit he's a beast? Is that good so far? So now you go 1 step further just to try & discredit my comment which quoted jboyd, by saying world class, where originally you only stated good players - which everyone agrees Draisaitl is? Right?

So what is a world class player? Again you are changing your argument to try & make yourself look intelligent & others not. Why didn't you say 'world class players' originally? Didn't you remember how good Draisaitly is?

So tell me, explain 'world class player' to me, as you have stated Kessel, Geno & Letang?
- Aussiepenguin

Being a beast or a good hockey player is much different than being one of the best in the world at your position. Kessel, Geno, Letang are all in the top tiers at their position, while Drais is a very good hockey player, I don't think he is considered a top 10 center or winger in the NHL.

What? No way? When did this theory come about? I thought if words were printed or published then it MUST be true. Son of a female dog. I've been dooped.
- j.boyd919

My only point is I won't accept analytics as the be alll.

Why should I answer your question if you never answer mine?
- Feds91Stammer

That's what he does, he doesn't ACTUALLY provide information. He just provides empty opinions with no stats to back it up.

My only point is I won't accept analytics as the be alll.
- cornnation

And you shouldn't but you should obviously realize that it is an extremely important tool.

That's what he does, he doesn't ACTUALLY provide information. He just provides empty opinions with no stats to back it up.
- j.boyd919

That is why I'm (frank)ing with him. I can write a sentence long response and he replies with a god damn essay and 50 (frank)ing emojis.

My only point is I won't accept analytics as the be alll.
- cornnation

Haha that wasn't directed towards to you at all. That's the thing... no one who values analytics accepts it as the end all be all. I would probably bet money that any of the analytics guys on Twitter making these charts and graphs watch more hockey than anyone on hockeybuzz.

Haha that wasn't directed towards to you at all. That's the thing... no one who values analytics accepts it as the end all be all. I would probably bet money that any of the analytics guys on Twitter making these charts and graphs watch more hockey than anyone on hockeybuzz.
- j.boyd919

Nah they don't actually track games to record the data. They just make it up.

Haha that wasn't directed towards to you at all. That's the thing... no one who values analytics accepts it as the end all be all. I would probably bet money that any of the analytics guys on Twitter making these charts and graphs watch more hockey than anyone on hockeybuzz.
- j.boyd919

I know it wasn't, but I'm going between work, kids, dinner and homework. And I'm almost at the point I no longer know what I'm arguing lol.

I just pooped. It was nice. Go pens!

I know it wasn't, but I'm going between work, kids, dinner and homework. And I'm almost at the point I no longer know what I'm arguing lol.
- cornnation

What? No way? When did this theory come about? I thought if words were printed or published then it MUST be true. Son of a female dog. I've been dooped.
- j.boyd919

Well pretty much all you do is go look up information from people who invent stats and then use it as your argument. I really have never heard an opinion of your own.

Well pretty much all you do is go look up information from people who invent stats and then use it as your argument. I really have never heard an opinion of your own.
- Grinder47

Nah. Actually you've got it all along. I watch the game and then I look at the data before I form my opinion so that I have a bigger foundation of knowledge of the subject matter that I'm forming my opinion on. And I use data to back up my opinion. There's a difference between using data to back of your opinion and actually just putting data around. I always voice my opinion an give reasons why.

Nah. Actually you've got it all along. I watch the game and then I look at the data before I form my opinion so that I have a bigger foundation of knowledge of the subject matter that I'm forming my opinion on. And I use data to back up my opinion. There's a difference between using data to back of your opinion and actually just putting data around. I always voice my opinion an give reasons why.
- j.boyd919

What would you without all the data?

That's what he does, he doesn't ACTUALLY provide information. He just provides empty opinions with no stats to back it up.
- j.boyd919

Seriously jboyd give it a rest my dog.

Ignoring stats then stating no stats offered is just embarrassing.

What was it you stated on the Tampa thread the other day? Fleury is an average to slightly above average goalie? Still not sure how you came to that conclusion as there was no information to go with it! So now saying I never give any 'actual' information to back up my opinion is just being hypocritical.

But I must remember, he who doesn't agree with you is wrong!

Seriously jboyd give it a rest my dog.

Ignoring stats then stating no stats offered is just embarrassing.

What was it you stated on the Tampa thread the other day? Fleury is an average to slightly above average goalie? Still not sure how you came to that conclusion as there was no information to go with it! So now saying I never give any 'actual' information to back up my opinion is just being hypocritical.

But I must remember, he who doesn't agree with you is wrong!
- Aussiepenguin

I stopped reading this thread. I swear it was giving me a headache.

Seriously jboyd give it a rest my dog.

Ignoring stats then stating no stats offered is just embarrassing.

What was it you stated on the Tampa thread the other day? Fleury is an average to slightly above average goalie? Still not sure how you came to that conclusion as there was no information to go with it! So now saying I never give any 'actual' information to back up my opinion is just being hypocritical.

But I must remember, he who doesn't agree with you is wrong!
- Aussiepenguin

Yeah it was me that said that, because you never gave any data, like usual.

Being a beast or a good hockey player is much different than being one of the best in the world at your position. Kessel, Geno, Letang are all in the top tiers at their position, while Drais is a very good hockey player, I don't think he is considered a top 10 center or winger in the NHL.
- j.boyd919

You forgot to change your alt!

Kessel I doubt is considered 'one of the best in the world at his position'. Letang would be arguable as well given that he hasn't been selected for any top tier competition in the last, well when was the last time he was selected? Draisaitl wouldn't be either in that regard. So how does that reflect the statement stammer (or your alt), said a few pages back disputing the talent on both teams?

But go back to the stammer profile because that's where it was!

Yeah it was me that said that, because you never gave any data, like usual.
- j.boyd919

There was data as there is data now - you just chose to ignore it as it contradicts your opinion. We all know your opinion is the greatest!!

That is why I'm (frank)ing with him. I can write a sentence long response and he replies with a god damn essay and 50 (frank)ing emojis.
- Feds91Stammer

So now the refusal to respond. Good job!

There was data as there is data now - you just chose to ignore it as it contradicts your opinion. We all know your opinion is the greatest!!
- Aussiepenguin

Nah there actually was on real data. Just you saying more or less shots. More or less games played. Stats similar. All that garbage. You actually provided no data.

There was data as there is data now - you just chose to ignore it as it contradicts your opinion. We all know your opinion is the greatest!!
- Aussiepenguin

Funny that, Vasi seeing 114 odd less shots tending with arguably a stronger D unit the stats for both Vasi & Flower are pretty close for this season (comparing this season as Vasi is basically playing as a starter). So I guess going by the stats thus far Vasi is only slightly above average if at all above due to the less shots faced & team in front (based on this year - being the most responsible stats to judge as it's the now not 24 months ago!) having better D? If the 'trend' continues Flower may very well be the better option in net for a contender (probably why JR wants to keep him in Pittsburgh


I said 'arguably', that's NOT a 'definitive' statement! Maybe less in the stats & more in reality my man?

I noted shots faced, games were mentioned as was the season & playing status being back up or starter based on those games played. So I have mentioned a lot more 'evidence' in my comment then you entered in yours being your 'general' statement of Flower being average to slightly above average?

So again my 'limited Australian' hockey knowledge offers more in way of information than yours. But again with your misguided opinion of your own importance & intelligence, you've erred when responding as you haven't (it appears), understood my comment or as the '12th Man' said, simply (frank)ed up!

^^these were your 2 posts regarding the matter... there's nothing to compare. You provided no data there than shots. And judging my most people's views on this board, judging players and teams by shots alone is bad practice. So.. maybe try again.

Nah there actually was on real data. Just you saying more or less shots. More or less games played. Stats similar. All that garbage. You actually provided no data.
- j.boyd919

So shots faced by a goalie is garbage?
How many games played when comparing 2 players is garbage?
The fact their save % was very similar is garbage?

What are the stats goalies are judged by if you take away the above 'garbage'?

Don't count their shots faced, their games played or their save %. Please explain!

Funny that, Vasi seeing 114 odd less shots tending with arguably a stronger D unit the stats for both Vasi & Flower are pretty close for this season (comparing this season as Vasi is basically playing as a starter). So I guess going by the stats thus far Vasi is only slightly above average if at all above due to the less shots faced & team in front (based on this year - being the most responsible stats to judge as it's the now not 24 months ago!) having better D? If the 'trend' continues Flower may very well be the better option in net for a contender (probably why JR wants to keep him in Pittsburgh


I said 'arguably', that's NOT a 'definitive' statement! Maybe less in the stats & more in reality my man?

I noted shots faced, games were mentioned as was the season & playing status being back up or starter based on those games played. So I have mentioned a lot more 'evidence' in my comment then you entered in yours being your 'general' statement of Flower being average to slightly above average?

So again my 'limited Australian' hockey knowledge offers more in way of information than yours. But again with your misguided opinion of your own importance & intelligence, you've erred when responding as you haven't (it appears), understood my comment or as the '12th Man' said, simply (frank)ed up!

^^these were your 2 posts regarding the matter... there's nothing to compare. You provided no data there than shots. And judging my most people's views on this board, judging players and teams by shots alone is bad practice. So.. maybe try again.
- j.boyd919

See my previous post.

So shots faced by a goalie is garbage?
How many games played when comparing 2 players is garbage?
The fact their save % was very similar is garbage?

What are the stats goalies are judged by if you take away the above 'garbage'?

Don't count their shots faced, their games played or their save %. Please explain!
- Aussiepenguin

Again, you provided no data. Other than the shots. You didn't provide save percentage or games played. You didn't reference even strength save percentage, pk save percentage, nor did you reference low, medium, or high danger save percentage, quality starts, or really bad stars, rebound saves, or anything else of worth. Your lack of information makes your argument empty, unless of course you believe all shots are created equal (which I don't) so there is no need to carry on that conversation if that's the case.

Again, you provided no data. Other than the shots. You didn't provide save percentage or games played. You didn't reference even strength save percentage, pk save percentage, nor did you reference low, medium, or high danger save percentage, quality starts, or really bad stars, rebound saves, or anything else of worth. Your lack of information makes your argument empty, unless of course you believe all shots are created equal (which I don't) so there is no need to carry on that conversation if that's the case.
- j.boyd919

You said shots on goal is garbage - your words above. You said I provided no data - what are shots on goal if they are not data?

I provided a comparable games played stat (is a statistic born from data? If so can a statistic be a form of data?), then finished by saying their 'stats' are pretty close. Now if you need me to nominate their save % you should have offered more information in your original comment that I replied to where you had 'zero' data or statistics mentioned!

You generalised I advanced the comment - again this is the English language that we are communicating in here, which you are finding very difficult to follow!!

Your reference to high medium & low % shots is at best disputable & with that should be part of no factual conversation involving real events.

Now do you understand?