From where? (And are they reliable?)

And really, the Ebs for Larsson Value would have been much fairer value - unless you're placing too much value in Larsson's draft position rather than facts, of course
- lumlums

You will be punished with everlasting agony and shut out from the presence of the Lord of Larsson and from the glory of his might.

Your reasoning is solid, but your classification of Larsson as "blue chip" is way off. He's a good second pairing defensive guy, and due to a previous lack of depth in Edmonton, you are improved accordingly.

Also, your statement that NJ would have not taken Nuge or Ebs is nothing more than speculation, as we have no idea what went on in those phone calls. We do have evidence of Chia in a call with Dallas on the Seguin trade, and it doesn't look like he's particularly astute when it comes to negotiating, especially if the decision has been made to move that player (which may have happened with Hall). Hall is a player who would have drawn interest from most GMs in the league, and so I don't understand your statement of "position of weakness" - the point is to improve your team, and sometimes that takes a little bit of patience, something that would appear to be lacking here.
- lumlums

Shero stated himself it was Hall or nothing. End of story. A little patience? He waited a year while he talked to GM's around the league. Not long enough? MacT tried for a year and a half and couldn't get it done, and Tambo had longer than both put together. The entire league was scoured for a defenseman. I don't get what you don't get about that. For a "doctor" you're talking like a real dumb ass.

I listened to the interview with shero right after .
I'm too lazy, but it's prob pretty easy to find.

He had no interest in the other two for Larsson


As far as the hall speculation, one has to assume he didn't make just one call


It's a loss in value. That much can't be debated.
Still bugs me abit.

But I think we're better with looch and Larsson than just hall.
(Dealing halls cap paved the way for looch

But your post is far from unreasonable
- HB77

It's definitely a loss in value. And if cap was the main issue, trading Ebs/Nuge (who had the same cap hit) for a loss would have made more sense than trading Hall for a loss. Having Hall wouldn't have prevented signing Looch if there was space from a different trade.

To me though, the worst is the Reinhardt trade - and a package of Nuge/Ebs and that first (or Barzal) could have gotten a MUCH better defenseman than Larsson.

From where? (And are they reliable?)

And really, the Ebs for Larsson Value would have been much fairer value - unless you're placing too much value in Larsson's draft position rather than facts, of course
- lumlums

No, I'm basing it on being the team that didn't draft a generational talent and has very few pieces.

Larsson at 24, with 6 years left at 4 mil per> Eberle at 26 with 3 years at 6 mil left.

Those are your facts Dr.

From where? (And are they reliable?)

And really, the Ebs for Larsson Value would have been much fairer value - unless you're placing too much value in Larsson's draft position rather than facts, of course
- lumlums

Here you go. Interview with Shero. Round about the 2 minute mark.

http://www.tsn.ca/radio/t...ding-larsson-for-1.518552

Shero stated himself it was Hall or nothing. End of story. A little patience? He waited a year while he talked to GM's around the league. Not long enough? MacT tried for a year and a half and couldn't get it done, and Tambo had longer than both put together. The entire league was scoured for a defenseman. I don't get what you don't get about that. For a "doctor" you're talking like a real dumb ass.
- Ihatebrianburke

Hey, if Gretzky can be traded, then a deal for a different defenseman could have been made. Hell, Weber and Subban, both moved on the same day, would have been MUCH better. For an Oilers "expert" you're talking like a real dumb ass

From where? (And are they reliable?)

And really, the Ebs for Larsson Value would have been much fairer value - unless you're placing too much value in Larsson's draft position rather than facts, of course
- lumlums

Just the FACT, that he's one of the top shutdown guys in the league. Which, looking at the standings, seems to be exactly what we needed.

Hey, if Gretzky can be traded, then a deal for a different defenseman could have been made. Hell, Weber and Subban, both moved on the same day, would have been MUCH better. For an Oilers "expert" you're talking like a real dumb ass
- lumlums

Both of those guys would have made it a lot harder to pay McDavid and Draisaitl when their elcs are up though

Here you go. Interview with Shero.

http://www.tsn.ca/radio/t...ding-larsson-for-1.518552
- Wildschwein

Shero has been very shrewd with trades and doesn't mind not making one if he doesn't feel he is getting what he wants.

THere's the Larsson trade, last year at the deadline he was ready to hold Stempniak if he didn't get a 2nd rounder (he got it from Boston) and at the 2015 draft he was entertaining moving down as long as he got a first still within the top 10 and second. When no one ponied up he went ahead and drafted 6th.

Now if he could only resist signing Pittsburgh cast offs.

Hey, if Gretzky can be traded, then a deal for a different defenseman could have been made. Hell, Weber and Subban, both moved on the same day, would have been MUCH better. For an Oilers "expert" you're talking like a real dumb ass
- lumlums

I won't dispute that they could have traded Hall elsewhere, but the fact is if Larsson was the target it was going to cost them Hall.

Here you go. Interview with Shero. Round about the 2 minute mark.

http://www.tsn.ca/radio/t...ding-larsson-for-1.518552
- Wildschwein

GMs do however lie all the time...

https://www.nhl.com/news/...ade-pk-subban/c-281032464

https://www.nhl.com/news/...s-no-surprise/c-281093904

Now, this may of course be true, but the fact that he goes from saying that he wasn't going to trade Larsson to trading him without hesitation should indicate that the offer of Hall was too much.

Here you go. Interview with Shero. Round about the 2 minute mark.

http://www.tsn.ca/radio/t...ding-larsson-for-1.518552
- Wildschwein

Schweiny bringing the truth in the name of our lord and saviour Larsson (praise be unto him).

Hey, if Gretzky can be traded, then a deal for a different defenseman could have been made. Hell, Weber and Subban, both moved on the same day, would have been MUCH better. For an Oilers "expert" you're talking like a real dumb ass
- lumlums

You mean the Subban for Weber trade that both GM's stated was the only deal that made any sense for either team. They were only trading for another franchise defenseman, not a winger. And let's get something straight. Gretzky wasn't traded, he was sold, by a scumbag of a human being that is hated in Edmonton.

Schweiny bringing the truth in the name of our lord and saviour Larsson (praise be unto him).
- MaximumBone

Really, I mean I didn't know the Brits were so anti-Swede until today. The good Dr. is showing his racism.

Both of those guys would have made it a lot harder to pay McDavid and Draisaitl when their elcs are up though
- StoopGuts

It would of course, Subban more so. But cap hell doesn't come about from paying good players what they're worth, it comes from overpaying middle to bottom liners. I will say that Larson's contract is definitely a big draw. The fact that you only have 4 forwards signed longer than McJesus gives some flexibility also.

GMs do however lie all the time...

https://www.nhl.com/news/...ade-pk-subban/c-281032464

https://www.nhl.com/news/...s-no-surprise/c-281093904

Now, this may of course be true, but the fact that he goes from saying that he wasn't going to trade Larsson to trading him without hesitation should indicate that the offer of Hall was too much.
- lumlums

True. I honestly think one of the biggest reasons this trade was made was due to Larsson's contract and cap hit. For what he brings he is extremely affordable which is a constant concern in the cap world of todays NHL.
I would have hated trying to work around Weber's/Subban's contracts.

True. I honestly think one of the biggest reasons this trade was made was due to Larsson's contract and cap hit. For what he brings he is extremely affordable which is a constant concern in the cap world of todays NHL.
I would have hated trying to work around Weber's/Subban's contracts.
- Wildschwein

Webers contract will be one of the worst in hockey in a few years, it is a contract of Kovalchuk proportions. The new CBA punishes those bigly.

You mean the Subban for Weber trade that both GM's stated was the only deal that made any sense for either team. They were only trading for another franchise defenseman, not a winger. And let's get something straight. Gretzky wasn't traded, he was sold, by a scumbag of a human being that is hated in Edmonton.
- Ihatebrianburke

Of course they did - that's what GMs do. Believing that that was the *only* deal that they would have done is naive. A GMs job is to make the team better - and to believe that there's only one deal in the world that can do that is laughable.

Really, I mean I didn't know the Brits were so anti-Swede until today. The good Dr. is showing his racism.
- Mr.Bobby

As a colonial I cannot say too much without fear of them burning down my home and forcing me off the land. This is a battle you must fight alone Mr Bobby.

Your reasoning is solid, but your classification of Larsson as "blue chip" is way off. He's a good second pairing defensive guy, and due to a previous lack of depth in Edmonton, you are improved accordingly.

Also, your statement that NJ would have not taken Nuge or Ebs is nothing more than speculation, as we have no idea what went on in those phone calls. We do have evidence of Chia in a call with Dallas on the Seguin trade, and it doesn't look like he's particularly astute when it comes to negotiating, especially if the decision has been made to move that player (which may have happened with Hall). Hall is a player who would have drawn interest from most GMs in the league, and so I don't understand your statement of "position of weakness" - the point is to improve your team, and sometimes that takes a little bit of patience, something that would appear to be lacking here.
- lumlums

Drafted 4th overall and many pegged him to possibly go 1st. 24 years old. Not sure what you qualify as blue chip.
Seguin was screwing around too much in Boston and was way down their depth chart. That whole scenario is well visited and Chia was in a tough position. No one wants to give up on a young hypertalented C but something had to give. The return wasn't horrible but like I said, he was in a tough position on that one.

Bad teams always trade from a position of weakness. He could talked about Halls numbers till he was blue in the face and the response would always be, "If he's so great then why does your team stink so much?"

Patience isn't really an option for a decade long lottery team. Had he waited longer, who do you suppose would have popped up? Montreal was only willing to part ways with Subban for Shea freakin Weber. Top tier dmen just don't really get traded or make it to UFA, and if they are available at all, their team demands a kings ransom for them and will get it. Please don't mention Pronger either, as there were some highly extenuating circumstances around that and Lowe is an idiot.

As a colonial I cannot say too much without fear of them burning down my home and forcing me off the land. This is a battle you must fight alone Mr Bobby.
- Wildschwein

The US has been limey repellant since the late 1700's.

It's definitely a loss in value. And if cap was the main issue, trading Ebs/Nuge (who had the same cap hit) for a loss would have made more sense than trading Hall for a loss. Having Hall wouldn't have prevented signing Looch if there was space from a different trade.

To me though, the worst is the Reinhardt trade - and a package of Nuge/Ebs and that first (or Barzal) could have gotten a MUCH better defenseman than Larsson.
- lumlums

It wasn't cap.
It was about getting a defender. And nuge/Ebs weren't getting the offers he wanted.
As I said: shero flat out stated it was hall or nothing for Larsson.

But then the removal of the lw hall, opened up the cap and the roster spot on the left side for looch

But yeah, the reinhart trade was bad. Not terrible at the time for a few reasons though.
And barzal is hindsight. We had no need for another smallish forward at that spot.
It just hurts now cause he looks so promising

Webers contract will be one of the worst in hockey in a few years, it is a contract of Kovalchuk proportions. The new CBA punishes those bigly.
- Mr.Bobby

It could be, but also won't be as much of an issue as long as he doesn't retire (though but most of that is on Nashville).

Hey, if Gretzky can be traded, then a deal for a different defenseman could have been made. Hell, Weber and Subban, both moved on the same day, would have been MUCH better. For an Oilers "expert" you're talking like a real dumb ass
- lumlums

Please don't dignify Pocklingtons actions by calling it a "trade".

Weber and Subban were moved for each other. Both franchise dmen. Massive difference.

Drafted 4th overall and many pegged him to possibly go 1st. 24 years old. Not sure what you qualify as blue chip.
Seguin was screwing around too much in Boston and was way down their depth chart. That whole scenario is well visited and Chia was in a tough position. No one wants to give up on a young hypertalented C but something had to give. The return wasn't horrible but like I said, he was in a tough position on that one.

Bad teams always trade from a position of weakness. He could talked about Halls numbers till he was blue in the face and the response would always be, "If he's so great then why does your team stink so much?"

Patience isn't really an option for a decade long lottery team. Had he waited longer, who do you suppose would have popped up? Montreal was only willing to part ways with Subban for Shea freakin Weber. Top tier dmen just don't really get traded or make it to UFA, and if they are available at all, their team demands a kings ransom for them and will get it. Please don't mention Pronger either, as there were some highly extenuating circumstances around that and Lowe is an idiot.
- TheTaoOfSemenko

Mact gotten ridden out of a job for said patience.
Chia waited a full season.
We had been bottom feeding for 7 years. On the cusp of all out rebuild failure.

Patience was no longer an option