Isn't Boychuk part of the old school players?

Looked like he ran into Sid, doubt he thought Sid would hold his place & drop his shoulder into the contact - he was wrong! Then he got embarrassed further when Sid scored. Seems like he was just whinging because he lost & got embarrassed!!
- Aussiepenguin

That's my take.

Isn't Boychuk part of the old school players?

Looked like he ran into Sid, doubt he thought Sid would hold his place & drop his shoulder into the contact - he was wrong! Then he got embarrassed further when Sid scored. Seems like he was just whinging because he lost & got embarrassed!!
- Aussiepenguin

That is what I saw also. Boychuk may not have even seen Crosby until the very last second thereby causing him to be unprepared for a hit.

Unless your name is Lundqvist (probably not for much longer), Schneider, or Price or maybe Holtby, you have your warts as a goalie. The MAF vs. Murray debate has become so polarizing at this point that people forget that both goalies have bad flaws that will cost games. MAF has his positioning issues and Murray has his slow reflexes and cross crease mobility issues. Thing is MAF is so goddamn flashy (both good and bad) that when he (frank)s up it looks like such a spectacular dumpster fire that its easy to poop on him, where as Murray's goals against tend to look much cleaner and are easier to forgive.

I honestly am about equally at ease when both goalies are in net. I think their flaws are about equal and both give us a really good chance to win on any given night. What I don't like is how much MAF has been playing. MAF is a rhythm guy so he needs a lot of starts, but now that Murray's back I want his workload scaled back a bit. I think he could use a breather.
- Victoro311

That's a good take on the goalie situation. Both are good goalies, but neither is in the elite level right now.

Outside if a 2 year playoff dumpster fire, MAF has been consistently good and has actually improved since the change in goalie coaches. In a league that has goalies rise and fall dramatically every year that's an accomplishment. He hasn't lived up to that #1 overall pick and become that dominant goalie that can steal playoff series himself, but he's been a guy you can win with for a long time.

Murray has had a meteoric rise from the sub .900 save percentage goalie we drafted a few years ago. He was good enough to win at a young age, but so was Cam Ward and he didn't turn out elite. And while he played well, I didn't feel he was better than Vasilevsky or Jones in the playoffs, he just did his job well enough to let the superior team win. How he'll hold up to a full starters workload and as the league starts adjusting to him are big questions he has to answer.

I'm not sure which goalie is better right now. I want it to be the younger, cheaper guy. Hopefully he isn't a short term wonder like so many before him. And he is young still so maybe Murray reaches that elite level. But for now, I think we have 2 good though not elite guys and am open minded as to who is actually the better goalie right now.

Sully referencing Daley jumping in on the rush

Sully referencing Daley jumping in on the rush
- j.boyd919

Love it. Thanks for posting.

That's a good take on the goalie situation. Both are good goalies, but neither is in the elite level right now.

Outside if a 2 year playoff dumpster fire, MAF has been consistently good and has actually improved since the change in goalie coaches. In a league that has goalies rise and fall dramatically every year that's an accomplishment. He hasn't lived up to that #1 overall pick and become that dominant goalie that can steal playoff series himself, but he's been a guy you can win with for a long time.

Murray has had a meteoric rise from the sub .900 save percentage goalie we drafted a few years ago. He was good enough to win at a young age, but so was Cam Ward and he didn't turn out elite. And while he played well, I didn't feel he was better than Vasilevsky or Jones in the playoffs, he just did his job well enough to let the superior team win. How he'll hold up to a full starters workload and as the league starts adjusting to him are big questions he has to answer.

I'm not sure which goalie is better right now. I want it to be the younger, cheaper guy. Hopefully he isn't a short term wonder like so many before him. And he is young still so maybe Murray reaches that elite level. But for now, I think we have 2 good though not elite guys and am open minded as to who is actually the better goalie right now.
- Tojo.

I actually do think MAF is currently the better goalie, but who's the better goalie is a debate that pails in importance tot he debate over who we should keep. To me, both are goalies that can give you above average production so who's better overall isn't nearly as important as aggregate cap space implications. I think the easy sound move to make is moving MAF, but I am open to the idea of The Old Man getting creative and moving Murray if it's for an inteligent return that saves the same amount of cap as moving MAF would have and helps us win in the now. That's a much harder move and I doubt it happens, but there's certainly a hypothetical scenario out there where moving Murr isn't the end of the world.

Anyways, solid post. Glad not everyone has to take an extreme stance on the Fleury vs. Murray situation. It's unsustainable, but for the initiate future we are well off for having both. Hopefully the decision to hold onto an elite tandem for one extra year doesn't (frank) us come expansion, because truthfully that makes me quite nervous.

Sully referencing Daley jumping in on the rush
- j.boyd919

Alright...Ive had a nights rest and I'm ready to try interneting again today.

Nice post. Sullivan still has the "leashes off" mantra and I think that's important for the personell employed by the Pens. Take the risks because they are talented enough to usually finish them off and if they dont finish them off, they're usually fast enough to get back...and if they cant get back there's one of two very good goalies in the net as last line of defence.

Alright...Ive had a nights rest and I'm ready to try interneting again today.

Nice post. Sullivan still has the "leashes off" mantra and I think that's important for the personell employed by the Pens. Take the risks because they are talented enough to usually finish them off and if they dont finish them off, they're usually fast enough to get back...and if they cant get back there's one of two very good goalies in the net as last line of defence.
- MattStrat

Take the risk, more often than not it'll go your way, once in a while it might find it's way to the back of your net, but don't sweat it. I dig it.

My guess is Boychuck didn't like taking a hit that he usually dishes out. Coming from Crosby probably made it sting a little more. He got crushed and it was wonderful.

My guess is Boychuck didn't like taking a hit that he usually dishes out. Coming from Crosby probably made it sting a little more. He got crushed and it was wonderful.
- madmike71

seems like he thought it was a head shot. Looked shoulder to shoulder to me, I'd need to see it in slow mo though

Looks like MAF had a pretty good game. The thing is with that, that 2nd goal against was horrific & never should have been scored.

So he does all the great stuff then completely melts down & does something completely irresponsible & well below his pay rate. Did we win thanks to MAF? Probably. Could we have lost thanks to MAF?

This is why I said previously, I never feel comfortable when he's in net because he usually always does something bad that should not be done. He's great but (frank) he's a worry! (He's still worth a fortune in trade though )
- Aussiepenguin

Meltdown? He went behind the net to play the puck and it took me crazy hop right to the slot. And yes if it weren't for flower pens woulda been blown out by the 2nd period. Watching the game is always a good start if you're going to rip people after they were the best player on the ice

Meltdown? He went behind the net to play the puck and it took me crazy hop right to the slot. And yes if it weren't for flower pens woulda been blown out by the 2nd period. Watching the game is always a good start if you're going to rip people after they were the best player on the ice
- TheKesselVessel

TBH, he should have never went after it.

Meltdown? He went behind the net to play the puck and it took me crazy hop right to the slot. And yes if it weren't for flower pens woulda been blown out by the 2nd period. Watching the game is always a good start if you're going to rip people after they were the best player on the ice
- TheKesselVessel

I wouldn't call it a meltdown...but it was definitely a mental blunder. He should of stayed in net there.

Nah MAF's Achilles is definitely his lack of sound positioning fundamentals. That's why he's always making super athletic saves/flailing around (depending on how you want to look at it). He has a tendency to overplay things and get caught out of position forcing him to fall back on his ridiculous athleticism and great reflexes.

When Murray gets caught out of position, its normally due to his slow footedness getting across the crease. That kid has solid fundamentals, but he has issues moving side to side, and that's why we see gaffes like the super weak goals he gave up several times on wrap arounds. The bad angle softies on Murr aren't due to positioning either. Those goals went over his glove, which is the other weakness I talked about. He has slow reflexes which allows team to expose him glove side. Murray can find tricks to compensate for his slowness, but I think his reflexes with his glove will always be a problem, just like at this point in his career, MAF is set in his ways and will never develop sound positioning fundamentals.

Like I said, both have warts. Both are good goalies. The decision to go with one or the other moving forward is purely a question of the salary cap.
- Victoro311

The critiques on Murray is why I question whether he has the high ceiling to be a top 3 goalie. Granted the difference between 4th best and 15th best isn't that big and tends to vary season by season. If his technique is really good how much can he improve? I assume he can improve his glove hand, but athleticism peaks in your early 20's.

seems like he thought it was a head shot. Looked shoulder to shoulder to me, I'd need to see it in slow mo though
- j.boyd919

Absolutely clean hit. Boychuck wasn't expecting it so it jarred him.

Absolutely clean hit. Boychuck wasn't expecting it so it jarred him.
- mdw7413

That's what I had thought to, which is why I was surprised at his comments post game

That's what I had thought to, which is why I was surprised at his comments post game
- j.boyd919

Yeah, I didn't even see the comments till I stopped by here. Usually if its something questionable it would have had some of the Isles posters talking about it, but I was over there last night and not a word. Think Boychuck was a bit embarrassed and it was the gwg.

Absolutely clean hit. Boychuck wasn't expecting it so it jarred him.
- mdw7413

I've enjoyed the gif replay quite a few times. It was clean. He caught him solid. Boychuks ears were probably ringing after that one.

seems like he thought it was a head shot. Looked shoulder to shoulder to me, I'd need to see it in slow mo though
- j.boyd919

It was a 100% clean hit.

Also, you guys are gonna mop the floor with the Flyers this weekend...like, badly, really, really badly.

It was a 100% clean hit.

Also, you guys are gonna mop the floor with the Flyers this weekend...like, badly, really, really badly.
- jmatchett383

Get outta here with that reverse jinx sh!t...

It was a 100% clean hit.

Also, you guys are gonna mop the floor with the Flyers this weekend...like, badly, really, really badly.
- jmatchett383

Highly doubtful. I'll never count the Flyers out vs. the Pens.

It was a 100% clean hit.

Also, you guys are gonna mop the floor with the Flyers this weekend...like, badly, really, really badly.
- jmatchett383

No idea what team is going to show up. The Pens have barely played 20 minutes in most games. MAF needed to be spectacular until they got it going. There's speculation you'll be seeing Murray's first game. I guarantee he won't be prepared for an onslaught like last nights second period.

Also sounds like Letang will be ready.

Highly doubtful. I'll never count the Flyers out vs. the Pens.
- j.boyd919

I don't count out any team vs the pens.

No idea what team is going to show up. The Pens have barely played 20 minutes in most games. MAF needed to be spectacular until they got it going. There's speculation you'll be seeing Murray's first game. I guarantee he won't be prepared for an onslaught like last nights second period.

Also sounds like Letang will be ready.
- madmike71

The Flyers playing 20 minutes would be a near miracle right now.

Highly doubtful. I'll never count the Flyers out vs. the Pens.
- j.boyd919

I'm gonna guess you haven't watched much of the Flyers this year.

They may light the Penguins up for 3-4 goals, but they'll give up somewhere between 5 and 8.