I actually think NJ makes the PO's this year or barely misses. And no I dont think Hamonic is our 2nd best, i still side with Boychuk as of now and firmly believe within 2yrs Pulock will be. Hammer is a nice player but sorry he's replaceable but the team lacks STAR players to help overcome the 1-man-band of JT .....

*maybe if Hall was acquired, then maybe Snow would have traded a young guy to get a dman??
- Ur Not Me

Teams very seldom trade defensemen that are worth anything. If you think Snow was trading Ryan Strome and getting someone comparable to Hamonic then you're lying to yourself.

As far as NJ making the playoffs, they have now lost their best defenseman, who was also their top shot-suppressing defenseman. I'm not all that confident that they have the talent up front, even with Hall, to be any kind of real threat to make the playoffs.

There are other wingers out there than Taylor Hall that can be acquired at a better price.

One thing you can't replace and i don't believe Pulock/Pelech have is Hamonic plays with grit and has a bit of a mean streak in him. This team is already soft in some areas. Plus i think he is underated as a defenseman. There were a few times when he was johnny on the spot with the goalie floundering at keeping the puck out of the net.

If the trade was made. i would have been sad to see him go but wouldn't be dissaponted in the return
- special_k1074

Trouba would be a nice replacement..... just saying

Lets not get extreme and say trading Hamonic and Hall would miss the playoffs. One could make an argument, that another GM if offered Hall for Hamonic, woulda been on the horn with 29 other NHL teams seeing what it would take to get a 20 min a night shut down dmen. Its not like the isles dont have 5 blue chip forward prospects, and picks to aquire it.
- kindlyrick

Not what I said it any capacity. I said his example was terrible because he's arguing that we should be doing what an inferior team did.

Teams very seldom trade defensemen that are worth anything. If you think Snow was trading Ryan Strome and getting someone comparable to Hamonic then you're lying to yourself.

As far as NJ making the playoffs, they have now lost their best defenseman, who was also their top shot-suppressing defenseman. I'm not all that confident that they have the talent up front, even with Hall, to be any kind of real threat to make the playoffs.

There are other wingers out there than Taylor Hall that can be acquired at a better price.
- eichiefs9

Like who? Bc elite scorers are hard to come by unless you trade something of worth. Hall for Hammer would have been a staright 1 for 1 which would ease the pain of losing possible multiple future pieces...

Like who? Bc elite scorers are hard to come by unless you trade something of worth. Hall for Hammer would have been a staright 1 for 1 which would ease the pain of losing possible multiple future pieces...
- Ur Not Me

I don't have a list of names of what players GM's may consider trading for any multitude of reasons including, not but limited to: cap issues, pending UFA status, the looming expansion draft, etc...

Are you telling me you don't think that there's any other wingers out there that would fill our need and be comparable to Taylor Hall? Not saying they'll be at Hall's skill level, but comparable.

I don't have a list of names of what players GM's may consider trading for any multitude of reasons including, not but limited to: cap issues, pending UFA status, the looming expansion draft, etc...

Are you telling me you don't think that there's any other wingers out there that would fill our need and be comparable to Taylor Hall? Not saying they'll be at Hall's skill level, but comparable.
- eichiefs9

Not trying to jump into your response to him, but the same can be said for a Dman playing similar style/minutes to Hamonic. So coming full circle, there is no right answer here. I just feel that 29 other GMs in the league would have pulled the trigger on that Hamonic for Hall deal.....and gotten 91 his suitor. I also, feel 29 other GMs woulda taken the list of prospects, young players, and picks and went out and gotten a Trouba type player. Barzal, Beauvillier, MDC, Ho sang, Bellows, Strome, Nelson, Lee, Bailey and picks......surely you can come up with a deal to land that player.

See what i did there.....ha

I don't have a list of names of what players GM's may consider trading for any multitude of reasons including, not but limited to: cap issues, pending UFA status, the looming expansion draft, etc...

Are you telling me you don't think that there's any other wingers out there that would fill our need and be comparable to Taylor Hall? Not saying they'll be at Hall's skill level, but comparable.
- eichiefs9

Well when u bring up Hall which is considered a top 5 LW today, thats a hard person to find as comparable.
Difference of teams trading off any possible player is bc they cant afford to resign, isles are slowly becoming that too, so that has to factor in.
I'd rather have Hall then Ladd, so maybe he wouldnt have been signed, but that didnt happen and Snow grossly gave-out too many years on a player that has the physicality to break down aka Callahan 2.0

Well when u bring up Hall which is considered a top 5 LW today, thats a hard person to find as comparable.
Difference of teams trading off any possible player is bc they cant afford to resign, isles are slowly becoming that too, so that has to factor in.
I'd rather have Hall then Ladd, so maybe he wouldnt have been signed, but that didnt happen and Snow grossly gave-out too many years on a player that has the physicality to break down aka Callahan 2.0
- Ur Not Me

You're gonna love Ladd....trust me. Dont worry about years 6, and 7.

You're gonna love Ladd....trust me. Dont worry about years 6, and 7.
- kindlyrick

Sorry i dont, he couldnt mesh well with CHI and all that talent, so I beg to differ...

edit: I say this, I wouldnt be surprised if Ladd has a phenomenal 1st year, but dont see anything good past yr 1

Not trying to jump into your response to him, but the same can be said for a Dman playing similar style/minutes to Hamonic. So coming full circle, there is no right answer here. I just feel that 29 other GMs in the league would have pulled the trigger on that Hamonic for Hall deal.....and gotten 91 his suitor. I also, feel 29 other GMs woulda taken the list of prospects, young players, and picks and went out and gotten a Trouba type player. Barzal, Beauvillier, MDC, Ho sang, Bellows, Strome, Nelson, Lee and picks......surely you can come up with a deal to land that player.
- kindlyrick

Except quality defenseman rarely get traded. Happens with forwards far more frequently. Outside of Larsson (for Hall) who was the last truly talented defenseman you saw traded? Other than guys who were pending UFA's and who's teams weren't going to sign them and flipped them at the deadline.

NJ has prospects/picks/etc they acquired Hall/Palmeiri/Schneider, etc so lets not count them out bc we think they have nothing .....
- Ur Not Me

Their defense is garbage though. Schneider is good enough to play behind that but that's not a playoff team.

Sorry i dont, he couldnt mesh well with CHI and all that talent, so I beg to differ...

edit: I say this, I wouldnt be surprised if Ladd has a phenomenal 1st year, but dont see anything good past yr 1
- Ur Not Me

He had 8 goals and 12 points in 19 games with Chicago during the regular season. That's not meshing well?

Well when u bring up Hall which is considered a top 5 LW today, thats a hard person to find as comparable.
Difference of teams trading off any possible player is bc they cant afford to resign, isles are slowly becoming that too, so that has to factor in.
I'd rather have Hall then Ladd, so maybe he wouldnt have been signed, but that didnt happen and Snow grossly gave-out too many years on a player that has the physicality to break down aka Callahan 2.0
- Ur Not Me

All you're doing is proving to me that you're wearing colossal-sized Taylor-Hall-blinders. You want Hall and don't care about much else.

You're completely overlooking the fact that trading for a good winger (not as good as Hall, but still a quality scoring winger) and keeping Travis Hamonic would make this team better and more complete than Taylor Hall would have by himself. Not considering that route is basically saying you'd rather have $100 bill than a $50 bill and 3 $20's.

Their defense is garbage though. Schneider is good enough to play behind that but that's not a playoff team.
- Isles_since_6

If there main F's stay healthy, I guaranty they make PO's

meaning no long term injuries to their main top 6...

He had 8 goals and 12 points in 19 games with Chicago during the regular season. That's not meshing well?
- NYI44

He was traded to play alongside Teows & I believe ended up on 3rd line...

He was traded to play alongside Teows & I believe ended up on 3rd line...
- Ur Not Me

Most common linemates were Toews and Hossa

http://leftwinglock.com/l...s&strength=EV&gametype=10

The new owners put everyone on notice, Isn't Snow trying to do the best he can to put together a cup contender? Does anyone think Snow or Cappy can get another job if they lose this one? so this is probably their only shot. Maybe the offers just aren't there or they want a kings ransom. At the very least it seams that Garth isn't mortgaging the future to save his own ass.

All you're doing is proving to me that you're wearing colossal-sized Taylor-Hall-blinders. You want Hall and don't care about much else.

You're completely overlooking the fact that trading for a good winger (not as good as Hall, but still a quality scoring winger) and keeping Travis Hamonic would make this team better and more complete than Taylor Hall would have by himself. Not considering that route is basically saying you'd rather have $100 bill than a $50 bill and 3 $20's.
- eichiefs9

Yes then if you look at it from my point, to acquire a top 5 LW for not even a top 20 dman in league, yeah u make the trade and figure out the rest. Elite talent is hard to come by unless u draft/over-pay/or get lucky in FA

Except quality defenseman rarely get traded. Happens with forwards far more frequently. Outside of Larsson (for Hall) who was the last truly talented defenseman you saw traded? Other than guys who were pending UFA's and who's teams weren't going to sign them and flipped them at the deadline.
- eichiefs9

You just brought up a good point. The Hall for Larsson trade was lopsided, but Edmonton who desperately needed a dman gave up a top 5 right wing. As i said before, you dont have to win every trade head to head, you just have to address your need. With all the prospects the isles have a deal can be made.

I mean the isles went out and got Leddy and Boychuk one summer lest we forget.

The new owners put everyone on notice, Isn't Snow trying to do the best he can to put together a cup contender? Does anyone think Snow or Cappy can get another job if they lose this one? so this is probably their only shot. Maybe the offers just aren't there or they want a kings ransom. At the very least it seams that Garth isn't mortgaging the future to save his own ass.
- special_k1074

Can we really use the phrases mortgaging the future when you've been at the helm of a rebuild for 10 years?

You just brought up a good point. The Hall for Larsson trade was lopsided, but Edmonton who desperately needed a dman gave up a top 5 right wing. As i said before, you dont have to win every trade head to head, you just have to address your need. With all the prospects the isles have a deal can be made.

I mean the isles went out and got Leddy and Boychuk one summer lest we forget...
- kindlyrick

Yes, and Chiarelli was almost wholly lambasted by everyone for making a terrible, panic trade to address a need. Larsson is not a top pairing defenseman in any sense of the word and he traded a top 5 LW for him.

Saying that you should fill a need by any cost is a dangerously bad way of thinking.

Yes, and Chiarelli was almost wholly lambasted by everyone for making a terrible, panic trade to address a need. Larsson is not a top pairing defenseman in any sense of the word and he traded a top 5 LW for him.

Saying that you should fill a need by any cost is a dangerously bad way of thinking.
- eichiefs9

I never said any cost. I said with the prospects the isles have coupled with picks a deal can be made.

Most common linemates were Toews and Hossa

http://leftwinglock.com/l...s&strength=EV&gametype=10
- eichiefs9

It didnt mesh well, Ladd was force fed 1st line bc of the trade but that line had issues producing at a scoring rate, Panarin-AA-Kane was really the 1st line scoring machine

Yes, and Chiarelli was almost wholly lambasted by everyone for making a terrible, panic trade to address a need. Larsson is not a top pairing defenseman in any sense of the word and he traded a top 5 LW for him.

Saying that you should fill a need by any cost is a dangerously bad way of thinking.
- eichiefs9

Chiarelli did what winners do......he took a risk. He addressed a need. With McDavid now, Hall is no longer Hall for the Oil. He got what he needed. Thats exactly why Snow shoulda made that trade.

Yes then if you look at it from my point, to acquire a top 5 LW for not even a top 20 dman in league, yeah u make the trade and figure out the rest. Elite talent is hard to come by unless u draft/over-pay/or get lucky in FA
- Ur Not Me

Oh. Well if all we need to do is "figure out the rest", the rest being "finding a top pairing defenseman that can play in all situations and log huge, important minutes", then I guess we'd be fine.

Generally if you're defense of doing something is "just do it and figure out the rest later", you probably shouldn't do that thing because that means you don't really have a plan and that's not smart.