I think Laughton, as with many young guys out of junior, still need to grasp the concept of constantly working shift in and shift out as well as game in and game out
- Just5

Good point.

He's shown flashes but has also lulled a bit. Maybe we see a similar development path to Schenn?

My dream is to have Konecny make it and dont want him playing fourth line minutes.

Weise should obviously be a lock.

(frank) Read.
- flyer_nutter

I've had my fill of Boyd Gordon already tell you the truth. I hadn't heard that name since he was a cap

Lets get crazy. I dont see Laughton as much in the future. Who the (frank) is he as a player?
- flyer_nutter

He's still pretty young tho. I see some untapped offensive potential if he can put the work in.

My dream is to have Konecny make it and dont want him playing fourth line minutes.

Weise should obviously be a lock.

(frank) Read.
- flyer_nutter

He'll make it back to Sarnia just fine.

He'll make it back to Sarnia just fine.
- ob18

Lets get crazy. I dont see Laughton as much in the future. Who the (frank) is he as a player?
- flyer_nutter

I don't know. Similar questions were posed to a 22 yoa B Schenn. Keep the fingers crossed

so again, you CANNOT fully say this as fact, because you dont know it 100% to be true or not. this is your opinion. i can say that Hextall is madly in love with schenn and of course they came to an agreement, but do i know that 100% no, and neither do u, just because he said he wanted to sign schenn and did, cannot possibly make u think that im right and ur wrong or even vice versa.

hextall could also be a smart GM, and was put in a position where he knew he didnt want to lose this player, but also didnt want to pay him what he was asking, and negotiations took this long to a point where yes, the schenn camp used it as leverage, and in the end hextall probably paid about a million more than he wanted, but again, as a smart GM, he knew he had to get him signed.

i mean, do you not understand what ur saying is opinion and conjecture, and in no way can be proven by any facts. u repeating that he wanted to get him signed, and then he did, making it a fact to back up ur argument, is not a fact. again, its your opinion thats perceived based on what u see and hear. i make my opinion the same way, and we just flat out disagree. not once in this whole conversation have i said ur wrong, i said what my opinion was and disagree, u continue to spout im wrong about my opinion, which is impossible, unless my opinion is about something that is factually proven that i think is false. my point and opinion do not follow that criteria.
- sjk540

As far as negotiations are concerned, I think it's pretty obvious that Hextall didn't want to pay what the Schenn camp was asking for, for most of the negotiations. A contract negotiation is a compromise. As I stated earlier, in some negotiations, both the team and the player, are on the same page, and easily agree to a contract. In some cases, the numbers the team wants to pay, and what the player wants, are separated by some distance, and it takes longer to come to a compromise and an agreement.


My opinion that Hextall wanted to sign Schenn to a multi year deal is fully supported by the facts that Hextall stated it publicly, multiple times, and he did in fact, sign Schenn to a multi year deal, worth over 5M a year.


What facts can you offer to support your opinion?

Lets get crazy. I dont see Laughton as much in the future. Who the (frank) is he as a player?
- flyer_nutter

Maybe give the kid a little bit of time, before we write him off. He has played a grand total of 107 NHL games, and was hampered by a concussion last season.

thrived? simmonds stats were borderline the exact same from two seasons ago playing without G. Schenn finally turned it on after taking almost 3 full seasons to get it together. the fact is, G makes everyone around him better. another fact is that schenn and coots seem to have amazing chemistry together. putting laughton with G has more of a chance of improving his game than with coots, and i fully think laughton has the potential to be a solid top 6 guy, think he can be another schenn who skates a little better. well never know until we try it. additionally, adding raffl to our bottom 6 only improves it as a group, while taking laughton out of a log jammed bottom 6 will help decipher roles for the bottom 6 guys.

if it doesnt work, than u know what u have with laughton, end of discussion.

its a win win win in my eyes. and one we should do sooner than later before we start competing for a cup each year. this is when we need to iron out the wrinkles.
- sjk540

Schenn, Simmonds and Voracek ate legitimate point collectors and you just wanna hand an opportunity to a kid who hasn't earned that spot yet. Simmonds with 32 two goals and Schenn with the best even strength point totals, yes, thrived.

Laughton basically went from a projected their line center to a number one wing in just a couple seasons. Even G had to work from the third line to the first in his career.

He'll make it back to Sarnia just fine.
- ob18

We are going to be so taken aback when Konecny is sent back to Sarnia and Salinitri makes the Flyers out of camp

Laughton was one of the best ES point producers on the team in poop minutes. He struggled at center, struggled defensively, but it's very possible that, given time on LW with perhaps Coots and Jake, who can cover his deficiencies, that he could actually put up some good scoring. Bumping Raffl down makes the third line even better. It could make the team deeper.

And there is zero reason Scot-Tay should not be on PP2 as a trigger man this year. And the PK (he did really well there oddly enough). He's not crap, but he needs to be recast and given more special teams work.

My dream is to have Konecny make it and dont want him playing fourth line minutes.

Weise should obviously be a lock.

(frank) Read.
- flyer_nutter

So keep Bellemare over Read?

Laughton was one of the best ES point producers on the team in poop minutes. He struggled at center, struggled defensively, but it's very possible that, given time on LW with perhaps Coots and Jake, who can cover his deficiencies, that he could actually put up some good scoring. Bumping Raffl down makes the third line even better. It could make the team deeper.

And there is zero reason Scot-Tay should not be on PP2 as a trigger man this year. And the PK (he did really well there oddly enough). He's not crap, but he needs to be recast and given more special teams work.
- Mononoke

The problem with this mindset is not everyone can get a push on this team as a top line player. Who was the new flavor of the offseason last year? Michael Raffl? What about the summer before, Matt Read? A lot of talent, not enough spots in the top 6. As a really good junior player, I expect Laughton to get better in time with increased minutes but it doesn't mean he should play with Giroux. Couturier I get, this is where I agree with you but not over Schenn, Simmonds or Voracek on G's line.

Laughton should be on special teams, no doubt.

Laughton was one of the best ES point producers on the team in poop minutes. He struggled at center, struggled defensively, but it's very possible that, given time on LW with perhaps Coots and Jake, who can cover his deficiencies, that he could actually put up some good scoring. Bumping Raffl down makes the third line even better. It could make the team deeper.

And there is zero reason Scot-Tay should not be on PP2 as a trigger man this year. And the PK (he did really well there oddly enough). He's not crap, but he needs to be recast and given more special teams work.
- Mononoke

Totally agree with pp2.

He's got to win more battles. Time to man up. Get involved in the game. Chirp, be in the other teams face. Let them know it's going to be a war. I was expecting a player with a lot more tenacity than he's shown. Kid is an angel.

Or don't and work your ass off. Ryan white work shift in and shift out. He's not there at all yet

Laughton was one of the best ES point producers on the team in poop minutes. He struggled at center, struggled defensively, but it's very possible that, given time on LW with perhaps Coots and Jake, who can cover his deficiencies, that he could actually put up some good scoring. Bumping Raffl down makes the third line even better. It could make the team deeper.

And there is zero reason Scot-Tay should not be on PP2 as a trigger man this year. And the PK (he did really well there oddly enough). He's not crap, but he needs to be recast and given more special teams work.
- Mononoke

They have 5 guys who are locked into the top 6: Giroux, Voracek, Simmonds, Couturier and Schenn. Going to need somebody to step up.

Could it be Laughton? Raffl? Wiese? Konecny? Cousins? There's a spot up for grabs and I'm fine with giving guys a shot. I think Laughton would be intriguing on a line with Couturier or Giroux.

But just having a guy to take some d zone starts because he's good at faceoffs doesn't mean your team is better or Giroux has less heavy lifting. That player has to be able to take tough zone starts AND be good afterwards AND be able to matchup against top 6 competition.

...

But even in the much mythologized Year of the Adam Hall, which people want replicated, Giroux took like 2 more offensive zone faceoffs every 5 games. That didn't exactly seem to release him from his burden.
- Mononoke

What ended up happening with Giroux and Hall was that Giroux would be put out with Hall in the defensive zone in case one of them was thrown out of the faceoff. It's rare that a complete 4th line is used for a defensive zone faceoff against a top line or even a 2nd line.
- PhillySportsGuy

Yeah, like Gordon being marginally better than Ryan White on draws is going to magically make the 4th-line capable of actually handling heavy minutes... Coots and G are still gonna be responsible for d-zone/late-period/late-game situations.

Unless Hak is crazy enough to match Gordon/VdV/PEB up against Crosby with the game on the line.

Yeah, like Gordon being marginally better than Ryan White on draws is going to magically make the 4th-line capable of actually handling heavy minutes... Coots and G are still gonna be responsible for d-zone/late-period/late-game situations.

Unless Hak is crazy enough to match Gordon/VdV/PEB up against Crosby with the game on the line.
- Tomahawk

Ryan White won 46.2% of his defensive zone draws last season. Gordon won 58.8% of his defensive zone draws last season. Gordon is far more than marginally better than White on draws. Giroux and Couturier will still get their share. Couturier is a LH shot, and Gordon and Giroux are RH shots. The idea is for Giroux to take far less defensive zone draws, and take more draws in offensive situations. That could have an impact on Giroux's production.

Unless Hak is crazy enough to match Gordon/VdV/PEB up against Crosby with the game on the line.
- Tomahawk

.....he wouldn't.....nah!.........................oh god.

Yeah, like Gordon being marginally better than Ryan White on draws is going to magically make the 4th-line capable of actually handling heavy minutes... Coots and G are still gonna be responsible for d-zone/late-period/late-game situations.

Unless Hak is crazy enough to match Gordon/VdV/PEB up against Crosby with the game on the line.
- Tomahawk

This has bugged me since July 1st. It's never been Weise vs White for me.

Yeah, like Gordon being marginally better than Ryan White on draws is going to magically make the 4th-line capable of actually handling heavy minutes... Coots and G are still gonna be responsible for d-zone/late-period/late-game situations.

Unless Hak is crazy enough to match Gordon/VdV/PEB up against Crosby with the game on the line.
- Tomahawk

I don't think the idea is to totally remove the burden of Giroux or Couturier, but to provide a line that can assume a more defense first role and handle a heavier load. They didn't exactly trust Bellemare, White & VandeVelde last year to be a supplementary shutdown line.

I also think PK is really the primary focus and their scouting & analysis tells them Gordon is an exceptional PK guy. That's why I am for spreading the B6 wealth and giving Laughton a T6 opportunity to boot.

Get a 3rd line of Raffl, Cousins & Wiese and a 4th of Read, Gordon and Lyubimov or Bellemare and it won't necessarily be a case of having a line get buried in it's own end most of the time.

Or at least that'd be my hope

Ryan White won 46.2% of his defensive zone draws last season. Gordon won 58.8% of his defensive zone draws last season. Gordon is far more than marginally better than White on draws. Giroux and Couturier will still get their share. Couturier is a LH shot, and Gordon and Giroux are RH shots. The idea is for Giroux to take far less defensive zone draws, and take more draws in offensive situations. That could have an impact on Giroux's production.
- MJL

Even so, why is White forced to take faceoffs at all?

Even so, why is White forced to take faceoffs at all?
- roenick97

First, I accidentally flagged this comment and for that I am sorry.

Secondly, who cares. White isn't even on the team anymore.

Secondly, who cares. White isn't even on the team anymore.
- Mordecai

should have been a career Flyer!

First, I accidentally flagged this comment and for that I am sorry.

Secondly, who cares. White isn't even on the team anymore.
- Mordecai

We're talking about the significance of Gordon's faceoff ability over White's, even though White is a winger...

FWIW, White's career faceoff % is 51.9% Bellemare is at 47.4% And the DZ FO% was bad for both 46% for White, 42% for Bellemare. The season before, White was at 58.8% on DZ FO's, while Bellemare was at 45.7%

Not sure why the Hell both Berube & Hakstol had Bellemare taking faceoffs over White-at least from a purely stats standpoint