I'd take a chance on Kane and slot him into the #2LW but buffalo would have to retain salary and we would have to have strict rules for him
- Maverick1818

For a guy who scored 30 G once he is way over hyped & over priced. His next best season he scored 20 G. Again only once.

I hope PD stays far away from Kane talks with Timmy.

Uncle Eugene approves this message

For a guy who scored 30 G once he is way over hyped & over priced. His next best season he scored 20 G. Again only once.

I hope PD stays far away from Kane talks with Timmy.

Uncle Eugene approves this message
- Erik6Karlsson5

Thus the #2LW

I think the lesson to be learned is that an elite center can make a good winger great. While, an elite winger can't necessarily do the same for the center. Hence, pour the money into the middle and don't overpay for wingers.

I look at the Pens as an example. Crosby took a very good Kunitz and gave him some great years. Malkin made a very good James Neal Elite.

There are certain wingers that can do it, Kane, a young Hossa, but not many.

tell me if i'm out to lunch with this:

trade hoffman to anaheim for fowler

package ceci, lazar, and a lottery protected 1st to edmonton for RNH and yakupov

zibby - RNH - ryan
yakupov - turris - stone
mac - JGP - smith
paul - kelly - puempel
neil

methot - karlsson
fowler - phaneuf
wideman - chabot/boro/claesson/etc

not sure how zibby would do on the wing. i think the value is pretty fair, maybe add small pieces here or there. i think that makes ottawa a better team.

tell me if i'm out to lunch with this:

trade hoffman to anaheim for fowler

package ceci, lazar, and a lottery protected 1st to edmonton for RNH and yakupov

zibby - RNH - ryan
yakupov - turris - stone
mac - JGP - smith
paul - kelly - puempel
neil

methot - karlsson
fowler - phaneuf
wideman - chabot/boro/claesson/etc

not sure how zibby would do on the wing. i think the value is pretty fair, maybe add small pieces here or there. i think that makes ottawa a better team.
- sensarmy_11

That's a lot for an ok centre and a bust of a top prospect. Doubt Edmonton is going to make another big trade after losing Hall.

The Hoffman/Fowler swap could be a possibility.

I think the lesson to be learned is that an elite center can make a good winger great. While, an elite winger can't necessarily do the same for the center. Hence, pour the money into the middle and don't overpay for wingers.

I look at the Pens as an example. Crosby took a very good Kunitz and gave him some great years. Malkin made a very good James Neal Elite.

There are certain wingers that can do it, Kane, a young Hossa, but not many.
- cranktheradio

I agree, that's why I think Duchene could make Hoffman a 40+ scorer

That's a lot for an ok centre and a bust of a top prospect. Doubt Edmonton is going to make another big trade after losing Hall.

The Hoffman/Fowler swap could be a possibility.
- Gord_Wilson_2.0

he's already better than zibby (already 70 or so more career points) and i expect he'll be better than turris by the time they're the same age

as for yakupov........i think there's a pretty big "edmonton factor" in his bust status. i think he'd do very well with a change of scenery

I agree, that's why I think Duchene could make Hoffman a 40+ scorer
- Maverick1818

Heres the thing with all your Duchene talk. Avs want to win, they aren't trading star players for Package of prospects and young unproven guys. They did that with ROR bc that was the best deal out there and he was as pending UFA. Duchene, Barrie, Landeskog...alll the garbage rumours that the talking heads at TSN have been tossing out are forgetting 1 thing, these players are controlled by the Avs for multiple years, this isn't a ROR situation

You won't be getting a guy like Duchene without sending out Hoffman anyways, so you are barking up the wrong Center Tree with the Avs

Well I guess AlfieKing was right. Kelly coming back home.

What a waste of a signing.
- Gord_Wilson_2.0

I actually heard this as a rumor but kool

I like Chris Kelly - probably the best Sen I met in person. Good guy.

As far as on ice - he certainly isn't a waste. 900k is good value and low risk. That said, I agree, we want / deserve more.

The Sens will HAVE to package for a top line LW or C at some point. As far as RNH, I DO think Lazar is worth giving up for a 1st overall pick just 5 years ago.

Heres the thing with all your Duchene talk. Avs want to win, they aren't trading star players for Package of prospects and young unproven guys. They did that with ROR bc that was the best deal out there and he was as pending UFA. Duchene, Barrie, Landeskog...alll the garbage rumours that the talking heads at TSN have been tossing out are forgetting 1 thing, these players are controlled by the Avs for multiple years, this isn't a ROR situation

You won't be getting a guy like Duchene without sending out Hoffman anyways, so you are barking up the wrong Center Tree with the Avs
- DDM-Coga

I donno dude, Sakic specifically but Duchene on blast at the end of the year in the media and then right after that said big changes are coming. Plus the multiple reports saying he's being shopped.

Personally I don't see Hoffman fitting into the Avs system. maybe a Smith because he is more of a two way forward

I actually heard this as a rumor but kool

I like Chris Kelly - probably the best Sen I met in person. Good guy.

As far as on ice - he certainly isn't a waste. 900k is good value and low risk. That said, I agree, we want / deserve more.

The Sens will HAVE to package for a top line LW or C at some point. As far as RNH, I DO think Lazar is worth giving up for a 1st overall pick just 5 years ago.
- AlfieisKing

We have a top line LW in Hoffman we just feel to pay the man and sign him long term. we 100% need a #1C though

I donno dude, Sakic specifically but Duchene on blast at the end of the year in the media and then right after that said big changes are coming. Plus the multiple reports saying he's being shopped.

Personally I don't see Hoffman fitting into the Avs system. maybe a Smith because he is more of a two way forward
- Maverick1818

Thats not true, Sakic doesnt talk to the media, Roy does. Sakic likes to be behind the scenes. And when sakic speaks he doesnt put players on Blast. Neither does Roy for 99% of the time, he said 1 thing about duchene in a frustrating lose trying to get into the Playoffs, and they both (Roy and Duchene) have openly said they were in the wrong and are moving past it since they are all about the team winning in the playoffs

Avs management has never come out and said that, it was guys like Dater who were writing that story line. When Sakic has spoke in June and at the draft its been he believes in his core, he believes in his coach, the process they are building not just for now but to build a development system that is still in place when they are long gone as they believe thats one of the big issues why the team can't get over the hump, they don't have a proper Farm system in place.

TSN doesnt pick up those stories bc they make their clicks on rumours.

Thats not true, Sakic doesnt talk to the media, Roy does. Sakic likes to be behind the scenes.

Avs management has never come out and said that, it was guys like Dater who were writing that story line. When Sakic has spoke in June and at the draft its been he believes in his core, he believes in his coach, the process they are building not just for now but to build a development system that is still in place when they are long gone.

TSN doesnt pick up those stories bc they make their clicks on rumours.
- DDM-Coga

The Sakic interview wasn't just reported man. I watched it.

The reports out of the draft were more then that, they were saying big changes were coming and honestly I believe they need it. the lost of ROR and PS made holes that were never filled. (like what would happen if Ottawa trades Hoffman). The Avs need to focus on signing Nathan M and doing a rebuild. You can do that by trading Duchene as long as you get someone to fill his spot, a young guy and a pick.

Which is what the reported asking price is.

That being said, you have nothing to worry about Sens management doesn't have the brains or skill to pull off that trade. With our luck we will prolly let Hoffman go for nothing lol

The Sakic interview wasn't just reported man. I watched it.

The reports out of the draft were more then that, they were saying big changes were coming and honestly I believe they need it. the lost of ROR and PS made holes that were never filled. (like what would happen if Ottawa trades Hoffman). The Avs need to focus on signing Nathan M and doing a rebuild. You can do that by trading Duchene as long as you get someone to fill his spot, a young guy and a pick.

Which is what the reported asking price is.
- Maverick1818

Ok man, you aren't going to win an argument to a die hard Avs fan who listen and reads to almost every word that comes out about this team. Sakic doesnt put players on Blast.

And funny you google Joe Sakic Big Changes are Coming and what do you find...nothing. What you find is Sakic is fine staying the course.

There is no reported asking price for Duchene, you are confusing rumour blogs and fan base side information for actual reported information. There is no "Report" on the asking price for Duchene.

The only thing that Sakic has said that he is open to making moves if it makes the team better, he isn't selling guys off here, this isn't a rebuild. So don't get the 2 confused.

Its just fruastting for Av fans in Canada having to listen to the trash that TSN is reporting lately abbot the team, they really don't have a good insider course of that franchise and just make these claims that get picked up as "Reports" by guys posting in here. Like how "Roy saying Barrie was a 5th Dman" is a true fact. There hasn't been 1 quote or interview that has Roy saying that, just a guy who works at the Denver Post who just tweeted that out 1 night, but now TSN reports it as its a fact.

So seeing all the Avs are dumb will take anything for their stars talk is just frustrating

Ok man, you aren't going to win an argument to a die hard Avs fan who listen and reads to almost every word that comes out about this team. Sakic doesnt put players on Blast.

And funny you google Joe Sakic Big Changes are Coming and what do you find...nothing. What you find is Sakic is fine staying the course.

There is no reported asking price for Duchene, you are confusing rumour blogs and fan base side information for actual reported information. There is no "Report" on the asking price for Duchene.

The only thing that Sakic has said that he is open to making moves if it makes the team better, he isn't selling guys off here, this isn't a rebuild. So don't get the 2 confused
- DDM-Coga

Just google "Matt Duchene trade rumors" Hockeypress 7 days ago and 4 days ago, a ton of reports and postings in April and May from sportnet and other sources as well.

Which have Sakic and Roy quotes that have been reported in them. Bob Mackenzie was on tv a couple of days ago talking about it as well and it was talked about on the NHL satellite radio network. Saying that the asking price for Duchene is the same as it's been all year a top 6 forward, a young player and a pick or prospect. Or a superstar Defense man.

I'm not saying it's 100% because nothing is. But to say that there is nothing happening and everything is just sunshine and roses with Duchene, Sakic and Roy is simply not true.

If the Avs aren't in a rebuild they certainly need some retooling.... same with the Sens.

Like I said before, you have nothing to worry about because the Sens management neither has the skill to pull off a trade like that, or the guts to even try to make a statement in the NHL.

I post scenarios like getting Duchene in here for a few reasons
#1 it's been in the rumor mill and reported a ton lately
#2 He is an awesome player i'm sure any team would love to have
and
#3 I think a C of his caliber would make Hoffman a 40+ goal scorer and is exactly what Ottawa needs and the return to the Avs would help them as well. Same as I have written about taking a chance on Yak or Kane or Schenn.

So no need to get so defensive

Just google "Matt Duchene trade rumors" Hockeypress 7 days ago and 4 days ago, a ton of reports and postings in April and May from sportnet and other sources as well.

Which have Sakic and Roy quotes that have been reported in them. Bob Mackenzie was on tv a couple of days ago talking about it as well and it was talked about on the NHL satellite radio network. Saying that the asking price for Duchene is the same as it's been all year a top 6 forward, a young player and a pick or prospect. Or a superstar Defense man.

I'm not saying it's 100% because nothing is. But to say that there is nothing happening and everything is just sunshine and roses with Duchene, Sakic and Roy is simply not true.

If the Avs aren't in a rebuild they certainly need some retooling.... same with the Sens.

Like I said before, you have nothing to worry about because the Sens management neither has the skill to pull off a trade like that, or the guts to even try to make a statement in the NHL.

I post scenarios like getting Duchene in here for a few reasons
#1 it's been in the rumor mill and reported a ton lately
#2 He is an awesome player i'm sure any team would love to have
and
#3 I think a C of his caliber would make Hoffman a 40+ goal scorer and is exactly what Ottawa needs and the return to the Avs would help them as well. Same as I have written about taking a chance on Yak or Kane or Schenn.

So no need to get so defensive
- Maverick1818

You know that the HockeyPress is just a fan page right?

Those are just guys speculating on the price, they really dont know. Thats where the frustration comes in, Friedman, Dreger, McKenzie are just speculating and shooting from the hips at time....they constantly say they "Think" thats that they are asking. Not as a known fact

Not trying to be a dink or anything, just frustrating seeing the same misinformation get passed along.

I am not saying the Avs won't ever trade a guy, but not now, not for these random future packages that come up in these blogs.

I am just speculating myself but Duchene would be the last guy to have issues with Roy and Sakic, they were his idols growing up, he was a childhood Avalanche fan growing up, this is his dream to play for them. He blindly goes along with whatever he says, which is great and a little scary to think he might be wasting his talent by just blindly following an being a good old canadian boy for his idols

With the expansion draft coming up, no team should be making blockbuster deals that complications their protection list. Its just common sense.

Ok man, you aren't going to win an argument to a die hard Avs fan who listen and reads to almost every word that comes out about this team. Sakic doesnt put players on Blast.

And funny you google Joe Sakic Big Changes are Coming and what do you find...nothing. What you find is Sakic is fine staying the course.

There is no reported asking price for Duchene, you are confusing rumour blogs and fan base side information for actual reported information. There is no "Report" on the asking price for Duchene.

The only thing that Sakic has said that he is open to making moves if it makes the team better, he isn't selling guys off here, this isn't a rebuild. So don't get the 2 confused.

Its just fruastting for Av fans in Canada having to listen to the trash that TSN is reporting lately abbot the team, they really don't have a good insider course of that franchise and just make these claims that get picked up as "Reports" by guys posting in here. Like how "Roy saying Barrie was a 5th Dman" is a true fact. There hasn't been 1 quote or interview that has Roy saying that, just a guy who works at the Denver Post who just tweeted that out 1 night, but now TSN reports it as its a fact.

So seeing all the Avs are dumb will take anything for their stars talk is just frustrating
- DDM-Coga

Right. Duchene "isn't on the market". I totally understand *wink wink nudge nudge*

You know that the HockeyPress is just a fan page right?

Those are just guys speculating on the price, they really dont know. Thats where the frustration comes in, Friedman, Dreger, McKenzie are just speculating and shooting from the hips at time....they constantly say they "Think" thats that they are asking. Not as a known fact

Not trying to be a dink or anything, just frustrating seeing the same misinformation get passed along.

I am not saying the Avs won't ever trade a guy, but not now, not for these random future packages that come up in these blogs.

I am just speculating myself but Duchene would be the last guy to have issues with Roy and Sakic, they were his idols growing up, he was a childhood Avalanche fan growing up, this is his dream to play for them. He blindly goes along with whatever he says, which is great and a little scary to think he might be wasting his talent by just blindly following an being a good old canadian boy for his idols

With the expansion draft coming up, no team should be making blockbuster deals that complications their protection list. Its just common sense.
- DDM-Coga

Yes I know Hockeypress is a fan thing, however I listed it because they have quotes in there. and of course it's speculation from Mackenzie and all those guys because no GM in the history of any sports has ever come out and said who they are shopping and what the asking prices are. However they talk to people inside, coaches, gm's, players etc and develop commonalities with what everyone is saying and then because they are analysis they create reports about it. and a lot of the time they are correct.

Same as they said Kane is having problems with Murray in Buffalo, or hearing for about a year the Taylor Hall was going to get traded and the asking price was a D... which ended up happening and a million other reports. All of these are educated speculation from people within those groups.

and they have certainly reported several times about Duchene. I mean this is a league that traded Gretzky. No one is 100% safe. and All i'm saying is that there are reports and rumors out there and where there is smoke there is usually fire and there has been a lot of smoke around Duchene lately. and that to me, pairing him with Hoffman in Ottawa would be no brainer.

Maverick + DDM.... on Duchene... without question the Avs won't move this guy unless it's a good deal. I don't think he's being shopped and I know thats not what you guys are saying. I think Maverick is right, that their have been reports/rumors of some discussions - in other words, I certainly believe there's smoke there.

Now that doesn't mean I think Duchene will be moved but I can say it wouldn't surprise me if he's moved in the next 1-2 years. Obviously his contract plays a role, but with J. Staal, Ryan and others - similar players have been traded from their teams after rumors came out....... those cases it took longer and people forgot it came up way before.

With Ryan, rumors were there at the 2012 draft (I think) and it took 2 years until he was moved. Staal always wanted a bigger role (and likely bigger $) and got both in Carolina. IMO both have failed to live up to their roles and contracts.

With Duchene, I don't think he's proven himself as a #1 center on a playoff team, but certainly has the ability and showed in the 2nd half that he can be a real star for the years to come. My question is - why move a guy like that? Yes you have MacKinnon but you'll need a strong #2. That's why Mika Zibanejad comes in for me. He could be a solid #2 for COL and play with Landeskog perfectly.

IF a deal was made, it would cost the Sens -- not just quality pieces but an extension where he would have to get equal to RoR. Likely means $ 7.5 x 8 (which would quick in after 2 years)

We have bigger issues than our 4th line centre spot, lets get that out of the way first.

My issue is that I feel Kelly will be relegated to a healthy scratch. So my point of view is that he can't really play 4th line centre either. Similar to Gomez when we signed him. Maybe I'll be wrong. I'd be happy if I was, but this isn't the Chris Kelly of 2007.
- Gord_Wilson_2.0

Feels like a Bryan Murray signing, doesn't it.
Maybe Dorion was driving the bus on those decisions!

Feels like a Bryan Murray signing, doesn't it.
Maybe Dorion was driving the bus on those decisions!
- SensFan25

Or maybe Murray is will pulling the strings in the back ground. This is why I thought we should have hired a GM from outside the organization

Or maybe Murray is will pulling the strings in the back ground. This is why I thought we should have hired a GM from outside the organization
- Maverick1818

Sens had the chance to get Ray Shero -- the same guy that pulled a deal that everyone and their mothers know was a slam dunk win (in terms of value)

I like the fact that Dorion is being calculated, the fact he brought in Boucher and stood by the decision, the fact he traded 1 spot to get the guy he wanted at the draft.... I just think it's really the start of regular season where we find out where this team is.

There's a lot of things that could go right -- Zibanejad could have a stellar year and become a legit top 2 center in the NHL, MacArthur could return to form with another 20G/45PT campaign, Turris + Stone could become the 1-2 punch the Sens need, Ryan could rediscover his game as a 30g man, and finally the defensive structure (biggest thing) could be completed restructured as the Sens FINALLY have a solid top 4D to play with Ceci (a overly priced one mind you). ........
There's a lot of coulds.... instead of shoulds on that list. In fact, if I was betting, I would bet that Turris + Stone will hit over 60 points if healthy and Hoffman+Ryan will combine for 50 goals. But I wouldn't bet on Zibanejad or MacArthur. IMO, it's unpredictable. I could be wrong, but those 2 are the ? for me in the top 6. Mac it's health but with Z-jad it's the ability to change his game to a more assertive attack and finish. He needs to start shooting more and learning how to use his body - especially closer to the net.

Chris Kelly is great, but unless Ryan and Zibby have career years this is not a playoff team.

Dorion says he likes the team, we can all see the potential. But are Zibby and Ryan going to be in shape, is Hoffman going to stop worrying about how his stick is taped and get involved in a game emotionally. Is Lazar going to step it up and top worrying about being a RW and just worry about being an NHL'er.

Ottawa has a lot of pieces, but we also have a lot of passengers. If the passengers decide to drive the bus, then we have something.

Hall is a left wing
- Symba007

Oops. Haha My bad and good point. I wouldn't make that trade either way. I feel both of those players RNH and Dratsail are way overrated.

I agree that Turris isn't an ELITE 1C but last year we were able to score by committee, ranking 9th in the league in GF.
Our problems were in GA category where we ranked 26th.
You guys make a really good argument for Duchene but his numbers aren't that much better than healthy Turris or Zbad, one 30 goal season...

http://www.hockeydb.com/i...s/pdisplay.php?pid=106808
http://www.hockeydb.com/i...ts/pdisplay.php?pid=99822
http://www.hockeydb.com/i...s/pdisplay.php?pid=139958

Hopefully Boucher and Crawford can solve our defensive problems this year and our forward core can maintain the same offensive output. By just browsing some of the elite teams' goal differential, we'll need approx +30 goal differential to have a really good year (Penguins and Caps had +42 and +57 years in 2016, Sharks +30 etc)

http://www.nhl.com/stats/...sort=goalsFor&aggregate=0

The good news is the Erik Condras of the league (and Chris Kellys) are easier to come by than 1C's. We will need to maintain our offensive output from last year while decreasing our goals against by 41 (or .5 ga/g) to reach this this threshold and be competitive, which isn't as hard as adding offensive production which comes at a premium (NJ, Van, Leafs, Canes etc.)

Time will tell but with new coaching, the addition of Phaneuf and Kelly, and hopefully the progression of Ceci I think we could be in good shape this year. If you guys recall the last time we made the playoffs it was due largely to goaltending (defence). If we could get the same rate of g/a from the team as a whole (and not count so heavily on goaltending to save the day every game) I think this team would be dangerous.