I may bethe only one without rose colored glasses, but Panik sucks as far as in that roll for the long Haul, he's a 600 k depth player, yeah he had his little feel good run last year, but Babcock and Stevie Y send him packin??? And who do they pawn him off on? Mr.great trader. Unfortunately, Tazer is gonna have to have line mates by committee again, hopefully a kid like McNeill plays up to his draft potential and eventually can become an option, and as far as Panarin, yes, special talent, But I am sure the rest of the league will adjust to him and will pay more attention to him, Good player but no Patrick Kane, and if he gets stupid with his demands, find someGM as gullible as Stan Bowman and geta haul back, on second thought, How could Bowman fleece himself?
- wonthecup10

Yeah, I don't disagree... Although I was impressed during the playoffs, I don't love him as 1LW at all (at 3LW I think he can bring a lot of value)... I was moreso making a statement that I have come to grips with the fact that a real 1LW signing is looking less likely... I think that some size would be nice and I could see him inserted there (and I suppose we can hope that Kane and Toews play together and make their line mate better) because we have less options but that is certainly not the "fix" to our 1LW issues... I think we end up seeing the lack of wings to play w/ 19 mitigated by breaking up PAK... Who knows maybe I'll be pleasantly surprised

She posts more logic, fact and common sense in 9 posts than most of us do in 900 posts.
- DarthKane

Yeaa...... but (frank) that.........

Not really / not well. Stats are not really meant to be used outside of context of other stats. You looks at his zone starts vs finishes + his base possession - all combined they illustrates Kruger gets the puck out of the DZ a lot and still generally has solid possession i.e. possession gain is high. Add in his transition and passing numbers, and you realize he individually helps drive that possession from one zone to the other. He's good at his role.

Below is a pic of Kruger's WOWY for 2014-15, btw, with his most common linemates + Kane who double shifted on the 4th line a lot. As you can tell, most of the the 'together' bubbles are higher for forwards because Kruger is a good complimentary player. This still does not include full context - like Shaw away from Kruger had predominantly high OZS% and Kruger-Hjammer saw over 90%+ DZS when together - but it's a good general overview imo.


- L_B_R

Thanks for your effort, LBR.........

Y
Hawks send Crawford and sea brook for nurse ( I know dreaming) or kelfbom and Draisati and yak. Draisati and kelfbom make the Hawks younger and if yak doesn't work out there's room under the cap this year and next for the bread man
- Abadseed

We don't need a goalie, and we like Seabrooke, but not his contract.


So no.

Hey Al,


What do you think the return for AA would be ? Would the Hawks be targeting a less3r Center with cap savings or a D man ?

Youve brought up AA a lot lately ? Dot connecting or hearing the Hawks would deal him and soon, before 7/1 ?
- mrpaulish

I would think you would get a nice $2-2.5 mill player back and a prospect and or pick...Big centers are in demand.

1st pairing....I think over half the teams don't have 2....Hawks have 3 which is another reason they won 3 Cups.
- Al

Agreed 100%, Al. Sometimes it's easy for a Hawk fan to take elite Dmen for granted but look around and you have 10 or so teams looking for one that just aren't available if they can be found.......

Agree but I thought it would be a combo of Shaw/Kruger and rookie...But inany event Bowman mentioned about reinventing the club through changes...

I take a chance they can find a fill in for AA rather than a guy who kills penalties and can check the top line center as well.

I like AA but at $4.5 mill per I take the chance and bank $2 mill.
- Al

If (IF) cap space is the most important return - is there enough of a market for AA at $4.5MM so that Stan won't have to take back too much bad paper of retain too much salary?

That could work, JJ, but my concern is that AA picked up a lot of loose change (and created a lot of traffic for his linemates) by camping in front of the net, which is not really Kruger's game. I wonder what impact that would have on 72 and 88.
- Hank_Greenberg

Whomever plays center on that line has one responsibility above all- get the puck, dish the puck...AND GET TO THE NET.

I would think you would get a nice $2-2.5 mill player back and a prospect and or pick...Big centers are in demand.
- Al

If thhe Hawks make that trade before 7/1 they could resign Ladd too

If (IF) cap space is the most important return - is there enough of a market for AA at $4.5MM so that Stan won't have to take back too much bad paper of retain too much salary?
- StLBravesFan

He shouldn't have to retain anything...Big 2 way- 2nd line center. AA is a vg players but if the aim is to save another 2-2.5 mill and or to sign another player......I trade AA above anyone else.

Indeed, except for the loan her out part. Her 9 posts a year aren't enough as is.
- Mr Ricochet

Sorry, I tend to spread my posting out to multiple places in season, though summer can be more open.

Also, talking about stats is like waving a red flag to me.

You don't think Seabrook would have goten as much or more on the open market?
- Al

Open market value is rarely a good deal or results in a good contract. The long deals UFA get usually end up being anchors. I think that is just the nature of the business. You have to overpay and worry about the implications later.

If thhe Hawks make that trade before 7/1 they could resign Ladd too
- mrpaulish

Maybe... but Campbell and someone else...

Open market value is rarely a good deal or results in a good contract. The long deals UFA get usually end up being anchors. I think that is just the nature of the business. You have to overpay and worry about the implications later.
- breadbag

Your idea about paying for future performance not past performance is logical and should be followed...But not the case when players are just entering their prime and have already won 3 Cups.

He shouldn't have to retain anything...Big 2 way- 2nd line center. AA is a vg players but if the aim is to save another 2-2.5 mill and or to sign another player......I trade AA above anyone else.
- Al

Completely agree. Kane/Panarin could do a lot with just someone who plays a simple game and doesn't have the price tag.

Call me crazy, but I would try Rasmussen in that slot. He is okay at the dot, big body, and can get to the net. He isn't a star, but he could hold down the role and probably not hurt the line while the Hawks spend money on depth elsewhere.

Your idea about paying for future performance not past performance is logical and should be followed...But not the case when players are just entering their prime and have already won 3 Cups.
- Al

It's one thing to saddle yourself with a contract while re-upping one of your players, it's quite another to give up assets for that privelidged.

Yeah, I don't disagree... Although I was impressed during the playoffs, I don't love him as 1LW at all (at 3LW I think he can bring a lot of value)... I was moreso making a statement that I have come to grips with the fact that a real 1LW signing is looking less likely... I think that some size would be nice and I could see him inserted there (and I suppose we can hope that Kane and Toews play together and make their line mate better) because we have less options but that is certainly not the "fix" to our 1LW issues... I think we end up seeing the lack of wings to play w/ 19 mitigated by breaking up PAK... Who knows maybe I'll be pleasantly surprised
- Frenchy4488

Frenchy,
Just posted Campbell is pretty much a done deal, IF Bowman could convince a kid like Jamie McGinn to come to Chicago ,selling him on the fact that he could possibly seize the opportunity to play with 19 ,that is if Q don't J ag him o ff, and Brian Campbell signed, I'd be happy with those 2, then if there is any room left, you go dumpster divin for the UnQualified guys like Percy or????. I'm coming to grips that Brouwer, Lucic, Ladd are forbidden territory. But McGinn is the key.
Then I would really like it if Hartman and McNeill both forced the issue and also made the team, I think then we have a nice blend. Q would then have to for a change be forced to lighten up and coach instead of just calling out lines to hop over the boards.

We won 3 cups without a true "2C". AA is perfect for that role, but I personally don't feel he is essential.

Also, (somewhat related) would Panarin have more, the same, or less points without Kane across from him? Split those two up and go something like Kruger-Kane-Panik, or Kruger-Hossa-Panarin, I think you have both more balanced scoring and better D.

JJ with the early evening brain teaser!
- Chunk

Yes they have, but remember they still had people like Sharp, Saad, Shaw and Oduya on those teams, not anymore. Add Keith and Seabs have more miles on them now and even with Panarin on this Hawks version the scales are still tipped heavily to those other clubs.

She posts more logic, fact and common sense in 9 posts than most of us do in 900 posts.
- DarthKane

Agreed, but I can only comprehend 4-1/2 of them.

Your idea about paying for future performance not past performance is logical and should be followed...But not the case when players are just entering their prime and have already won 3 Cups.
- Al

That is the truth. The Hawks are victims of their own success in a lot of ways. This team is still going to hit a real rough patch when the core gets another 4-5 years older. I'm curious to see if they will go with a full rebuild when the time comes, or try to limp along in mediocrity like Detroit has been doing. Refusing to actually rebuild and just keep falling short of real contender status.

It's one thing to saddle yourself with a contract while re-upping one of your players, it's quite another to give up assets for that privelidged.
- Jeropotato

Hawks have no choice but to dump younger players who are good values...No way around it when you dedicate so much cap space toward 7 players.

Goal is to win Cups and there is always a price to pay.

That is the truth. The Hawks are victims of their own success in a lot of ways. This team is still going to hit a real rough patch when the core gets another 4-5 years older. I'm curious to see if they will go with a full rebuild when the time comes, or try to limp along in mediocrity like Detroit has been doing. Refusing to actually rebuild and just keep falling short of real contender status.
- breadbag

Depends if limping into the future still means making the playoffs like Detroit continues to do.

I don't quite get the push to get rid of AA, 42pts out of a 2nd line center isn't bad. Besides that he was always in front of the net blinding goalies. Seems like teams had a hard time moving him out of the crease. Have to wonder how many goals were scored where he didn't get any credit but his presence in front of the goalie played a big role.

Or a fourth possibility Vadim Shipachyov.
- Dabearshawks

From your lips to Stan's ears.

Make it happen DBH!

Hawks have no choice but to dump younger players who are good values...No way around it when you dedicate so much cap space toward 7 players.

Goal is to win Cups and there is always a price to pay.
- Al

Agreed, but the salary is worth more to the Hawks than anyone else for 2 reasons:
1. The 'Thank You' money for past performance ( worth nothing to anyone else).
2. You didn't give up any extra assets to get him.

I am in no way criticizing the Hawks for paying him that, just stating that other teams interest in paying that salary is somewhat less.