Karlsson was robbed...He'll come back harder with a chip on his shoulder.

Some notes from Dorion today:

Zibanejad - "in the best shape he's ever seen him."
That's pretty good to hear. If true.

He also said Zibanejad was a player teams asked about most.

Chabot - "He's someone that could definitely battle for a job when training camp comes around."

Seems possible, but I'm wondering if he spends a year in the AHL.

Chiasson/Wiercioch - "It's no secret that both players would like to refresh their careers with other organizations "

No shock there....

Buddy Robinson resigns a two way deal. Okay.

You realize that in order to block shots, or take the puck away, that means your team doesn't have the puck. The Kings had the puck more than any other team in the NHL. Of course Doughty is going to have fewer blocked shots and takeaways.
- tkecanuck341

So what you're saying is that his numbers are the result of him playing on a much better team.....not of him being a better player. Got it

Karlsson got robbed. to me simply based of stats and how they played all year it should have been #1 Karlsson #2 BB and #3 DD

Some notes from Dorion today:

Zibanejad - "in the best shape he's ever seen him."
That's pretty good to hear. If true.

He also said Zibanejad was a player teams asked about most.

Chabot - "He's someone that could definitely battle for a job when training camp comes around."

Seems possible, but I'm wondering if he spends a year in the AHL.

Chiasson/Wiercioch - "It's no secret that both players would like to refresh their careers with other organizations "

No shock there....

Buddy Robinson resigns a two way deal. Okay.
- MaxTLimit

Nothing too shocking here. I'm still hoping Dorian moves the 12th overall pick for a more NHL ready player.

I'd also like to see the Sens bring in Kerby Rychel out of Columbus. He's demanded a trade and is a young player who has some potential. He's also a left winger who potentially could crack the top 9 or even top 6. I don't think moving the 1st rounder for him is a great idea (but he was a 19th overall pick in 2013, so maybe it wouldn't be too far fetched), but another package might be able to do it. He's an NHL ready prospect.

While I have my wish list, it seems Dorian is poised to have a quiet day tomorrow.

So what you're saying is that his numbers are the result of him playing on a much better team.....not of him being a better player. Got it
- sensarmy_11

something tells me this

his numbers are the result of him playing on a much better team

will be the answer to every point and counter point... As I said earlier, don't take it personal unless Karlsson had told you that he'd give you the trophy to place on your mantle if he won the Norris in 2016.

Erik Karlsson is truly a once in a lifetime offensive defenseman. Nobody comes even remotely close to his capabilities in terms of goal/point scoring. Just as Doughty is light years beyond Karlsson when it comes to being defensively responsible and competent. They aren't even in the same stratosphere when it comes to anything not related to points and goals. For people that value the so called fancy stats, this genuinely wasn't even much of a competition. Burns and Karlssons styles are going to be indirectly or directly responsible for nearly as many goals against as they score. Doughty will always be 25-30 points behind those types of players year after year, just as he'll end up significantly ahead in the only stat that SHOULD matter the most in his net plus stats for goals for and goals against generated while he's affecting play. This year may have finally seen a turn towards the position being evaluated in a more mature perspective. Might not be the 'sexy' choice, but it's certainly the more relevant one.

Oilers have asked the Sens what they would be willing to give up for either RNH or Hall.
It sounds like if they land Subban they want to move salary out.

Another case of a player getting an award that he deserved in the wrong season.....Kopitar was another example, was better in other seasons but the voters loved Bergeron until the decline of the Bruins became more pronounced.

Can't judge Karlsson since I rarely saw him last season, but Doughty was most impressive last season for the massive number of minutes he sucked up, as Sutter could rarely find a 3rd defensive pair and sometimes a 2nd pair he trusted. As far as offensive numbers, Doughty could contribute a lot more in a different system, but the Sutter system definitely holds him back.

But no doubt the WJC gold medal, 2 Olympic golds and 2 Stanley Cup rings hanging off the guy were probably the deciding factor....can attest that of the two Cups won by LA, the key factor in the Finals was that the Kings had Doughty and the other team did not.

Another case of a player getting an award that he deserved in the wrong season.....Kopitar was another example, was better in other seasons but the voters loved Bergeron until the decline of the Bruins became more pronounced.

Can't judge Karlsson since I rarely saw him last season, but Doughty was most impressive last season for the massive number of minutes he sucked up, as Sutter could rarely find a 3rd defensive pair and sometimes a 2nd pair he trusted. As far as offensive numbers, Doughty could contribute a lot more in a different system, but the Sutter system definitely holds him back.

But no doubt the WJC gold medal, 2 Olympic golds and 2 Stanley Cup rings hanging off the guy were probably the deciding factor....can attest that of the two Cups won by LA, the key factor in the Finals was that the Kings had Doughty and the other team did not.
- jkaflagg

Yes, everybody understands that he gets the lifetime achievement award

Oilers have asked the Sens what they would be willing to give up for either RNH or Hall.
It sounds like if they land Subban they want to move salary out.
- Cup 06

Hard to believe Hall would not be part of the deal for Subban. Unless Montreal asked for Draisaitl which I would prefer over Hall.

Not sure NuHop (at his salary) is a value added acquisition over the much lower costing Ottawa centres.

I would do Hoffman+ for Hall but the salary saving for the Oil would not be significant enough to make a deal work.

Ottawa won't do Ceci.

Do you have an insight as to the player that might work or is targeted. Or is this just a shotgun blast by the Oil trolling for interest?

Oilers have asked the Sens what they would be willing to give up for either RNH or Hall.
It sounds like if they land Subban they want to move salary out.
- Cup 06

Really? Source? Interested in reading more about this...

Nothing too shocking here. I'm still hoping Dorian moves the 12th overall pick for a more NHL ready player.
- Gord_Wilson_2.0

Unfortunately, it sounds unlikely.

I'd also like to see the Sens bring in Kerby Rychel out of Columbus. He's demanded a trade and is a young player who has some potential. He's also a left winger who potentially could crack the top 9 or even top 6. I don't think moving the 1st rounder for him is a great idea (but he was a 19th overall pick in 2013, so maybe it wouldn't be too far fetched), but another package might be able to do it. He's an NHL ready prospect.
- Gord_Wilson_2.0

Less interested in a straight up 12 for him, but parts could be moved to balance things. I certainly don't like Hoffman for Rychel. But I doubt that would happen.

Saw this:

#NHL RUMORS:
• Source, the Hurricanes are entertaining offers on Jeff Skinner. MTL is interested. Move up in Draft?
- The Hockey Press®
‏@TheHockeyPress

Since it seems like Sens are losing Hoffman...or moving him, I'd like to see them in on Skinner. But, I've already said that.

So what you're saying is that his numbers are the result of him playing on a much better team.....not of him being a better player. Got it
- sensarmy_11

No, what I'm saying is that there are no individual statistics that your can look at that will tell you who is better.

Sounds like Habs are collecting calls for PK but price is sky high. Sort of dumbfounded why you'd move him and why you'd expect a giant package after a subpar season with a contract about to get locked down with a no trade.

Sounds like the Avs could make a move to shake up the roster. Not sure if they would move Duchene or McKinnon, but you never know. Personally, I think they will move Barrie if they do make a move at all. There have been Sens/Avs discussions before. They aren't afraid to talk a deal, even if nothing happens. Cue DDM-Coga to come in and shoot down any talk.

As MaxTLimit said, it looks like Skinner could be moved. Earlier in the year he seemed like a guy who wouldn't be moved unless the Canes provided a prospect or kept salary due to his contract and slow start. Now it seems Skinner is a good bargaining chip for the Canes. He'd certainly help solidify the top 6 if brought in.

I wouldn't worry too much on the Hoffman front. Negotiations take time. Ceci isn't signed yet either. With that said, it wouldn't shock me if Hoffman was moved, but I feel if there is a deal, we will be on the loosing end.

LOL. That's perfectly fine. We will keep Karlsson and you can keep doughty let's trade thoughts later.
- PtotheY

Doughty has 2 cups with him being a major factor. Karlsson can't get his team anywhere near the Cup.

I'll take Doughty and in fact Keith over Karlsson any day of the week

Doughty has 2 cups with him being a major factor. Karlsson can't get his team anywhere near the Cup.

I'll take Doughty and in fact Keith over Karlsson any day of the week
- KINGS67

I'll take karlsson and Keith over doughty any day of the week.......what's your point?

"The James Norris Memorial Trophy is an annual award given to the defenseman who demonstrates throughout the season the greatest all-round ability in the position. "
Not who had the best season, or who played better defense or offense. Karlsson didn't win it this year, did you lose out on some bonus money? some Sens fans are taking this as a personal insult...
- Stu17

And since Jake Muzzin had 30 more blocked shots and more takeaways than Doughty on the same always with the puck team, I guess we conclude that Doughty didn't really try defensively and shouldn't have got the trophy.

Or maybe the best place to look might be head to head games to see how the match up went, where Doughty was 0 points and -4 in 2 games, whereas the undeserving Karlsson was 1G 2A +2.

Anyways, I'm sure there were plenty of hidden intangibles, outside of points, defensive stats and head to head...

1. Toronto - Auston Matthews
2. Winnipeg - Patrik Laine
3. Columbus - Jesse Puljujärvi
4. Edmonton? - Matthew Tkachuk,
5. Vancouver?
6. Calgary -
7. Arizona -
8. Buffalo? - ---- Pierre-Luc Dubois, Alex Nylander, Olli Juolevi will certainly be gone in top 10 in my opinion ---

Michael McLeod could jump up to be taking outside the top 7; or he stays available for Sens. Kind of like a Ryan Kesler or Mike Fisher comparable. Offensive output a concern at NHL level.

9. Montreal - Logan Brown - not stone but hard to imagine he's there for Sens
10. Colorado - Clayton Keller - him and Brown can rotate. MAYBE 1 falls
11. New Jersey - If any of the above fall then they scoop; otherwise Tyson Jost

I would say there is a 80% chance the Sens will take one of Tyson Jost, Jacob Chychrun, Jake Bean, or Michael McLeod. Something tells me Jost or McLeod will land in Ottawa. One guy I didn't mention is Mikhail Sergachyov, who will likely go after top 7 but before Ottawa very likely.

IF Mika Zibanejad was being traded this week - it would have to result in a true #1 center coming in.

The fact remains that #1 centers are either traded for (rare) - Seguin, Johansen - or they almost HAVE to be drafted in round 1 and a lot of the time in the top 10.

Three 'center' pieces - Zibanejad, Lazar, White.
Thomas Chabot and this 12th overall pick are also interest trade bait.

I'll take karlsson and Keith over doughty any day of the week.......what's your point?
- sensarmy_11

Thank god your opinion doesn't mean poop.... By the way doughty is a younger Keith. You're just mad cause the only trophy you'll ever see won is the Norris.

Thank god your opinion doesn't mean poop.... By the way doughty is a younger Keith. You're just mad cause the only trophy you'll ever see won is the Norris.
- KINGS67

I forgot that YOUR opinion is gospel...

Thank god your opinion doesn't mean poop.... By the way doughty is a younger Keith. You're just mad cause the only trophy you'll ever see won is the Norris.
- KINGS67

by "younger keith" you mean a dman who isn't as talented as karlsson but was just lucky to play on a stacked team.....got it

so....who you guys hoping to draft tonight, assuming we pick 12th.

i'm hoping to land Chychrun....that will give us quite a big of organizational depth on the blueline.

Erik Karlsson is truly a once in a lifetime offensive defenseman. Nobody comes even remotely close to his capabilities in terms of goal/point scoring. Just as Doughty is light years beyond Karlsson when it comes to being defensively responsible and competent. They aren't even in the same stratosphere when it comes to anything not related to points and goals. For people that value the so called fancy stats, this genuinely wasn't even much of a competition. Burns and Karlssons styles are going to be indirectly or directly responsible for nearly as many goals against as they score. Doughty will always be 25-30 points behind those types of players year after year, just as he'll end up significantly ahead in the only stat that SHOULD matter the most in his net plus stats for goals for and goals against generated while he's affecting play. This year may have finally seen a turn towards the position being evaluated in a more mature perspective. Might not be the 'sexy' choice, but it's certainly the more relevant one.
- Woodysdemise

Super inaccurate, but I am sure that you read that somewhere so I guess you can't be faulted for believing it.