Only if the team around them pulls the weight. This year was the proof. After the deadline trades, we all thought Hawks were the team to beat, but we saw the 1st round exit. Tazer and Kaner pulled their weight, others did not. This is why we lost. Hockey is a team game, one or two players never decide teh outcome; they can ignite the team to perform with their performance as they have done during the 3 cup wins, but the rest has to follow.

BTW, Crawford won the finals in 2013 and should have been finals MVP, hands down!
- Nerko77

Crawford was probably BETTER in 2014 .... his play v St. Louis was outstanding, it went to brilliant levels against the Wild and was quite good against the Kings considering he was getting run over (while if we sniffed on Quick it was a penalty).

I think with the two of them, it wasn't a case of pay for past performance only. They wouldn't have gotten as much money without that past, sure. But, they've won another Cup since the signing. And, given their ages and relative talent level at the time of the signing, you'd expect them to keep performing at a very high level as they were both entering their prime. Isn't that what we are saying we wish StanBo would do? Pay for likely future output?
- pdx2ord

Again, I think the TEAM won those Cups, not the individuals. Hossa, Keith, Seabrook, Sharp, Byfuglien, Hjallmarsson, Crawford, Saad, Oduya, Campbell, Ladd, Frolik, Versteeg, and the list goes on and on. You could argue that Keith and Hossa have been equally as important to the 3 Stanley Cup championships as 19+88. Moving forward 19+88 will be more vital, but Keith and Hossa make 50% of 19+88. Who is the better value? It is what it is at this point. Can't go back on the deals and StanBo needs to figure out a way to make it work.

I just remember thinking after 2015 that there was NO WAY the Hawks dont win at least 1-2 more Cups with this Core. At this point, can anyone sit here today, looking at the current roster, prospect pool, and impending cap crunch next summer.....and say that even 1 more Cup is a sure thing? I'm a dozen beers deep, but the false projections of the Salary Cap during the summer of 2014 by Gary Bettman and Co. have saddled the Hawks with two inflated contracts, and severely limited the Hawks chances of icing a complete roster. Combine that with StanBo's generous contract extensions for role players (bickell + Kruger specifically) and TWT what this team can do during the next 5 years....

How they are constructed. Yes the CURRENT model (kick the can a year down the road, hemhorrage some talent and reload as best as possible year after, year, after year is set up where you can't lose a,b or c. But is that model sustainable in the Hawks' eyes, is it changing (good Lord they are talking about a 9.5 mil player), if so at what speed (timeline) and/or have they decided to change to core? If so how?

I don't even know what question to ask cuz I don't see the model as sustainable. When I look for players to add in some hypothetical I look for anyone who might play for a million, cuz that's based in reality, the math insists on it.

How other way is their to attack roster losses, ie "get less worse", or define a successful NHL franchise's goals from year to year? STL is getting less worse this year, DAL is getting less worse this year, TB is getting less worse this year, NYR is getting less worse this year, ANA is getting less worse this year and this will hit any and EVERY team that has any kind of success at least every other year. Unfortunately it's not even arguable.

I'm not advocating moving out player a,b or c nor am I advocating not. Cuz I don't know what a sustainable model is but I sure as hell hope the Hawks do.
- Mr Ricochet

Lot of teams feeling the wrath of the cap either this offseason or next. That's one reason why it's so hard to put a finger on which model or team blueprint is the most efficient or the best at dealing the hand you're dealt while trying to become less worse. The cap is the killer here. Unfortunately, it's hard to say who has to go or who the market is "hot" for. It has to be a larger salary - not just these petty small salaries because the large ones are too many for this team and crippling it. So maybe it is Seabrook or Crawford, or a combination of AA, Shaw, Kruger. They should subtract the piece that they feel is the most easily replaced and will deal the least damage. Lucic or Ladd would be ideal, but another big contract is not going to help one bit. Tomorrow will probably show 2 or 3 of those 5 above gone. Hopefully, Stan can garner a 1st rounder, take back little to no salary, and address the depth we will inevitably lose. The deals will start trickling in tomorrow for sure.

Two Hall of Famers - 3 Cups (2 at the time they signed) - still only 26/27, lots of productive years left....

Tell the greedy owners to loosen the cap restrictions and lower ticket prices so the average fan can afford to go to games, to forego the $500MM expansion windfall and instead relocate failing franchises to cities that might actually result in increased revenues and caps. Not sure why the players are expected to act out of loyalty by giving hometown discounts when everyone else connected with the league can just maximize their revenues

Don't object to two of the best players in the league getting paid like it - players who produced and achieved the "one goal" three times.

Yeah, it hurts to be in this cap situation every year, but enough with demeaning Toews and Kane - pay them and deal with it.
- StLBravesFan

DING DING DING !!!!

Toews and Kane would have gotten a whole lot more on the open market .and imagine the outrage on this board if they left ..

DING DING DING !!!!

Toews and Kane would have gotten a whole lot more on the open market .and imagine the outrage on this board if they left ..

- oldduffman

They are the highest paid players in the NHL by $1mllion each. More than Sidney Crosby who has averaged nearly 100 points/season over his career. How exactly could they have gotten any more as UFAs? They got paid at TOP dollar, like every Stan Bowman signing with the exception of Niklas Hjallmarsson.

They are the highest paid players in the NHL by $1mllion each. More than Sidney Crosby who has averaged nearly 100 points/season over his career. How exactly could they have gotten any more as UFAs? They got paid at TOP dollar, like every Stan Bowman signing with the exception of Niklas Hjallmarsson.
- EnzoD

Im with EnzoD here. Bowman gambled early on a rising cap instead of playing a little hardball and he got cornholed

Do you really think any team would have offered more than $10.5 each, one million more than the highest league cap hit at the time with the knowledge the cap was stagnating and the canadian dollar falling?

Listen, I know Bowman was trying to be proactive and ahead of the curve, but he bit it hard here. I am eternally grateful for the 3 cups they gave us and I know there is a marketing value here too in keeping them, but he gambles here and it came up snake eyes.

Brisson licked his chops and leverages the relationship of TWO clients with 3 cups on the same team and basically had the nuclear option of shop one, shop both. Bowman got scared and lost the mans game. period

They are the highest paid players in the NHL by $1mllion each. More than Sidney Crosby who has averaged nearly 100 points/season over his career. How exactly could they have gotten any more as UFAs? They got paid at TOP dollar, like every Stan Bowman signing with the exception of Niklas Hjallmarsson.
- EnzoD

1/2 million when Kopitars new contract kicks in

and realistically, not the highest paid players if Stamkos goes to free agency

1/2 million when Kopitars new contract kicks in

and realistically, not the highest paid players if Stamkos goes to free agency
- Slofire94

He is talking at the time, not moving forward.

At the time Malkin and OV were the highest cap hits at $9.5 mil

Britain actually voted to leave the EU. Question is, does their market crashing (it is) drag Canada's down with it?

Britain actually voted to leave the EU. Question is, does their market crashing (it is) drag Canada's down with it?
- pdx2ord

It is dragging all world markets down. Japan has suspended trading

Kempny is you're #4 Dman. Whatever needs done to extend Panarin. At least two rookies in the bottom 6, including Rasmussen as a rookie. Motte makes the cut. Panik will be in the top 6 (no other choice). Schmaltz starts in Rockford. The vets (core) come back hungry. One of Shaw or Kruger are gone. Crow is your goalie.
- Mr Ricochet

If Motte makes it so will Schmaltz. Schmaltz is a special player

Im with EnzoD here. Bowman gambled early on a rising cap instead of playing a little hardball and he got cornholed

Do you really think any team would have offered more than $10.5 each, one million more than the highest league cap hit at the time with the knowledge the cap was stagnating and the canadian dollar falling?

Listen, I know Bowman was trying to be proactive and ahead of the curve, but he bit it hard here. I am eternally grateful for the 3 cups they gave us and I know there is a marketing value here too in keeping them, but he gambles here and it came up snake eyes.

Brisson licked his chops and leverages the relationship of TWO clients with 3 cups on the same team and basically had the nuclear option of shop one, shop both. Bowman got scared and lost the mans game. period
- hawkeytalkman

DING DING DING....

It is dragging all world markets down. Japan has suspended trading
- Marlowe

Oh I thought I read the Yen was surging. Damn.

Of course this wasn't a question last year but this next year it would be, Saad or Panarin? Who do you keep?
- Mr Ricochet

Well i'd obviously say Panarin. He's working out A LOT this off season.

Oh I thought I read the Yen was surging. Damn.
- pdx2ord

Yen and dollar (and gold) are up but markets are all down. Last DOW future I saw was down more than 3% and I just read in the NYTimes that they are expecting a 700 point drop at open.

Saad bc he can kill penalties and is more physical. Saad could have been the Conn Smythe trophy winner from 2015 and is younger than Panarin.
- EnzoD

Something about watching a kid develop. Of course I didn't see him step by step but saw him once, maybe twice, with the NTDP as a U-18 in Bensenville. Noticed him easily as his speed was evident and he had good size. Straight north-south speed, no zig and kinda stiff hands....... Off to Major Junior and next I see him as a Hawk and so much more developed. Told me the kid is coachable and will work, all I ask for.

It is dragging all world markets down. Japan has suspended trading
- Marlowe

The Loonie is getting pounded.

Panarin, I think. It appears that Panarin has that Kane-skill of making those around him better players and I don't know that Saad is as good of a play-maker
- maria_wyeth

No right no wrong in this choice. I can see someone making a case that there are so few power forwards with Saad's speed/skill/size package. Can also make an easy argument that Panarin has 80-90 point skill and finish that doesn't rely on pure finesse, of course we've only seen him for one year.

The Loonie is getting pounded.
- Lido_Shuffle

Good thing we got a committed cap number before today. Ugh.

Good thing we got a committed cap number before today. Ugh.
- pdx2ord

THIS^

May be apocryphal, but:

Ed Lopat - a terrific pitcher for the terrific Yankee teams of the late 40s/early 50s - asked for a salary increase after a pretty good season - the GM told him he hadn't won twenty games in a season yet - he would get a big increase when he did.

So - next season he did - and the GM said (you can guess) - can't give you the big increase - how do we know you can do it again?

Certainly, with Toews and Kane, you can assume THEY will do it again.
- StLBravesFan

Reminds me of Old Charles Comiskey telling Big Ed Walsh no raise until you win 30. Next season he's at 29 with one start left and Kid Gleason(?) wouldn't let him make his last start or two to win the 30th, no raise. I might be off a bit but that's the story.

Wife used to complain about players making so much money so I had her watch Eight Men Out with me. Now she understands............

To all of you "hometown discount" people...will you please come work for me? I can't wait for you to make me a lot of money and then [frank] you on the back end.

If Motte makes it so will Schmaltz. Schmaltz is a special player
- Dabearshawks

Have the UND-Quinippiac and UND-Omaha-Nebraska on DVR and rewatched both this last week. No doubt Schmaltz has improved his game. ......

Two different players and roles they can fill. I just think what will be asked of Motte considering his skill set and body type he's the better bet to stick as a rookie.

Of course we haven't seen camp yet so time will tell.

Lot of teams feeling the wrath of the cap either this offseason or next. That's one reason why it's so hard to put a finger on which model or team blueprint is the most efficient or the best at dealing the hand you're dealt while trying to become less worse. The cap is the killer here. Unfortunately, it's hard to say who has to go or who the market is "hot" for. It has to be a larger salary - not just these petty small salaries because the large ones are too many for this team and crippling it. So maybe it is Seabrook or Crawford, or a combination of AA, Shaw, Kruger. They should subtract the piece that they feel is the most easily replaced and will deal the least damage. Lucic or Ladd would be ideal, but another big contract is not going to help one bit. Tomorrow will probably show 2 or 3 of those 5 above gone. Hopefully, Stan can garner a 1st rounder, take back little to no salary, and address the depth we will inevitably lose. The deals will start trickling in tomorrow for sure.
- 93Joe

Probably an over simplification Joe but I guess there is no wrong and no right, and that's my point. Lotta fans posting you can't move this guy or that guy and my stance is you can and that depends on the model going forward and have they "internally" changed the One Goal motto.

JJ makes a great point about slowly sliding into mediocrity as the Wings have. It will happen unless you stop it, question is how and when. Add to that the cap and expansion probably TWICE in the next few years and it's enough to make a fan nuts and management manic.

They are the highest paid players in the NHL by $1mllion each. More than Sidney Crosby who has averaged nearly 100 points/season over his career. How exactly could they have gotten any more as UFAs? They got paid at TOP dollar, like every Stan Bowman signing with the exception of Niklas Hjallmarsson.
- EnzoD

And do you think that if Crosby were a free agent he wouldn't be getting a bigger contract? Not everyone's contract is up at the same time. If Crosby, Toews, Kane, Stamkos, and Ovechkin were all free right now, they would all be at or above 10.5. You can't look at contracts in a vacuum.

The best players are going to be paid the most. Be happy we have so many good ones. Would you rather be Carolina or Vancouver and have a bunch of cap space?

Boston, Chicago, LA, Pitt,what do they all have in common? Cups and cap problems. I'll take it all day long.