The only thing i saw was during the Cup celebration. He looked like a guy who didn't want to be there. I love Fleury, and would have no problem with him being here in October, but man, did he look like he wanted nothing to do with that celebration.
- cap1681

He's just human and seems normal to feel left out, he was the guy for years.

Why not ask for the 6th? Because it's insulting, and offputting, as the article said. Even in a normal scenario, MAF is nowhere worth anything near the 6th overall. That 6th can get you Tkachuk, PLD, Nylander, Juolevi...
Factor in the fact that there's 1 team looking for a goalie (Dallas can't afford MAF), and many teams with more than 1 goalie they like, Penguins really don't have much leverage.
Worst case scenario for Flames: We buy James Reimer for just money. Completely average goaltender, but average > 30th place SV%.
Worst case for Pens: You bank on another team's star goalie to absolutely suck/get injured for the season and take a 'good but not great' goalie's $6 million cap hit. It doesn't happen, and he walks for free.

Not to mention, you don't need an elite goalie to win the cup, depending on the team you put in front of him.
- Bradlee3

But I don't think you win a cup with the James Reimer's / Tomas Greiss's of the world, and I dont think you win a cup with Ben Bishop making $7-8M either. Former are just nothing above average and the latter is not elite enough for that money. Unless you have a young star on ELC, Fleury is in the sweet spot, imo.

Why not ask for the 6th? Because it's insulting, and offputting, as the article said. Even in a normal scenario, MAF is nowhere worth anything near the 6th overall. That 6th can get you Tkachuk, PLD, Nylander, Juolevi...
Factor in the fact that there's 1 team looking for a goalie (Dallas can't afford MAF), and many teams with more than 1 goalie they like, Penguins really don't have much leverage.
Worst case scenario for Flames: We buy James Reimer for just money. Completely average goaltender, but average > 30th place SV%.
Worst case for Pens: You bank on another team's star goalie to absolutely suck/get injured for the season and take a 'good but not great' goalie's $6 million cap hit. It doesn't happen, and he walks for free.
- BobHartley

This is my thinking. When you barter, you start off high, but when you're trying to sell a Chinese jersey in a Cancun marketplace you don't ask $1000 for it. You ask for something just outside reasonable, maybe $50, and go from there. Pissing off your customer is a receipt for disaster and it doesn't look like there will be a bidding war for MAF. Only the Flames have been officially tied to him and they've also been officially tied to Bishop as well. We can't afford to piss off Calgary.

Lehtonen is 5.9 mill a year.....Fleury and Murray are under 6.5 combined...think about that for a minute.
- MattStrat

Yeah but we cant keep both because of the expansion draft and not enough PT for both so we need to get over this notion of keeping him here any longer than we have to. It's not fair to him to have to constantly be asked about where he's getting traded to. It's not fair to have him playing backup minutes and it's not fair to Murray to have him splitting time when he should be proving that he can handle starters minutes. It creates desension in the locker room and it's purely selfish. So let's all just get over the fact that Fleury still a Penguin on opening night will cause more problems than any thing else and let's let him get on with his life.

This is my thinking. When you barter, you start off high, but when you're trying to sell a Chinese jersey in a Cancun marketplace you don't ask $1000 for it. You ask for something just outside reasonable, maybe $50, and go from there. Pissing off your customer is a receipt for disaster and it doesn't look like there will be a bidding war for MAF. Only the Flames have been officially tied to him and they've also been officially tied to Bishop as well. We can't afford to piss off Calgary.
- Victoro311

I still think fleury is the best option ...cheaper than bishop ...better than Reimer ...it's just too perfect of a fit

Maybe one could look at Pitt asking for the 6th and than cgy making it known they are moving on to bishop as just each side going back and forth in bargaining ...

All this talk about winning the cup and just keeping the band together for next year. I say B.S.

Staying too loyal or paying to much for mediocre talent just because they won a cup is a good way to take a regression.

Keep trying to improve, don't get too loyal to Ben Love$joy or Schultz, sign a big free agent if you have the cap space, sell high if you need to.

Penguins schedule released. Most interesting thing is they play a night game on New Years Eve at home, then have a whole week off.

I think a big aspect of this situation getting over looked is Murray's pending RFA status, if he is as good as many think he is then is it really that unrealistic a team would throw an offer sheet at Murray that the Pens couldn't match. As it stands right now a team could go as high as a little over 7M on an offer and only give up a 1st, 2nd & 3rd round pick and by looking at some of the trades and deals being given out right now offering Murray a deal around 7y-48M could be realistic and giving up a 1st, 2nd & 3rd round would essentially be a steal for a 23yo elite franchise goalie.

There really wouldn't be a worse case scenario than moving Fleury in a poor market to protect Murray from the expansion draft and then losing Murray before the draft anyway to an offer sheet they can't match.

Why not ask for the 6th? Because it's insulting, and offputting, as the article said. Even in a normal scenario, MAF is nowhere worth anything near the 6th overall. That 6th can get you Tkachuk, PLD, Nylander, Juolevi...
Factor in the fact that there's 1 team looking for a goalie (Dallas can't afford MAF), and many teams with more than 1 goalie they like, Penguins really don't have much leverage.
Worst case scenario for Flames: We buy James Reimer for just money. Completely average goaltender, but average > 30th place SV%.
Worst case for Pens: You bank on another team's star goalie to absolutely suck/get injured for the season and take a 'good but not great' goalie's $6 million cap hit. It doesn't happen, and he walks for free.
- BobHartley

You had Reimer level goaltending last year, how did that work out? MAF was an Allstar last year and had the best statistical year of his career. Big schism between he and Reimer. If we take one of Dallas' goalies back we will get more for them than we will from you. I can see Buffalo coveting him as well. And you can take Bishop who you will have to overpay to get and overpay more to keep. Fine with us.

Why did Rickon run in a straight line? Had he zig zagged things would have been different....Makes no sense!

Why did Rickon run in a straight line? Had he zig zagged things would have been different....Makes no sense!
- sammy87

Again with the spoilers. You're heartless.

Also watch Apocalypto. Your strategy has been tried for limited success

You had Reimer level goaltending last year, how did that work out? MAF was an Allstar last year and had the best statistical year of his career. Big schism between he and Reimer. If we take one of Dallas' goalies back we will get more for them than we will from you. I can see Buffalo coveting him as well. And you can take Bishop who you will have to overpay to get and overpay more to keep. Fine with us.
- Dcoms

Buffalo isn't in the goalie market. They gave up a lot for Lehner and Lehner was good when healthy last year. Buffalo and Edmonton will not be giving up on Lehner and Talbot any time soon.

Rarely agree with this dude, but both of these takes seem accurate to me.

Dan Kingerski ‏@Budmoonshine 1h1 hour ago
Don't get too worried about "Buyer's Market" for Fleury... Half dozen good teams w/ mediocre G's under contract. One will get aggressive.

Dan Kingerski ‏@Budmoonshine 4h4 hours ago
Jim Nill (Dallas GM): So, Fleury?
GMJR: Top 6 forward and a pick
JN: But...
GMJR: Then sign a FA. I can wait.

Yeah but we cant keep both because of the expansion draft and not enough PT for both so we need to get over this notion of keeping him here any longer than we have to. It's not fair to him to have to constantly be asked about where he's getting traded to. It's not fair to have him playing backup minutes and it's not fair to Murray to have him splitting time when he should be proving that he can handle starters minutes. It creates desension in the locker room and it's purely selfish. So let's all just get over the fact that Fleury still a Penguin on opening night will cause more problems than any thing else and let's let him get on with his life.
- Dcoms

The only thing that will be hurt by Fleury being on the opening day roster is fans egos for thinking the actually have any clue as to what goes on inside locker rooms and on benches. There's absolutely no way to know how either player will feel about the situation to suggest their will be dissension in the locker room, there was no problems or dissension in the locker room during the playoffs when Murray was starting and Fleury was on the bench full time so there's actually more evidence that it won't be a problem than there is that a problem will exist.

I still think fleury is the best option ...cheaper than bishop ...better than Reimer ...it's just too perfect of a fit

Maybe one could look at Pitt asking for the 6th and than cgy making it known they are moving on to bishop as just each side going back and forth in bargaining ...
- Redmile247

I'm sure JR is getting crickets with his 6OA request. Lets face it, Calgary is more than MAF away from being contender. The 6OA is way more valuable to this franchise than 2 years of good goaltending. If I'm BT, I see if I can send a bag of pucks over to SJ so they can talk with Reimer. If nothing else, that would get Pitts attention.

All this talk about winning the cup and just keeping the band together for next year. I say B.S.

Staying too loyal or paying to much for mediocre talent just because they won a cup is a good way to take a regression.

Keep trying to improve, don't get too loyal to Ben Love$joy or Schultz, sign a big free agent if you have the cap space, sell high if you need to.
- YouMeAndDupuis9

All about not staying loyal, but that's more so when it comes to extensions. This year we don't have anyone to extend so we can bring the band back to together. Next year is decision time.

Rutherford is going down a dangerous path! He has no leverage and has the gull to ask for a 6th overall pick for a 31yr old goalie making 5.75 for the next 3 yrs and has had 2 concussions! I wouldn't be surprised if Treliving is still laughing from that conversation. The most I would offer for Flower is a mid 2nd and a middle prospect at which point Rutherford should give Treliving a big hug and say thank you so much!

Rarely agree with this dude, but both of these takes seem accurate to me.

Dan Kingerski ‏@Budmoonshine 1h1 hour ago
Don't get too worried about "Buyer's Market" for Fleury... Half dozen good teams w/ mediocre G's under contract. One will get aggressive.

Dan Kingerski ‏@Budmoonshine 4h4 hours ago
Jim Nill (Dallas GM): So, Fleury?
GMJR: Top 6 forward and a pick
JN: But...
GMJR: Then sign a FA. I can wait.
- YouMeAndDupuis9

Waiting sucks... JR could die of old age any minute now

Penguins schedule released. Most interesting thing is they play a night game on New Years Eve at home, then have a whole week off.
- cap1681

Next year all teams have a "bye week".

Waiting sucks... JR could die of old age any minute now
- Guile

It is the same in that you are betting against the odds on a variable that has a much lower likelihood of playing out ie injury or another goalie struggling. Who is to say the opposite doesnt happen and other teams end up with multiple goalies performing above average so more goalies are available via trade as opposed to more teams in need of a goalie in your scenario. You can't negotiate based off unknowns, only the available information.

He is not more valuable on our roster if waiting means one of the 3 options I previously posted get forced to play out. In that instance, his added "depth" effectively has a negative value by forcing us to do a buyout, give up assets to get rid of him, or losing Murray.

The whole Fleury thing has literally nothing to do with depth. It is 100% asset management. There is no way we gain leverage by waiting assuming nothing else changes. As I pointed out, Calgary would be best suited waiting us out if they were smart.
- Rawdog9755

I'm not betting on anything. I am saying that he doesn't need to be dealt now.

I'm saying that the likelyhood that other possibilities that do not exits right now but will exist at some point before a decision needs to be made about his situation, is better than you think.

How many scenarios are there to deal MAF now...most people think 1 or 2.

You are telling me there won't be 1 or two more between now and the expansion...come on now.

There are 3 reasons to move him 1) He wants out 2) Cap Issues 3) we will lose him in expansion (for nothing)

1) He does not appear to want out...not yet. Perhaps he wants to try and win his starting job back, who knows.

2) The cap is supposedly going to be around $73M...so it sounds like we'll be okay there

So that leaves expansion...and there is still time to prepare for that.

In the meantime, you could start the season with two goalies that have won a Stanley Cup...just saying...

Next year all teams have a "bye week".
- acdc1206

The thing I like most is there are only 4 or 5 day games scheduled as of now.

You had Reimer level goaltending last year, how did that work out? MAF was an Allstar last year and had the best statistical year of his career. Big schism between he and Reimer. If we take one of Dallas' goalies back we will get more for them than we will from you. I can see Buffalo coveting him as well. And you can take Bishop who you will have to overpay to get and overpay more to keep. Fine with us.
- Dcoms

We didn't have Reimer level goaltending, we had the WORST goaltending the league, and by a good margin. Take a moment to read the article comparing Reimer to MAF. There's really not much a difference. Except one does not cost a franking 6th overall. Reimer is free, and cheap. MAF is aging, good but not great, and $6mil. It's not like the Flames has Oiler D. We have 10 top D, easily.

No other team is in the goalie buying market. Last point, we spent $9mil last season on trash goaltending. I'm personally ok with spending $7mil on Vezina-goaltending.

This is my thinking. When you barter, you start off high, but when you're trying to sell a Chinese jersey in a Cancun marketplace you don't ask $1000 for it. You ask for something just outside reasonable, maybe $50, and go from there. Pissing off your customer is a receipt for disaster and it doesn't look like there will be a bidding war for MAF. Only the Flames have been officially tied to him and they've also been officially tied to Bishop as well. We can't afford to piss off Calgary.
- Victoro311

come on Fleury isn't a chinese jersey. He's closer to Schneider than a Chinese Jersey. If two 2nd's are fair then theres no reason not to ask for the 6th. Maybe they counter and ask for pouliot included. He's regarded as about the 10th best goalie in the NHL.