You just proved my point. You claim HE beat Washington and HE beat TB & SJ but HE didn't beat those teams, the Pens beat those teams because they were the better team in each of those series, HE didn't single-handedly beat any of those teams. HE played well but was lucky/gifted enough to be playing behind the best team.
- jaydogg1974

It's a team sport. Which team did Martin Jones beat all by himself? And if the Penguins weren't so prone to giving up their leads by taking their foot off the gas late in the second to the beginning of the third maybe Murrays save pct is much higher. Which goalie ever single handedly won a playoff series except maybe Ron Hextall in 87?

This guys is just obsessed with trying to make Murray out as some Johnny come lately when he's succeeded at every level and improved year in and year out. Murray makes it look easier than it is because he's so calm but he's always playing the right angles and always playing the right position. Yes he has work to do but he's also a lot further ahead than most goalies are at his age and experience level. And the Penguins playing "flawless hockey" narative he keeps repeating is pure BS, they did play well no question but far from flawless. Murray was what he had to be. MAF just hasn't been, you can argue the team in front of him wasn't always as good but not always.
- Dcoms

Never winning a championship at an level is considered succeeding at every level? Again I apologize for actually wanting players to prove themselves before I proclaim them a God.

I also don't recall using the word flawless but if I did it wasn't often, I did however say the team in front of him was dominant which is exactly what they were when they were the better team in almost every game they played, at 1 point outshooting their opponent in 12 straight games.

I view Murray as better than Jarry and I view Fleury as a expensive luxury. He gets traded we clear up salary cap and could still add. Also Murray was a rookie and didn't lose more than he won. Sullivan wanted to go to Fleury and he was shaky. Yes he missed time but shaky is how I feel when Fleury is in net during the postseason. I appreciate all Fleury has done here but he also has concussion concerns and plays a position where you will be getting hit in the head.

Murray is the future and Fleury is the past.
- lloyd095

Totally fair on all counts

It's a team sport. Which team did Martin Jones beat all by himself? And if the Penguins weren't so prone to giving up their leads by taking their foot off the gas late in the second to the beginning of the third maybe Murrays save pct is much higher. Which goalie ever single handedly won a playoff series except maybe Ron Hextall in 87?
- Dcoms

None and None, exactly what I said, it's a team game so Murray didn't beat anyone as the original poster said, the Pens beat Wash, TB and SJ.

Next years goalie mkt could be a tough one. Part of the reason I'm ok keeping fleury this year. Buffalo and toronto could enter the goalie mkt before the expansion draft. Expansion team is like to select 3 quality goalies who fit into low end starters or top back ups.
- sditulli

It's too risky. They can't risk losing Murray in the expansion draft and the closer they get to it the less leverage they have. Right now in a Fleury trade the Penguins have the upper hand, next year it could come down to them having to give up a high pick or a good prospect to get a team to take Fleury.

He has to go through waivers now so he can't just go up and down and if he's getting paid to be on the NHL roster he's not going to be playing in the AHL. But we ll see where he is at the beginning of the season since I'm always wrong I'm sure he ll be one WHS(and yes that is sarcasm)
- Dcoms

Your such a yammering sphincter that you can't even process what your trying to refute, I never said Wilson would be sent down, I point blank said he would start the season on the NHL roster. I just pointed out that you had no clue(as usual) as to why because you claimed he couldn't go down because he signed a 1 way deal which as I said is 100% incorrect.

Your such a yammering sphincter that you can't even process what your trying to refute, I never said Wilson would be sent down, I point blank said he would start the season on the NHL roster. I just pointed out that you had no clue(as usual) as to why because you claimed he couldn't go down because he signed a 1 way deal which as I said is 100% incorrect.
- jaydogg1974

Go lay down before your head explodes, like I read every word you write. I don't see you as any kind of expert on anything.

Go lay down before your head explodes, like I read every word you write. I don't see you as any kind of expert on anything.
- Dcoms

savage

Never winning a championship at an level is considered succeeding at every level? Again I apologize for actually wanting players to prove themselves before I proclaim them a God.

I also don't recall using the word flawless but if I did it wasn't often, I did however say the team in front of him was dominant which is exactly what they were when they were the better team in almost every game they played, at 1 point outshooting their opponent in 12 straight games.
- jaydogg1974

Well he lead a team full of rookies and nobodys into the OHL playoffs. A team that had no business being in the playoffs if not for him. He won every award he was eligible ffor except MVP as a rookie in the AHL and played 305 minutes of shutout hockey, a record that will stand a long time. He has no championships because hockey is a team sport and he never played on a championship caliber team. As far as individually goes though he's succeeded at every level he's played.

Go lay down before your head explodes, like I read every word you write. I don't see you as any kind of expert on anything.
- Dcoms

Oh snap!

Go lay down before your head explodes, like I read every word you write. I don't see you as any kind of expert on anything.
- Dcoms

You probably should have, you could have learned something. maybe you should go back to telling us all how Pouliot is already a top 25 Dman in the league, you were much better in that one.

Never winning a championship at an level is considered succeeding at every level? Again I apologize for actually wanting players to prove themselves before I proclaim them a God.

I also don't recall using the word flawless but if I did it wasn't often, I did however say the team in front of him was dominant which is exactly what they were when they were the better team in almost every game they played, at 1 point outshooting their opponent in 12 straight games.
- jaydogg1974

Michael Jordan awful basketball player. Couldn't even make his high school team

Well he lead a team full of rookies and nobodys into the OHL playoffs. A team that had no business being in the playoffs if not for him. He won every award he was eligible ffor except MVP as a rookie in the AHL and played 305 minutes of shutout hockey, a record that will stand a long time. He has no championships because hockey is a team sport and he never played on a championship caliber team. As far as individually goes though he's succeeded at every level he's played.
- Dcoms

So now we've gone from he's succeeded at every level to he succeeded last year? Should have just opened with that because that was correct and I would have agreed.

Michael Jordan awful basketball player. Couldn't even make his high school team
- sditulli

That's a shame sditulli, you're actually an intelligent person i thought you could do better.

Malkin is going nowhere. Nowhere.

I hate to read a few (very few, maybe a couple) idiots trying to trade him after a Cup.

If anything we just learned that the 3 LINE FORMULA works!

Trade Flower and re-sign Schultz, Cullen and bring a top 6 fwd for Geno.

I really just don't understand how there's an argument on this subject. What we saw in the ECF and SCF was Murr's floor. The cat had been let out of the bag on Murray and guys knew to shoot high glove side on him and make him move from side to side to beat him. The opposition was trying to exploit Murray's weaknesses with regularity after the Caps series, so I don't think Murray's ever going to preform at a lower level than that. If you don't think that floor is something we can win with and can't understand the importance of cap space and/or plugging a roster hole either at LW or defense depth, then I honestly don't know what to say to you.

The only way Murray gets traded instead of Flower is if there's not a MAF deal on the table that helps us AND we get a laugher deal for Murray.

I really just don't understand how there's an argument on this subject. What we saw in the ECF and SCF was Murr's floor. The cat had been let out of the bag on Murray and guys knew to shoot high glove side on him and make him move from side to side to beat him. The opposition was trying to exploit Murray's weaknesses with regularity after the Caps series, so I don't think Murray's ever going to preform at a lower level than that. If you don't think that floor is something we can win with and can't understand the importance of cap space and/or plugging a roster hole either at LW or defense depth, then I honestly don't know what to say to you.

The only way Murray gets traded instead of Flower is if there's not a MAF deal on the table that helps us AND we get a laugher deal for Murray.
- Victoro311

I think its funny people put that as his ceiling... hes not been with a top tier NHL goalie coach yet for long stretches of time (I will assume he got some in training camp this year). Teaching someone to hug a post better, and be a bit more patient before going butterfly are not groundbreaking mechanical changes.

You know what is as impactful as the fleury situation? The malkin situation. If he's hurt till January or February what does that do to our cap? If malkin is on ir for half the season then we have a ton of cap room.

You know what is as impactful as the fleury situation? The malkin situation. If he's hurt till January or February what does that do to our cap? If malkin is on ir for half the season then we have a ton of cap room.
- sditulli

I am sure JR has that in mind. But gotta find out if he needs TJ first

The bickering and Richard measuring that goes on at this board makes it pretty well unreadable. Discuss and debate, but for god sakes, at least try and be respectful to one another, we are all Pens fans here.

The bickering and Richard measuring that goes on at this board makes it pretty well unreadable. Discuss and debate, but for god sakes, at least try and be respectful to one another, we are all Pens fans here.
- Willaged

Amen, bro.

Malkin to the Wild.... EK 47 level rumor
- Guile

Tomorrow, Phoenix and then another place the next day.

If its Minnesota and Pittsburgh is trading him, the Wild had better start with Coyle and Dumba.

I have no idea how this unfolds regarding Malkin, but Minnesota makes more sense than LA and Chicago.

The bickering and Richard measuring that goes on at this board makes it pretty well unreadable. Discuss and debate, but for god sakes, at least try and be respectful to one another, we are all Pens fans here.
- Willaged

*notable exception for Sammy

But yes, I agree.

how about flower for sam bennett and a pick? or flower for the lower of their #1's and a prospect? Ian cole for brian elliot?

random trade of the day...since Ek got the Pit/Min juices flowing (lol)...

Pouliot for Zucker

edit: just saw Zucker is an RFA. maybe a sign and trade... I dunno throwing something semi realistic out there.