Now that's good thinking. He's a guy whose value could actually be more at the deadline than now. Why trade him for spare parts or draft picks now when you could make a move at the deadline, possibly to pick up whatever pieces are needed for the Cup run.
- hardnosed

It's a risk that may end up giving Flower away, but we would have him as a security to see how Muzza goes starting next season, as well as trading him at or before the deadline for more. JR is a Kenny Rogers fan isn't he? What's that song......the Gambler!

Fleury isnt worth the 6th overall pick, Im there with you. But I dont like the idea of picking up Frolik in exchange for him. Good player and all but no thanks on that 4/$4.3M contract. Id rather get some kind of prospect & pick package and use the cap space to sign a UFA.

Id rather:
Fleury, 2nd + mid range prospect for #6.
Fleury for Calgary 2nd.

Important to remember also, while Murray was very solid for the Pens, he lost more games for the Pens than he won. The Pens team D made his job much easier than any other goalie in the playoffs. There is always the option of moving Murray and having Jarry develop for another couple years under Fleury. Not saying that is the right move but if someone blows your socks off you have to consider it.
- MacPatty

I agree with the team D making Murray's job much easier. That's what I was telling that LA troll who was whining that Murray didn't get the Conn Smythe. Pittsburgh has NEVER played that level of team D. Never. If that drops off, I can't say I'm 100% confident that Murray (at this point) can cover for the decline in defense.

I know it won't be popular, but If I'm Ruth, I listen to every option. If someone blows your socks off for Murray, I'd consider it.

Actually, players can waive their NMC and be exposed to the expansion draft.
- cap1681

And there is no guarantee MAF will do this.

So, you would rather lose Murray in the expansion draft for nothing so you can keep Fleury in case of injury or sophomore slump? We wouldn't lose Fleury in that draft ... it would be Murray and that would be worse than trading MAF for Frolik. Neither good, but one certainly worse.
- Oneonta Penguin

I'm going to wait until I see the official expansion rules before assuming that Murray will draft eligible and that Fleury will have to be protected. Saw a bunch of articles yesterday stating that the expansion rules bandied about are not what the final rules will look like.

I agree with the team D making Murray's job much easier. That's what I was telling that LA troll who was whining that Murray didn't get the Conn Smythe. Pittsburgh has NEVER played that level of team D. Never. If that drops off, I can't say I'm 100% confident that Murray (at this point) can cover for the decline in defense.

I know it won't be popular, but If I'm Ruth, I listen to every option. If someone blows your socks off for Murray, I'd consider it.
- madmike71

I'd rather have cap space than not have cap space, but I agree. Especially if Fleury proves too hard to move. Fleury is still a starting goalie in this league, and Jarry has the pedigree to one day be one. We're not completely F'ed if we're forced to move Murr instead, and if the package is fantastic, it would be easier to stomach losing him.

And there is no guarantee MAF will do this.
- Victoro311

True, but it's worth exploring. I think he knows the situation, and if he wants one last year as a Penguin, opting to nullify his NMC (is that possible to do without a trade???) would be the option.

If Murray could get you #6, I say go for that...Fleury is good for at least 2-3 more years, and Jarry is developing well too. There are other ways to drop salary, like trading Cole and/or Daley for picks. #6 is likely going to be a young winger with a lot of upside, and PIT may even get creative and package the pick with a player(s) to move up with EDM to get #4 or even #3, which would help both short and long-term cap situation, plus simultaneously start building up a core of younger players to lead the team in 3-4 years.

It's a risk that may end up giving Flower away, but we would have him as a security to see how Muzza goes starting next season, as well as trading him at or before the deadline for more. JR is a Kenny Rogers fan isn't he? What's that song......the Gambler!
- Aussiepenguin

I'd rather trade Fleury, then sign a capable back-up to split starts with Murray. There are a bunch of guys on the UFA market that would fill that role, and save the Pens a bunch of money on the cap.

Reimer, Khudobin, Enroth, Montoya to name a few.

True, but it's worth exploring. I think he knows the situation, and if he wants one last year as a Penguin, opting to nullify his NMC (is that possible to do without a trade???) would be the option.
- jmatchett383

There can be a gentleman's agreement in place for Flower to wave his NMC for the draft when the time comes, but I doubt that would be officially reported and that would drive me up the wall going through an entire year under the impression we're gonna lose Murray if MAF isn't moved.

I'd rather have cap space than not have cap space, but I agree. Especially if Fleury proves too hard to move. Fleury is still a starting goalie in this league, and Jarry has the pedigree to one day be one. We're not completely F'ed if we're forced to move Murr instead, and if the package is fantastic, it would be easier to stomach losing him.
- Victoro311

It's actually pretty enticing. Murray would bring a big return, a useful return. Instead of filler.

Murray could become an All Star, or his lack of a glove hand could really expose him in a full season next year, especially if the defense in front of him is not playing playoff style hockey in November.

if Matt Murray gets you #6 overall then you do that deal. you go get a guy you can have developed and ready to go in 3 years time in the draft or sign as a free agent... maybe you trade for that goalchie, but whatever happens, you trade Murray for 6OA!!...

If Murray could get you #6, I say go for that...Fleury is good for at least 2-3 more years, and Jarry is developing well too. There are other ways to drop salary, like trading Cole and/or Daley for picks. #6 is likely going to be a young winger with a lot of upside, and PIT may even get creative and package the pick with a player(s) to move up with EDM to get #4 or even #3, which would help both short and long-term cap situation, plus simultaneously start building up a core of younger players to lead the team in 3-4 years.
- mventres

Why do the Pens need a top 10 pick??? I don't understand this. If the pick isn't in the top 3, any player picked most likely won't be ready for 2-3 years. Those will be years that the Pens will be in the thick of competing for another Cup. Would rather have a NHL ready player that will be able to help this team now.

There can be a gentleman's agreement in place for Flower to wave his NMC for the draft when the time comes, but I doubt that would be officially reported and that would drive me up the wall going through an entire year under the impression we're gonna lose Murray if MAF isn't moved.
- Victoro311

I've never heard of a player waiving his NMC except to accept a trade, and the NMC usually accompanies the trade. I'm not 100% sure that you can just tear it up on a whim.

True, but it's worth exploring. I think he knows the situation, and if he wants one last year as a Penguin, opting to nullify his NMC (is that possible to do without a trade???) would be the option.
- jmatchett383

It is true...if he wanted to do this he potentially could do it, certainly risky though

I've never heard of a player waiving his NMC except to accept a trade, and the NMC usually accompanies the trade. I'm not 100% sure that you can just tear it up on a whim.
- jmatchett383

The acquiring team has the option to void it or keep it

It's actually pretty enticing. Murray would bring a big return, a useful return. Instead of filler.

Murray could become an All Star, or his lack of a glove hand could really expose him in a full season next year, especially if the defense in front of him is not playing playoff style hockey in November.
- hardnosed

Exactly what I'm thinking. That glove hand is....well....not great at the moment. I don't want to take anything away from him, but he really only had to stand on his head a couple of games in the playoffs. Only one complete game that I can think of.

56th!

Great quotes from clean out day

The acquiring team has the option to void it or keep it
- YuenglingJagr

Right...but can you nullify it on the spot without a trade? I'm not really sure.

Frolik would be a nice add to this team. He is a good 2 way player who can play with speed and chip in offensively. He gives you more of that depth in the forward position that was a huge factor in winning the Cup, plus frees up 1.4M in cap space. He would also makes Kunitz expendable.
- cap1681

Kunitz is a better player than Frolik. Hands down. Id rather roll with Rust on an ELC than Frolik on his contract.

I think everyone is underestimating the value of a true #1 goalie. Having a steady goalie makes every other player on the ice look better.

Take Carolina. Can you really build a young, talented D core in front of a goalie who cant consistently stop the puck?

Calgary gave up the most goals against last year despite investing heavily in their D. That looks bad on the GM and it is all due to poor goaltending. They need to make the playoffs next year.

If Toronto wants to start winning they will need someone much better than Bernier to right the ship.

That is 3 teams I count that really need goaltending and stability. I also count 3 talented goalies, (Fleury, Bishop and Andersen) that are available. Bishop might be a bit better but he only has 1 year left and then he is going to take a monster contract to re-sign. Fleury is the best option on the market for a team looking to stabalize their net for the next few years.

It's actually pretty enticing. Murray would bring a big return, a useful return. Instead of filler.

Murray could become an All Star, or his lack of a glove hand could really expose him in a full season next year, especially if the defense in front of him is not playing playoff style hockey in November.
- hardnosed

The thing is, that even though we are fine cap wise, we still need cap space. If Murray is moved, he needs to bring back an extremely impactful piece on an ELC (top 6 wing/top 4 d man). Thinking about Calgary, we'd have to make damn sure that whoever we get with 6th overall is NHL ready. Or, if we went Murray for Bennett, would we be happy with that?

I'd rather avoid trading Murray, but what makes us happy if that were to hypothetically happen? Definitely needs to be high end.

speaking of the haul one would get for Murray.... what kinda haul are we talking?

Jarry is a only a few years in the making.

Id almost hold on to him for one more year if you dont get a solid offer

Many goalies have had one great year, just to falter when handed the reins. Why not keep MAF as a backup plan, even if he only gets 30 starts atleast he is there

doesnt seem to be a sour backup guy

Id almost hold on to him for one more year if you dont get a solid offer

Many goalies have had one great year, just to falter when handed the reins. Why not keep MAF as a backup plan, even if he only gets 30 starts atleast he is there

doesnt seem to be a sour backup guy
- nightmare3020

It's a good option, but a risky one.

Why do the Pens need a top 10 pick??? I don't understand this. If the pick isn't in the top 3, any player picked most likely won't be ready for 2-3 years. Those will be years that the Pens will be in the thick of competing for another Cup. Would rather have a NHL ready player that will be able to help this team now.
- cap1681

Because in 3 years Crosby will be 32 and Malkin will be 33. The Pens need to ensure they have some LEGIT home grown top 6 players in the pipeline. If you can get to #6 without compromising your starting lineup you have a chance to do that. If trading one of your two starting goalies does that it is just good asset management.