Honestly use to be a bigger fan of this teams FO. Last summer we are forced to trade Saad because of the cap (Most of us in agreement that Bicks contract was a large reason why) and so he is gone. Fine turn the page to this year and we are tight for money again (as expected obviously) and we are willing to give up TT to dump bickell to resign SHAW! Why wouldnt we do that a year ago for Saad. Obviously a better player than Shaw is. If all that was just to resign a depth and honestly expendable player when we could have done the same thing a year ago for Saad than I have lost faith in the front office. Now if they resign Ladd instead then I am for it. But if all that you give up TT, Sharp, Johns, all to make more cap space and you say we are going to trade saad rather than trade Shaw a year later. Like what shaw brings but high energy and gritty players are not hard to find. Goal scorers like Saad are.

Didn't you guys hear, you're trading for Malkin because he wants out of PGH so he can be "the guy"................
- cap1681

For Malkin to be "the guy" in Chicago wouldn't Keith, Toews, and Kane need to go back to Pitt?

I think I'd pass on that if I were Stan. Of course, after the Sharp and Daley trade who knows what he is thinking?

Questions for StanBo? If Ron Hextall can get another 2nd round pick based on games played in the playoffs for Kimmo Timmonen WHY couldn't you ask for something similar for Trevor Daley? Maybe if you did you wouldn't have to replace picks along with cap space at such an expensive price? Let's not forget that today's trade was essentially a 1st rounder plus Bickell for a 2nd and a 3rd.

And the 2nd 2nd rounder you gave up for RunsBAD turned into Christian Dvorak. Mokena product and now one of the top prospects outside of the NHL. Wouldn't it have been nice to see Dvorak competing for LW this year?

Your memory serves you correctly. McIntyre will play in the DEL next season. Additionally, McIntyre was horrid in his short stint in Rockford late last season.

As for the Hildebrand signing, I'll bet he's depth that will be stashed in Indy this coming season.
- EKB13

Hildebrand was 1st team All American. Could be more than depth.

Honestly use to be a bigger fan of this teams FO. Last summer we are forced to trade Saad because of the cap (Most of us in agreement that Bicks contract was a large reason why) and so he is gone. Fine turn the page to this year and we are tight for money again (as expected obviously) and we are willing to give up TT to dump bickell to resign SHAW! Why wouldnt we do that a year ago for Saad. Obviously a better player than Shaw is. If all that was just to resign a depth and honestly expandable player when we could have done the same thing a year ago for Saad than I have lost faith in the front office. Now if they resign Ladd instead then I am for it. But if all that you give up TT, Sharp, Johns, all to make more cap space and you say we are going to trade saad rather than trade Shaw a year later. Like what shaw brings but high energy and gritty players are not hard to find. Goal scorers like Saad are.
- kevndevries

Panarin will be a longer term better addition than Saad.

Can't keep everyone when everyone wants to get paid.

For Malkin to be "the guy" in Chicago wouldn't Keith, Toews, and Kane need to go back to Pitt?

I think I'd pass on that if I were Stan. Of course, after the Sharp and Daley trade who knows what he is thinking?

Questions for StanBo? If Ron Hextall can get another 2nd round pick based on games played in the playoffs for Kimmo Timmonen WHY couldn't you ask for something similar for Trevor Daley? Maybe if you did you wouldn't have to replace picks along with cap space at such an expensive price? Let's not forget that today's trade was essentially a 1st rounder plus Bickell for a 2nd and a 3rd.

And the 2nd 2nd rounder you gave up for RunsBAD turned into Christian Dvorak. Mokena product and now one of the top prospects outside of the NHL. Wouldn't it have been nice to see Dvorak competing for LW this year?
- tredbrta

Stan took the cap savings by the Pens absorbing the entire Daley contract and 1/3 of Scuderi's contract. The trade clearly favored the Pens in the end, but you're not getting salary retention and picks back in that trade. Plus, at that time, the Pens were in a really bad spot and the Hawks were much higher seated. It was more realistic that the Pens were going to miss the playoffs than they were going to make a long run - so it was probably not even considered.

Panarin will be a longer term better addition than Saad.

Can't keep everyone when everyone wants to get paid.
- Return of the Roar

That's a pretty bold prediction. Panarin will almost certainly put up more points than Saad, but Saad is an upper-tier all around player who is still developing. If Panarin puts up points like last year, he will be at minimum be looking at the same ballpark contract as Saad, if not more. I like both players a lot, but to say Panarin will be better is a 50/50 guess at best right now.

Panarin will be a longer term better addition than Saad.

Can't keep everyone when everyone wants to get paid.
- Return of the Roar

I dont disagree but we would have both of them. We just wouldnt have Anisimov and honestly Brad Richards might still be the 2C. If the hawks would have offered Saad 5.5 million for 6 years he would have taken it. Thats just a million more than Anisimov now. Maybe you cant pay seabrook quite so much to make up for a little of that? Maybe you get Kruger for 3 flat? Hindsight is 20/20 but they could have seen this coming because Bickell wasnt going anywhere. I think you could have had the same top 6 minus Anisimov and plus Saad locked up and under the cap.

Canes fan here. I think it's a win-win trade. Canes get closer to cap floor and a young forward that I'd expect will get more minutes than he did in Chicago(more production). Chicago gets 2 draft picks and more importantly cap relief. So on the surface it's fairly even. When I look at the whole picture(through my red tinted glasses) the 2nd Rd is NYR and the third is Chi from Versteeg trade and it makes me more impressed with what Ron Francis has done. He's essentially traded Jake Massie, Drew McIntyre, 5th Rd in 17, and Eric Staal for Nordstrom, Zykov, TT, Bickel's contract, Saarela, and a 2nd Rd in 17. So 3 throw ins and Staal for all that.

Crow for Hamonic may make sense for both clubs.
- fattybeef

My TT for Harmonic made sense back in January, but then again we would stiull have Bickell...

You might be right. However, there really isn't much in the way of "competition" for Zawaski. Nobody really covers Hockey on the radio or TV side other than the company shills, or newspaper beat guys who will never go out on a limb for fear of being cut off completely. Kuc, Lazerus, Meyers, Konroyd, Boyle, etc., etc. etc. None of them will ever say anything but what they have been Ok'ed to say. Nothing controversial. With no regular outlet to stir the pot if needed, Zawaski may just be the guy.
- TheTrob

Lazerus did say he thinks the Hawks will regret this trade, but that was on his twitter, and generally he falls right in line like the rest them

So in essence, you have to look at the deal as a 2nd and 3rd for TT. My opinion, it's a win. Guy wasn't playing top 6 minutes.



As far the Hawks playing the FA market, if they can acquire Nielsen somehow, that is a HUGE pickup. I have watched my fair share of Nielsen here on the Island and I can tell you he should be a top, top player on every teams list.
- purepone

Exactly, exactly, exactly!! I was getting out of the car for a dr appointment and caught the end of super smooth, super fly, super hip Jason Goff mention Bickell and TT to CAR for a 2nd and a 7th. Had to run and couldn't listen anymore but thought I wonder how much of the Bickell cap did StanBowPops&McD have to eat? But i liked what I heard.

Get home and see it's not a 7th but a 3rd and they retain no money. I thought a 2nd and 7th with no retention was excellent. I'm giddy............By the way the 2nd I guess was the pick the Canes got from NYR, the 50th overall.

As you mention it's TT for a 2nd and 3rd. Now if TT were to have a pedestrian year and they have to move him after this season do they get a 2nd and 3rd with no anchor?

Is moving Bickell money to sign a Shaw or Panarin worth gambling TT's ceiling is a top 6 C or W at 60-65 points, 3 zone play, above 50% FO, stay healthy and consistent and a PP and PK mainstay? Even assuming TT is all of the above he'll want to be paid and would you rather Shaw or Panarin over the very top of TT's ceiling, and again would you take that chance in a hard cap world?

Best case scenario. TT ends up a 40-45 point perimeter player and the money used goes toward signing a Shaw or Panarin and the 2nd or 3rd ends up a useful bottom 6 guy or a 4/5 Dman.

Worst case scenario TT ends up a 3 way 2C with 55-60 point numbers and Shaw or Panarin and the 2nd and 3rd bust.

Very hard to see how the Hawks lose here.

And yea Franz Nielsen is really underrated. A true 3 way 2nd line C with 55 point numbers and plays a solid PP and PK. Something one would hope TT could grow into. ......Guy is solid and steady.

At least we have a second round pick now (#50) and there could be a decent player drafted there. I'd like to see the team take Tyler Benson.

My TT for Harmonic made sense back in January, but then again we would stiull have Bickell...
- wiz1901

Well at this point, with the trade that just went down and Kempny in the fold on D I think we need another top 9 forward. And this is with Shaw staying.

Stan took the cap savings by the Pens absorbing the entire Daley contract and 1/3 of Scuderi's contract. The trade clearly favored the Pens in the end, but you're not getting salary retention and picks back in that trade. Plus, at that time, the Pens were in a really bad spot and the Hawks were much higher seated. It was more realistic that the Pens were going to miss the playoffs than they were going to make a long run - so it was probably not even considered.
- mw630

None of that is relevant to the point. When trading an asset (Daley) you so obviously valued higher months earlier you could have easily structured an additional pick or picks into the back end based on TOI or games played. It could have easily gone both ways (he could have agreed to pay extra if Scuderi excelled here). Call it insurance for both sides. Not a complex concept.

For a GM widely considered an advanced stats and cap guru - many of Bowman's trades look pretty clueless. Particularly those of the last 18 months.

Danault and a SECOND rounder for 2 rentals? That is a 1st and 2nd rounder for a PTO player in Fleishmann and a slumping Weise? Why not make that 2nd rounder conditional?

Sharp and JOHNS for Garbutt and Daley but Nill retains on Garbutt only? Why doesn't Johns give Bowman any leverage at all? Is this a fire sale? Require the retained be on Daley or a prospect back... or a pick based on Johns TOI in the playoffs.

TT (a 1st rounder) for a 2nd and 3rd plus $4m plus in cap space makes more sense BUT even here a performance based pick could easily be added.... say TT reaches 60 points then a 2nd rounder is added.

For having such a large front office the Hawks keep things very, very basic.... and player development? How about the whole "Dano is a right wing only - even in the AHL" mantra in the front office? So obviously a mistake we could see it in the 300 level.

Thought I had read Hamonic had backed off his trade demand, and here it is...

http://www.newsday.com/sp...-trade-request-1.11782625

Well at this point, with the trade that just went down and Kempny in the fold on D I think we need another top 9 forward. And this is with Shaw staying.
- z1990z

I'd like to see Jaime McGinn brought in. The defense still needs an upgrade IMO. Kempny has never played in the NHL before. I just think that it might be good to tame expectations on him.

None of that is relevant to the point. When trading an asset (Daley) you so obviously valued higher months earlier you could have easily structured an additional pick or picks into the back end based on TOI or games played. It could have easily gone both ways (he could have agreed to pay extra if Scuderi excelled here). Call it insurance for both sides. Not a complex concept.

For a GM widely considered an advanced stats and cap guru - many of Bowman's trades look pretty clueless. Particularly those of the last 18 months.

Danault and a SECOND rounder for 2 rentals? That is a 1st and 2nd rounder for a PTO player in Fleishmann and a slumping Weise? Why not make that 2nd rounder conditional?

Sharp and JOHNS for Garbutt and Daley but Nill retains on Garbutt only? Why doesn't Johns give Bowman any leverage at all? Is this a fire sale? Require the retained be on Daley or a prospect back... or a pick based on Johns TOI in the playoffs.

TT (a 1st rounder) for a 2nd and 3rd plus $4m plus in cap space makes more sense BUT even here a performance based pick could easily be added.... say TT reaches 60 points then a 2nd rounder is added.

For having such a large front office the Hawks keep things very, very basic.... and player development? How about the whole "Dano is a right wing only - even in the AHL" mantra in the front office? So obviously a mistake we could see it in the 300 level.
- tredbrta

To add to this.... wasn't the Timo trade made with a condition based on his play/how far we got. Since we won the Cup and he played a certain number of games it became two 2nds?

At least we have a second round pick now (#50) and there could be a decent player drafted there. I'd like to see the team take Tyler Benson.
- DarthKane

I agree, I have been watching Tyler for years, living in Edmonton when he was breaking all of the scoring records with the Southside Athletic Club.

Canes fan here. I think it's a win-win trade. Canes get closer to cap floor and a young forward that I'd expect will get more minutes than he did in Chicago(more production). Chicago gets 2 draft picks and more importantly cap relief. So on the surface it's fairly even. When I look at the whole picture(through my red tinted glasses) the 2nd Rd is NYR and the third is Chi from Versteeg trade and it makes me more impressed with what Ron Francis has done. He's essentially traded Jake Massie, Drew McIntyre, 5th Rd in 17, and Eric Staal for Nordstrom, Zykov, TT, Bickel's contract, Saarela, and a 2nd Rd in 17. So 3 throw ins and Staal for all that.
- Wolfpack5

I watch a lot of Canes hockey. I like the two guys who call the game and the guy with the soap opera name is astute even accounting for having to "sell" the Canes. Most don't know, I do cuz I had Ward and Lack in fantasy hockey last year, that this group gave up the 5-6th least amount of shots last year. That's goooood.

I like the young group, especially the defense (Slavin is my guy), and that they have bought in, are structured and coachable.

And speaking of coach I think Peters is a much better option than hard ass winningest coach ever Q to get the most out of a TT. He'll be more of a developer and patient. As mentioned that young group is structured and that doesn't just happen and ain't easy.

You'll read 189 scouting reports from hawk fans on TT but not one will say the kid ain't skilled. Best of luck to the kid.

I dont disagree but we would have both of them. We just wouldnt have Anisimov and honestly Brad Richards might still be the 2C. If the hawks would have offered Saad 5.5 million for 6 years he would have taken it. Thats just a million more than Anisimov now. Maybe you cant pay seabrook quite so much to make up for a little of that? Maybe you get Kruger for 3 flat? Hindsight is 20/20 but they could have seen this coming because Bickell wasnt going anywhere. I think you could have had the same top 6 minus Anisimov and plus Saad locked up and under the cap.
- kevndevries

I don't know if that's true. I was under the impression the Hawks offered 5m and his agent wouldn't take below 6. According to Saad he wasn't involved in the negotiations at all and if his agent/dad were standing firm at 6 I don't know that the extra .5 would have swayed them. If Saad himself had been a part of the negotiations things could have ended up quite differently

I don't know if that's true. I was under the impression the Hawks offered 5m and his agent wouldn't take below 6. According to Saad he wasn't involved in the negotiations at all and if his agent/dad were standing firm at 6 I don't know that the extra .5 would have swayed them. If Saad himself had been a part of the negotiations things could have ended up quite differently
- maria_wyeth

If Saad chose not to be part and is unhappy, then he can enjoy his $6M each year with CLB, watching the playoffs from his couch starting mid-April. I couldn't care less anymore.

To add to this.... wasn't the Timo trade made with a condition based on his play/how far we got. Since we won the Cup and he played a certain number of games it became two 2nds?
- bhawks2241

Yes, it was. Pretty easy for Stan to copy when he traded Daley. Even if he had to reciprocate in some way. I see the Hawks giving up extra picks quite frequently. If anything, considering their draft position, they should be seeking as many extra picks as possible - even if they are lower round picks.

If Saad chose not to be part and is unhappy, then he can enjoy his $6M each year with CLB, watching the playoffs from his couch starting mid-April. I couldn't care less anymore.
- blackhawk24

Yeah, and who knows if it's even accurate. When Saad first said it I assumed he was trying to not look greedy after he said he'd consider a hometown discount and then didn't. "Oh well I wasn't involved and was really surprised to find out about this" sounds better than "I didn't mean it when I said I would take a discount, and my dad and agent assured me the Hawks would give me whatever I was asking for."

Both of those are silly when a totally legitimate reason is "I am young and in a sport where I am potentially one injury away from ending my career so I need to ensure my financial security now"

He got his money but is playing for CBJ, and the Hawks spent all season trying to replace him

None of that is relevant to the point. When trading an asset (Daley) you so obviously valued higher months earlier you could have easily structured an additional pick or picks into the back end based on TOI or games played. It could have easily gone both ways (he could have agreed to pay extra if Scuderi excelled here). Call it insurance for both sides. Not a complex concept.

For a GM widely considered an advanced stats and cap guru - many of Bowman's trades look pretty clueless. Particularly those of the last 18 months.

Danault and a SECOND rounder for 2 rentals? That is a 1st and 2nd rounder for a PTO player in Fleishmann and a slumping Weise? Why not make that 2nd rounder conditional?

Sharp and JOHNS for Garbutt and Daley but Nill retains on Garbutt only? Why doesn't Johns give Bowman any leverage at all? Is this a fire sale? Require the retained be on Daley or a prospect back... or a pick based on Johns TOI in the playoffs.

TT (a 1st rounder) for a 2nd and 3rd plus $4m plus in cap space makes more sense BUT even here a performance based pick could easily be added.... say TT reaches 60 points then a 2nd rounder is added.

For having such a large front office the Hawks keep things very, very basic.... and player development? How about the whole "Dano is a right wing only - even in the AHL" mantra in the front office? So obviously a mistake we could see it in the 300 level.
- tredbrta

For whatever reason, Daley really never got a shot with Hawks and was never favorably viewed upon by coach Q. I agree with your sentiment that they should have gotten more, but they sold low on Daley after not giving him an opportunity to fit into their scheme. They were looking for cap space and that's what they got.

From a front office that has made some really great trades/signings over the last few years, they have made some questionable trades the last two years. I know they needed to get Sharp's contract off the books, but I thought that was a horrendous trade when they made it. They made it even worse by trading the pieces they got for worse pieces that didn't fit their style of play.

As a Pens fan who has lived in Chicago for almost 20 years, I watch and root for the Hawks any time they're not playing the Pens. I'm seeing them take a very similar path the Pens took starting in 2010. You have two all world talents coming off bridge contracts and now have the two highest annual salaries in the NHL. Hossa is still a productive player, but that contract will become a burden since it stays on the books even if he retires, a very good goalie making good money, two top defensemen making good money (Keith's cap hit is great, but he has a lot of term left), young players and picks are traded for aging rentals, and questionable trades are being made.

There is no question the Hawks are still a top team with immense talent, but it becomes more and more challenging to build out top to bottom rosters like they've had previously when you have 7 players on long contracts (Toews, Kane, Keith, Seabs, Crow, Hoss, Anisimov) counting for nearly 70% of the cap.

Yeah, and who knows if it's even accurate. When Saad first said it I assumed he was trying to not look greedy after he said he'd consider a hometown discount and then didn't. "Oh well I wasn't involved and was really surprised to find out about this" sounds better than "I didn't mean it when I said I would take a discount, and my dad and agent assured me the Hawks would give me whatever I was asking for."

Both of those are silly when a totally legitimate reason is "I am young and in a sport where I am potentially one injury away from ending my career so I need to ensure my financial security now"

He got his money but is playing for CBJ, and the Hawks spent all season trying to replace him
- maria_wyeth

Lets see... Make 4-5 million per year and a chance to be part of a historic franchise winning multiple Cups or 6 million a year playing for a lottery team? Good choice Mr. Saad.