Ok.

What will "work" is relative to a lot of other factors.

Your logic seems to assume there is no other means of back-filling the goalie position beyond the prospect pipeline. Mine doesn't. And honeslty I have NOT heard how they would backfill. I just think there are 2-3 possible "methods." Trade being the most likely, and not necessarily a goalie for goalie trade.
- John Jaeckel

I cannot envision anybody but Jimmy Howard being available at a somewhat resonable rate and significant downgrade.
Darling & somebody cheap can't keep you close to the top of the division and in the hunt for the Cup. I listed their salaries a couple pages back.
You know if darling plays a lot and well, I see Crawford leaving but he still hasn't shown a body of work that justifies CC gone.

I don't see a rostered player getting you better than Crow, and don't envision two separate trades to subtract yet another...

On the bright side it's starting to look like we're going to get a pretty high first round pick in 2017

I've spent time doing that too. I stated out with Eve University but bounced around a lot. Did mining for a while, joined a friends low sec corp. for a while but they were to squishy for me. Joined RvB did lots of destruction there. Went to Sniggwaffe/PL and then GSF.

I also moved freight for RedFrog, got fired for stealing a 6.5 billion isk Pirate Battleship. It's their fault. The collateral was only 750 mil so I made out quite nicely.


- gifman

Love those stories.

Before I stopped playing, I joined a CFC corp ("The Bastion" I guess at that point), don't remember who they were though, and honestly just never really had the time to get into it. Would have much preferred to find an in with industrialists as I can't handle the pvp.

Gentlemen, I'm a long time reader, but this is my first post. I have a question for all the posters who would rather have Ladd over Shaw. I am a huge Ladd fan, but if you compare their lifetime playoff stats, Shaw's seem to be a bit better overall. Plus, he is six years younger. Other than regular season numbers, what boxes does Ladd check off that Shaw does not?
- JPBurke27

Welcome..... Andrew Ladd is a bonafide power forward, very very few of them, who was drafted 4th overall. Here is his draft year: http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/draft/nhl2004e.html

I'm a fan too but would take Shaw at less money than Ladd at this stage of their careers in a rock hard cap world.

On Murray, do we really know he is an elite goalie? I thought he gifted that last San Jose win to them...
Wait until the other teams video guys pass the footage on and they devise game plans and find the weak parts of hs game even more so.
- wiz1901

Wheeew, a lot here Wiz Man. The real world got in the way and I just now found the time to respond... I'm gonna PM you.

But as far as Murray I hate to say the best/worst/fastest ever about anything but watching a kid this young have a foundation, economy of movement, ability to only play in the moment, have the beyond his years ability to hit cruise control and rely and revert totally to/on his fundamentals/technique and look like a clone of Holtby at 21 just mesmerizes me. To fight through the mental part of winning the cup adds to his physical game.

But IMO in Game 6 he was vulnerable from the middle of the game on. He wasn't smooth he was choppy, economical, he anchored himself and was stabbing, was thinking not playing. IMO he was fighting it.

Is he elite? As Al says the very best see the end of the movie before anyone else does and I ain't in that class. But as mentioned I love his foundation and mental approach knowing there was no real book on the kid this year and there sure as hell will be one next year. ........If he busts he'll be the 1,793rd guy to do so when it didn't seem likely.

Edit: The thing says I can't PM you. PM me please..........

I cannot envision anybody but Jimmy Howard being available at a somewhat resonable rate and significant downgrade.
Darling & somebody cheap can't keep you close to the top of the division and in the hunt for the Cup. I listed their salaries a couple pages back.
You know if darling plays a lot and well, I see Crawford leaving but he still hasn't shown a body of work that justifies CC gone.

I don't see a rostered player getting you better than Crow, and don't envision two separate trades to subtract yet another...
- wiz1901

Yeah but it's not just about their value as players. it's very much also, maybe more so, about $$$ right now.

I don't see a rostered player getting you better than Crow, and don't envision two separate trades to subtract yet another...
- wiz1901

Have to disagree, with a buyers market for goalies I would guess the return for a top pair D (cough Seabrook) exceeds the return for 50. Then bring in Campbell @$3M and it saves $3.8M to fill another hole at say LW

Bickell calls Chicago second home in post-trade farewell
http://www.thescore.com/news/1044351
(via http://thesco.re/theScore_app )

Bye Mr. Bicks. We shall miss your big hits and your wicked wrister from the top of the circle. You will always be in our hearts for 17 seconds.

GO PLAYOFF BICKS!

Have to disagree, with a buyers market for goalies I would guess the return for a top pair D (cough Seabrook) exceeds the return for 50. Then bring in Campbell @$3M and it saves $3.8M to fill another hole at say LW
- Sundevil

And with his departure you lose the only guy with a shot from the point and the ability and willingness to put someone into the boards.

If teams think the Hawks' D is soft and stick centric now.....

Teravainen surprised by deal to Hurricanes
http://www.thescore.com/news/1044103
(via http://thesco.re/theScore_app )

And this guy didn't have a clue.

At least lil Arti's smart enough to see the cap and it's problems.

And with his departure you lose the only guy with a shot from the point and the ability and willingness to put someone into the boards.

If teams think the Hawks' D is soft and stick centric now.....
- Return of the Roar

The model is moving towards TEAM speed, the Pens and Sharks both proved its validity. Name a thumper other than cheap arse Letang and maybe Burns on those teams? Seabrook looked like the mafia had fitted him with cement skates

The model is moving towards TEAM speed, the Pens and Sharks both proved its validity. Name a thumper other than cheap arse Letang and maybe Burns on those teams? Seabrook looked like the mafia had fitted him with cement skates
- Sundevil

Seabrook needed help getting onto the plane after the last game.

Seabrook needed help getting onto the plane after the last game.
- Al

Is one long off-season going to be enough for some of these guys?

Is one long off-season going to be enough for some of these guys?
- StLBravesFan

If not trouble, but that extra month to heal and also to have more quiet time is a very big deal.

Welcome, JP

Shaw's playoff stats with two Cup winners, one WCF finalist. Ladd's with one Cup winner and the Winnipeg Jets. Context.

The age thing is somewhat valid but the miles on Shaw are a lot harder and he may have a serious and chronic back issue—not good-especially with his style of play.

Ladd's offensive game is a bit more refined; he will be more productive.

AND, he is a natural LW, Shaw is a square peg there.
- John Jaeckel

Ladd won two Cup, he won another with Carolina.

Sorry, I could not disagree more.

1.5 is a huge number when you are constantly up against the cap and your top 9 players eat up 79% of your cap space. 1.5 is likely two roster players.

EDIT: And you have a $3M overage penalty for bonuses earned the previous year.
- MartiniMan

Agreed. I've said this several times. $1.5m is the equivalent of a Kruger or a Shaw. You have to fill a roster spot with a $800k-$1m player. So an extra $1.5m means you can fill that exact same spot with a $2.3-2.5m player. Don't think of $1.5m of cap space as getting a $1.5m player. Think of it as getting an upgrade of $1.5m above the standard Rockford contract of $900k. Or, as you put it, maybe two $750k upgrades.

Honestly, I think it's a little of both. Toews has a lot of hard miles on him since the 09-10 season. He draws the top line for defense when Kruger's line doesn't. He draws the top d-pairing, except for last year, probably. Toews is an all-around player, moreso than Kane (although Kane's is remarkably better since he's been in the league).

It will be interesting to see what this extra rest does for him and the rest of the team.

Remember Pat and 2241, no team has played more hockey in the HISTORY OF THE NHL over the last 7 years than the Blackhawks.
- CanOCorn

Wow. Would have thought the Islanders in 19 straight series wins would have been the most.

Should the hawks have to deal Shaw's rights, what would the return be? Could it be like a Troy Brouwer type deal where they got a first rounder for him or does their cap situation dilute the value of their trading assets?

When Panarin was scoring those meaningless points at the end of the regular season, I was feeling sick. Therein lies the reason why we cannot afford a $6M goalie. We have to build a team somehow around our bloated contracts.
- 67hawks

Exactly. I posted at the time that his fantastic last week (multiple 4 point games) was costing us the equivalent of Shaw!

IMO, they should give Shaw the 3 year deal as Kruger. Not a penny more, not a penny less. They cannot pay him $3.5-4M+
- Dannyboy

This hurts to break as news, but by my own spreadsheet with all the bonuses described on SCH today, with Scuderi, etc. and Rundblad buried at a cost of $.1M, it's BAD....

If the cap is $72.8M and they pay Shaw $2.5M next year, plus plug in Lundberg for Rasmussen, then they have $2.686M left for forwards #11, 12, and 13. I mean... they can't even bring up three ELC's at $.925M at the same time as that works out to $2.775M and puts them over the cap.

Or they look at a couple of vets for $.7M and bring up an ELC.

Good news about the dead cap hit this year is that it provides the room for Panarin's big raise next year. (and yes, I know there's Darling, Panik and maybe a couple others up for raises next year).

Dead hits this year:
$1.125m Scuderi
$3.05m carry-over bonuses
$100k Runbad salary hit for burying in the rock.
$4.3m dead hit this year goes away next year.
One of the others due for a raise next year was Teuvo. Not any more.

This hurts to break as news, but by my own spreadsheet with all the bonuses described on SCH today, with Scuderi, etc. and Rundblad buried at a cost of $1M, it's BAD....

If the cap is $72.8M and they pay Shaw $2.5M next year, plus plug in Lundberg for Rasmussen, then they have $2.686M left for forwards #11, 12, and 13. I mean... they can't even bring up three ELC's at $.925M at the same time as that works out to $2.775M and puts them over the cap.

Or they look at a couple of vets for $.7M and bring up an ELC.
- DMChi2010

Only required to have 18 skaters and two goalies. That is to say they only need 12 forwards on the roster. Thats two guys at $1.3MM at a $72.8MM cap.

I think one thing might be certain:

If Artemi Panarin. or Andrew Shaw tries to "Saad" the hawks, they will be sent packing...there is no room for Bowmanian overpays any more.
- wiz1901

Wiz, you're on fire. There's been a lot of fandom Bowmania since the Teets/Bicks deal.

@renlavoietva

NHLPA will agree to exercise the escalator clause (5%) but wants to make sure everybody's on board before making it official.

Good news about the dead cap hit this year is that it provides the room for Panarin's big raise next year. (and yes, I know there's Darling, Panik and maybe a couple others up for raises next year).

Dead hits this year:
$1.125m Scuderi
$3.05m carry-over bonuses
$100k Runbad salary hit for burying in the rock.
$4.3m dead hit this year goes away next year.
One of the others due for a raise next year was Teuvo. Not any more.
- Cmonalready

Panarin will be another $2.5MM if he hits his numbers again though.