[quote=PtotheY]There is no trolling, there is just point blank wrong judgements...this is one of them. The Messier Award is one of the most important awards in the sport? Was is better than to measure leadership. Skill is good, hockey intelligence is also equally as good and leadership is as important as skill and hockey intelligence. So the NHL would only measure people that can score, then you would only be rewarding one third of what makes the NHL great. As per your train of thoughts, players like Toews, Kopitar, Backes should never even be considered top tier players because they were never in top 5 scoring. If you would know anything your talking about, you would come to realize that the NHL and hockey world today is no where close to where it was before...many things have changed, most noticeably socring has gone down quite a lot so players make less points. So you can't compare older players to newer players because the fundamental analytic components of the sport have changed since 10 years ago.

As for Dougie, he was great, but Alfie was also great because he was just a pure leader, something that Dougie didn't have as much. So the difference in the points per game are defenitely caught up and overacheive by the leadership skills Alfie brought to enable his entire team, rather than just scoring and playing good D. Both amazing players, but you can't compare all numbers, and that's when leadership assessments

I'm not sure shooting the puck at one of the classiest players in the NHL is considered " leadership ".

There is no trolling, there is just point blank wrong judgements...this is one of them. The Messier Award is one of the most important awards in the sport? Was is better than to measure leadership. Skill is good, hockey intelligence is also equally as good and leadership is as important as skill and hockey intelligence. So the NHL would only measure people that can score, then you would only be rewarding one third of what makes the NHL great. As per your train of thoughts, players like Toews, Kopitar, Backes should never even be considered top tier players because they were never in top 5 scoring. If you would know anything your talking about, you would come to realize that the NHL and hockey world today is no where close to where it was before...many things have changed, most noticeably socring has gone down quite a lot so players make less points. So you can't compare older players to newer players because the fundamental analytic components of the sport have changed since 10 years ago.

As for Dougie, he was great, but Alfie was also great because he was just a pure leader, something that Dougie didn't have as much. So the difference in the points per game are defenitely caught up and overacheive by the leadership skills Alfie brought to enable his entire team, rather than just scoring and playing good D. Both amazing players, but you can't compare all numbers, and that's when leadership assessments are important.
- PtotheY

I've tried twice to read this rambling, incoherent mess, and I'm still not sure what language it's written in

I'm not sure shooting the puck at one of the classiest players in the NHL is considered " leadership ".
- jcfogerty

Not sure what you're talking about. It was pretty inspirational.

The Ducks never looked back. Inspired the hell out of them.

I'm not sure shooting the puck directly at one of the classiest players in the league , on the biggest stage no less, is considered " leadership ". Doug Gilmour single-handedly led his Leaf teams to two consecutive semi-finals.

Not sure what you're talking about. It was pretty inspirational.

The Ducks never looked back. Inspired the hell out of them.
- prock

Congrats to Alfie -- not too many people that deserve more than #11.

Speaking of sweedish HOF captains, Karlsson's off season workout is going hard.

This summer has great potential with guys talking about having big off season workouts - Zibanejad, Boroweici, and others have already shared their desire for a big year.

I've tried twice to read this rambling, incoherent mess, and I'm still not sure what language it's written in
- AxlRose91

I always chuckle when posters try and sound educated yet can't string a sentence together.

Congrats to Alfie -- not too many people that deserve more than #11.

Speaking of sweedish HOF captains, Karlsson's off season workout is going hard.

This summer has great potential with guys talking about having big off season workouts - Zibanejad, Boroweici, and others have already shared their desire for a big year.
- AlfieisKing

it is interesting to hear about all the players that have stayed in Ottawa to do summer training. Report on the Karlsson/Boucher meeting for 3 hours is intriguing. Boucher is the guy that coached Stamkos to 60 goals and he has said he wants to inspire Karlsson to another level.

I don't think the Sens are going to pursue Stamkos.

There's probably some truth to that. The comparison to Sundin isn't overly relevant (even the most loyal Sens fan on earth would admit that Alfie is nowhere near Mats' level), but I'm sure the link to Toronto has helped to expedite the HHOF selection process in the past

I mean, just look at the way Jeter is treated in the baseball community. Never a top five player in the league, below-average defensively, never hit for power, yet he's treated like the second coming of Babe Ruth. There are dozens of superior players who'll never be uttered in the same breath as Jeter, simply because they played in Milwaukee, or Cincy

So yeah, playing in the league's biggest market will always help
- AxlRose91

You do make some decent points, but your bias fell out there.

Sundin 1346 gp - 564 g - 785 a - 1349 pts. Won the Messier award.

Objectively not a big difference in numbers, Alfie has more awards and finals appearances. If Sundin deserves to get in the year before he even retires, Alfie should be in there at some point..

Mark Howe is in the HHOF
Mark Howe.

Congrats to Alfie -- not too many people that deserve more than #11.

Speaking of sweedish HOF captains, Karlsson's off season workout is going hard.

This summer has great potential with guys talking about having big off season workouts - Zibanejad, Boroweici, and others have already shared their desire for a big year.
- AlfieisKing

You don't "deserve" doctorates, you earn them...

The HOF is dumb and random.

Mats Sundin had a somewhat better career than Alfie.

Awards for leadership are the lifetime achievement awards of sport.

The summer is loooooooong

Prock and jcfogerty

You're on thin ice... I'll boot your asses til after July 1 if you disrupt this thread.

Post accordingly.

Meh, Sundin was pretty borderline himself, and he was better than Alfredsson.

Any Leafs hockey fan will tell you that.
- prock

Fixed

Prock and jcfogerty

You're on thin ice... I'll boot your asses til after July 1 if you disrupt this thread.

Post accordingly.
- Dozzer

To paraphrase my favorite movie.... "don't mind them... they's just drunk....... they was only foolin' about"

Curly Bill Brocius

it is interesting to hear about all the players that have stayed in Ottawa to do summer training. Report on the Karlsson/Boucher meeting for 3 hours is intriguing. Boucher is the guy that coached Stamkos to 60 goals and he has said he wants to inspire Karlsson to another level.

I don't think the Sens are going to pursue Stamkos.
- spatso

TBH ,its a a good thing.As much as we cry about the slow and frustrating process that we all have had with some of the kids we have .Drafting and developing ,your own talent is the right way to go .
I dont see this changing anytime soon here ,we will pass from being an average team to a contender in due time .Rushing things never seems to work out

TBH ,its a a good thing.As much as we cry about the slow and frustrating process that we all have had with some of the kids we have .Drafting and developing ,your own talent is the right way to go .
I dont see this changing anytime soon here ,we will pass from being an average team to a contender in due time .Rushing things never seems to work out

- top shelf 15

If Ottawa has an opportunity to pursue Stamkos and don't .... they're fools.

There is not one player in Ottawa's current roster, or prospect pool that has his talent. If they can sign him ..... sign him

he's only 26 for Alfie's sake

If Ottawa has an opportunity to pursue Stamkos and don't .... they're fools.

There is not one player in Ottawa's current roster, or prospect pool that has his talent. If they can sign him ..... sign him

he's only 26 for Alfie's sake
- SensnRBs

Lots of key pieces for us will need raises,Turris,Stone,EK,jgp etc.Adding another 10 mil a year contract wont make that any easier .In a perfect world i would agree adding a guy like Stammer would pretty much set up our top 9 though

Lots of key pieces for us will need raises,Turris,Stone,EK,jgp etc.Adding another 10 mil a year contract wont make that any easier .In a perfect world i would agree adding a guy like Stammer would pretty much set up our top 9 though

- top shelf 15

So? You move Turris and/or Mac (if you can)

So? You move Turris and/or Mac (if you can)
- TheCalSen

Turris are you mad???

Turris = Toews

sorry .... cldnt help myself

I'm not sure shooting the puck directly at one of the classiest players in the league , on the biggest stage no less, is considered " leadership ". Doug Gilmour single-handedly led his Leaf teams to two consecutive semi-finals.
- jcfogerty

Check out Neidermayer Worrel on youtube....Scotty was a hell of a player but classy guys don't behave that way.

Clayton Keller C at #12


The more Videos I see and acticles I read about this kid, the more I hope Sens can steal him with the 12th overall pick. He'll be one of the smallest to go in the first round, but what he lacks in size he makes up for in skill & speed.

If he's picked before 12, I'd like either of these 4..

Logan Brown C
Mikhail Sergachyov D
Jake Bean D
Tyson Jost C

So? You move Turris and/or Mac (if you can)
- TheCalSen

Not opposed to that move but if we're getting Stamkos why not trade Ryan and try Zbad on the wing

I always chuckle when posters try and sound educated yet can't string a sentence together.
- jcfogerty

Yes, imagine trying TO sound educated and coming up extremely lame....