rust practiced on ice today for people that didn't know.
- martox

I think theres a decent chance someone offers Schultz 4 years 16 million. He's not worth that yet, but he has a shot at making that a reasonable contract. That is probably close to the market for 4/5D 1st power play guy. My opinion is that's close to fair value for him since he offers potential of becoming a 3d. Depends a bit on how the cap shakes out.

Add in a premium for being a cup winning dman.

I think we have a decent shot at signing him for around 3.
- sditulli

If we don't qualify Schultz (which I don't believe we should at 4M per) Do we get first dibs on offering him a lower contract? Can we not qualify him, but then sign him to a 3x3 type deal or do we have to wait until July 1st UFA day like all the other teams? Obviously I know if we don't qualify him Schultz has the right to see the offers on the open market if he wishes, but just curious if we can negotiate a "non-qualifying" offer pre July 1.?

rust practiced on ice today for people that didn't know.
- martox

Did he? I thought he was just around Consol.

If we don't qualify Schultz (which I don't believe we should at 4M per) Do we get first dibs on offering him a lower contract? Can we not qualify him, but then sign him to a 3x3 type deal or do we have to wait until July 1st UFA day like all the other teams? Obviously I know if we don't qualify him Schultz has the right to see the offers on the open market if he wishes, but just curious if we can negotiate a "non-qualifying" offer pre July 1.?
- Willaged

We own his rights. We can negotiate with him whenever the F we want. We could start negotiating with him tonight if we wanted.

Fairly certain we did this with Bennett last summer. Bennett got a 100k pay deduction, which wouldn't make sense given the QO rules. I think the rule is a RFA can come to terms on a contract bellow the QO if they want and stay a RFA, but if they don't and a QO isn't extended, then they become a UFA.

Did he? I thought he was just around Consol.
- Victoro311

he worked out with the coaches alone. think it is just part of them examining him.

We own his rights. We can negotiate with him whenever the F we want. We could start negotiating with him tonight if we wanted.

Fairly certain we did this with Bennett last summer. Bennett got a 100k pay deduction, which wouldn't make sense given the QO rules. I think the rule is a RFA can come to terms on a contract bellow the QO if they want and stay a RFA, but if they don't and a QO isn't extended, then they become a UFA.
- Victoro311

Yeah I understand all thatt. Just wasn't sure if you could not qualify a guy but then give a lower offer before July 1. Wasn't sure if by not qualifying a guy if you give up your exclusive rights or not.... anyways, if I'm GMJR I use Matt Niskanen as my comparable for Justin Schultz... you offer 2.5-3M over 2 or 3 years- you sell that this appears to be a good fit, he can play on a good team in a sheltered role and build on his skill set and at the end of the 3 years he may be able to parlay those 3 good years in a Niskanen esque long term, big money deal, either here or else where. Where as if you chase the money now, get say 4M x 4 years, but at the end of those 4 years if it goes poorly like in Edmonton you may be playing on year to year league minimum deals just to stay in the league. A slightly smaller contract now will be an investment in your next contract.... that's my sales pitch if I'm GMJR.

Did he? I thought he was just around Consol.
- Victoro311

You forget who he knows.

You forget who he knows.
- Oneonta Penguin

would you stop that lol...

would you stop that lol...
- martox

Nope. If I'm going to be forever heckled for being Guile's alt (even though I am clearly more charming) you will be forever heckled for humble bragging about being Paddy Hornqvist's best friend.

he worked out with the coaches alone. think it is just part of them examining him.

- martox

I had the understanding that if a player was diagnosed with a concussion they had to stay off ice at least a week. Maybe it's just can't play for at least a week. Even still, I can't see them letting him out on the ice in bright lights if he had a concussion.

I believe Rust to be very important in this series due to his speed, tenacity, new found scoring touch and chemistry with Geno.

I think theres a decent chance someone offers Schultz 4 years 16 million. He's not worth that yet, but he has a shot at making that a reasonable contract. That is probably close to the market for 4/5D 1st power play guy. My opinion is that's close to fair value for him since he offers potential of becoming a 3d. Depends a bit on how the cap shakes out.

Add in a premium for being a cup winning dman.

I think we have a decent shot at signing him for around 3.
- sditulli

Schultz is a better defender than Depres, he has all of Depres physical talents (speed, size) but his IQ is higher than Depres will ever be. It will come down to what Schultz wants to do really because he is worth in the 4M range. PP QBs dont grow on trees.

He either realizes that he has a REALLY good thing here, takes into account that he made more than a rookie normally would have in Edmonton and decides to play at a discount and work on his game in a winning environment.

Or he wants to get paid.

I think after the nightmare that was his tenure in Edmonton, Schultz has an acute understanding of money isnt everything and will sign with the Pens.

Nope. If I'm going to be forever heckled for being Guile's alt (even though I am clearly more charming) you will be forever heckled for humble bragging about being Paddy Hornqvist's best friend.
- Victoro311

ye I dug my own grave

Did he? I thought he was just around Consol.
- Victoro311

He did not... he had his own skating and drills after the team left the ice. I don't count that as a good sign.

Nope. If I'm going to be forever heckled for being Guile's alt (even though I am clearly more charming) you will be forever heckled for humble bragging about being Paddy Hornqvist's best friend.
- Victoro311

Thank you, for calling me more charming than myself. I enjoy self improvement each and every day.

Schultz is a better defender than Depres, he has all of Depres physical talents (speed, size) but his IQ is higher than Depres will ever be. It will come down to what Schultz wants to do really because he is worth in the 4M range. PP QBs dont grow on trees.

He either realizes that he has a REALLY good thing here, takes into account that he made more than a rookie normally would have in Edmonton and decides to play at a discount and work on his game in a winning environment.

Or he wants to get paid.

I think after the nightmare that was his tenure in Edmonton, Schultz has an acute understanding of money isnt everything and will sign with the Pens.
- stackthepads

Schultz and Depres are simply different players. Not really compareable IMO.

He did not... he had his own skating and drills after the team left the ice. I don't count that as a good sign.
- Guile

never said he practiced with the team. it was an optional practice anyways was it not? he went on after the practice with the coaches ye. As the pic showed

Schultz is a better defender than Depres, he has all of Depres physical talents (speed, size) but his IQ is higher than Depres will ever be. It will come down to what Schultz wants to do really because he is worth in the 4M range. PP QBs dont grow on trees.

He either realizes that he has a REALLY good thing here, takes into account that he made more than a rookie normally would have in Edmonton and decides to play at a discount and work on his game in a winning environment.

Or he wants to get paid.

I think after the nightmare that was his tenure in Edmonton, Schultz has an acute understanding of money isnt everything and will sign with the Pens.
- stackthepads

And like I said, a discounted short term deal (2-3 years) in a good situation could yield a very good next contract, where as taking the most money now and having another Edmonton situation could very well be the end of the road for him.

From last blog:



I hope it continues as well. Teams underestimating us thinking they just need to turn up & they will win.

Who gives a (frank) what the 'experts' think anyway? Silent overachievers (thanks Kreiderbomb ). Players start believing the hype, that's a great thing for the Pens team because they are being rag dolled in the press.
- Aussiepenguin

I like it as well.

The general feeling I'm getting from media and general public alike is that the majority still think the Sharks have this.. And most base it off their 2nd period play...which I dont totally follow the logic of.

I had the understanding that if a player was diagnosed with a concussion they had to stay off ice at least a week. Maybe it's just can't play for at least a week. Even still, I can't see them letting him out on the ice in bright lights if he had a concussion.

I believe Rust to be very important in this series due to his speed, tenacity, new found scoring touch and chemistry with Geno.
- MattStrat

He's got a concussion, the question is just how much of a concussion does he have? I dont think it looks good that he played another shift after then had to be shut down.

It is the cup though, and players have certainly played with concussions before. Not advocating that he should play, he probably shouldnt... but the chances are better that he never plays in another one than he makes it back, in his place if Im not woosy Im playing.

Yeah I understand all thatt. Just wasn't sure if you could not qualify a guy but then give a lower offer before July 1. Wasn't sure if by not qualifying a guy if you give up your exclusive rights or not.... anyways, if I'm GMJR I use Matt Niskanen as my comparable for Justin Schultz... you offer 2.5-3M over 2 or 3 years- you sell that this appears to be a good fit, he can play on a good team in a sheltered role and build on his skill set and at the end of the 3 years he may be able to parlay those 3 good years in a Niskanen esque long term, big money deal, either here or else where. Where as if you chase the money now, get say 4M x 4 years, but at the end of those 4 years if it goes poorly like in Edmonton you may be playing on year to year league minimum deals just to stay in the league. A slightly smaller contract now will be an investment in your next contract.... that's my sales pitch if I'm GMJR.
- Willaged

Personally, I think he signs here 2 x 6. Defenseman market wasn't as strong last year as the year Orpik/Nisky/Engelland all got big deals. I just think a GM might gamble on his talent and offer him something like 4 by 16. Too often in sports GM's give big contracts to guys on the downside of their career. With Schultz your basically signing him for his prime 26-29 years and gambling Edmonton is dysfunctional and Schultz has talent. If the cap goes up the next few years we could see that market improve again where 4/5D get big bucks.

FWIW if Schultz hits his potential I think he could be something like Yandle...probably better than Daley.

Schultz and Depres are simply different players. Not really compareable IMO.
- Victoro311

Come on Vic, they are both defencemen they are easily comparable.

Come on Vic, they are both defencemen they are easily comparable.
- stackthepads

Personally, I think he signs here 2 x 6. Defenseman market wasn't as strong last year as the year Orpik/Nisky/Engelland all got big deals. I just think a GM might gamble on his talent and offer him something like 4 by 16. Too often in sports GM's give big contracts to guys on the downside of their career. With Schultz your basically signing him for his prime 26-29 years and gambling Edmonton is dysfunctional and Schultz has talent. If the cap goes up the next few years we could see that market improve again where 4/5D get big bucks.

FWIW if Schultz hits his potential I think he could be something like Yandle...probably better than Daley.
- sditulli

Some good points here. We did just see Vancouver give up a very promising prospect and a high 2nd rounder for a 4/5 dman. There are teams really hurting for good dmen and Schultz hasn't looked out of place in the cup final. He certainly has the upside to be unlocked.

I like it as well.

The general feeling I'm getting from media and general public alike is that the majority still think the Sharks have this.. And most base it off their 2nd period play...which I dont totally follow the logic of.
- MattStrat

Greg Gilbert today said the Sharks would wear the Penguins down, and in general the attitude was that the Penguins couldn't continue to win with their speed game. Could happen, I fully expect the Sharks to come out flying tomorrow night. But after discounting the Penguins all day yesterday I expect the tenor to change at least slightly today and it really didn't.

Big thing for the Penguins is that they need to be more aggressive at the points and go get the puck. If the Sharks swing the puck down low I trust the Penguins forwards to collapse quickly.

Personally, I think he signs here 2 x 6. Defenseman market wasn't as strong last year as the year Orpik/Nisky/Engelland all got big deals. I just think a GM might gamble on his talent and offer him something like 4 by 16. Too often in sports GM's give big contracts to guys on the downside of their career. With Schultz your basically signing him for his prime 26-29 years and gambling Edmonton is dysfunctional and Schultz has talent. If the cap goes up the next few years we could see that market improve again where 4/5D get big bucks.

FWIW if Schultz hits his potential I think he could be something like Yandle...probably better than Daley.
- sditulli

He is not getting 6 mil per nor would he sign for 6 years at 2 mil per, so that 2 x 6 isn't happening any way you slice it.