I was thinking the same thing. We probably don't lose Game 5 with Murray in net considering a couple of the goals Fleury let in, but we also probably don't see the version of Murray we saw last night if he was rested for a game. Murray and Sheary looked completely rejuvenated. It's the rest of the team's fault for dropping a very winnable game 5 while those two rested up. Fingers pointed squarely at Malkin, Fleury, Letang, and somewhat Crosby for that one.
- Victoro311

Statements along the lines of "we probably don't lose Game 5 with Murray in net" really bother me. They're basing an entire very important argument over who should be playing on hypotheticals instead of facts. The decision about who should be playing should be based on what has actually happened on the ice, not conjecture, and you can bet your ass that's how Sullivan is evaluating things.

want to get into a fact/opinion argument again?

I was thinking the same thing. We probably don't lose Game 5 with Murray in net considering a couple of the goals Fleury let in, but we also probably don't see the version of Murray we saw last night if he was rested for a game. Murray and Sheary looked completely rejuvenated. It's the rest of the team's fault for dropping a very winnable game 5 while those two rested up. Fingers pointed squarely at Malkin, Fleury, Letang, and somewhat Crosby for that one.
- Victoro311

I really think the "stars" are under the blame microscope unlike other seasons even though they should've been then as well.

This season is different. HCMS isn't taking the blame, a rookie diamond in the rough goalie playing and leading beyond his age isn't, GMJR sure as he'll isn't taking blame, the scapegoat that is Kessel isn't, all the WBS call ups def aren't, even Fleury which I give a pass to the other night is only somewhat culpable at this point.

Only Crosby, Geno, and Letang are deserving of blame if this goes south, and I think they realize the situation they are in. Only Malkin stumbled once last night with the bad penalty. If the Bolts win, all eyes are focused on our big 3 and rightfully so.

(frank), you're weird.
- Blackstrom2

Stop, he's old and feeble and the nursing home limits his access to the outdoors.

(frank), you're weird.
- Blackstrom2

Yeah, dude is dense, and miserable. Doesn't really bring much to the table.

Statements along the lines of "we probably don't lose Game 5 with Murray in net" really bother me. They're basing an entire very important argument over who should be playing on hypotheticals instead of facts. The decision about who should be playing should be based on what has actually happened on the ice, not conjecture, and you can bet your ass that's how Sullivan is evaluating things.

want to get into a fact/opinion argument again?
- DeflatedPucks

Butterfly effect, as well. You go and change the past, who is to say everything else would have happened the same?

I really think the "stars" are under the blame microscope unlike other seasons even though they should've been then as well.

This season is different. HCMS isn't taking the blame, a rookie diamond in the rough goalie playing and leading beyond his age isn't, GMJR sure as he'll isn't taking blame, the scapegoat that is Kessel isn't, all the WBS call ups def aren't, even Fleury which I give a pass to the other night is only somewhat culpable at this point.

Only Crosby, Geno, and Letang are deserving of blame if this goes south, and I think they realize the situation they are in. Only Malkin stumbled once last night with the bad penalty. If the Bolts win, all eyes are focused on our big 3 and rightfully so.
- Reverend Killtaker

I don't think anyone should be blamed. No game is a given, they didn't get left in the dust like the Boston ECF. They've put up a hell of a fight, and I've enjoyed every minute of these playoffs.

According to the rulebook it is technically "off-side" but nobody cares. Nobody cares.
- StealthTomato

I guess I'ms the onlys one that think that spellings sometime makes as differences.

I don't think anyone should be blamed. No game is a given, they didn't get left in the dust like the Boston ECF. They've put up a hell of a fight, and I've enjoyed every minute of these playoffs.
- j.boyd919

Agreed. Tampa is a good team and damn opportunistic. The blame game carousel is getting old

I don't think anyone should be blamed. No game is a given, they didn't get left in the dust like the Boston ECF. They've put up a hell of a fight, and I've enjoyed every minute of these playoffs.
- j.boyd919

Blame admittedly may or may not be a harsh/improper word at this point, but there is always a point of discussing lessons learned after an event and all eyes will be on Genos lack of productivity, his nature to take horrible penalties at inoportune times, Crosbys mediocre production, Letangs meltdown and drop in productivity.

I guess I'ms the onlys one that think that spellings sometime makes as differences.
- Chadavitch

Only sad attempts at trolling will.

Statements along the lines of "we probably don't lose Game 5 with Murray in net" really bother me. They're basing an entire very important argument over who should be playing on hypotheticals instead of facts. The decision about who should be playing should be based on what has actually happened on the ice, not conjecture, and you can bet your ass that's how Sullivan is evaluating things.

want to get into a fact/opinion argument again?
- DeflatedPucks

Hahaha good one

But my statement was a lot more mild than the one that originally set me off and that was after circles of asinine, milatent argument on both sides of the MAF vs Fleury debate where each side was insulting the other's intelligence for holding a different opinion because they didn't realize that their opinions weren't fact. At that point the facts were MAF had a great season, and Murray was playing well up until that point but his play was slipping. The argument has sense been put to rest. The new facts are MAF is too rusty to be relied upon after too long of a layover. That's what game 5 showed at least.

I obviously have no idea of Murray would have won game 5, nor do I have any idea that if he had played game 5 he wouldn't have been as good as he was in game 6. Those are just guesstimates.

Blame admittedly may or may not be a harsh/improper word at this point, but there is always a point of discussing lessons learned after an event and all eyes will be on Genos lack of productivity, his nature to take horrible penalties at inoportune times, Crosbys mediocre production, Letangs meltdown and drop in productivity.
- Reverend Killtaker

To be fair, if he was going to slash, that was way to slash tho...

(on the other hand, Mike Sully's rxn when he got to da bench - we know who's not his homeboy now)

To be fair, if he was going to slash, that was way to slash tho...

(on the other hand, Mike Sully's rxn when he got to da bench - we know who's not his homeboy now)
- DeflatedPucks

I'm too sober at this time of day to try and decipher this. Anyone else want to take a stab at it?

Blame admittedly may or may not be a harsh/improper word at this point, but there is always a point of discussing lessons learned after an event and all eyes will be on Genos lack of productivity, his nature to take horrible penalties at inoportune times, Crosbys mediocre production, Letangs meltdown and drop in productivity.
- Reverend Killtaker

This is where I'm at, and to your other post, there's just nowhere else to go with the accountability. Goaltending has been great to fine in every game except for like two. All the depth players in the forward and defensive ranks have played outstanding. Only guys that could maybe do better are Fehr and Kunitz, and Kunitz has really elevated his game this series and Fehr is still fine. There aren't any holes in the roster except maybe LW and one slot in the top 4, but that's only due to injury and GM Old Man addressed that possibility through trades as best he could, so it's not a team building problem to be laid at the feet of the General Manager. There haven't been any Bylsmanian coaching errors, so it's not on Sullivan. It's only the super stars that haven't been pulling all of their own weight lately. Last game was a start.

This exactly. We don't have a bunch of big bodied, physical defensemen on the blue line that can rip skaters off the puck, dump guys out of the crease, and clog up space. The closest things we have to that are Ian Cole and Olli Maatta. When we get leads we should just keep playing the same game that limited the other team to ~12 shots per period. It's really hard for a team to convert on 30-40% of their shots in one period.
- Victoro311

I also think the team they are playing factors into this. The Lightning are very quick and hard to trap anyways. The pens could probably get away with an extended trap against a slower team, but it won't work as well in this case.

I'm too sober at this time of day to try and decipher this. Anyone else want to take a stab at it?
- Reverend Killtaker

Judging by Mike Sullivan's reaction, he was pissed at Geno after the slash despite the fact that if you're going to slash someone, might as well give them a real stinger, to paraphrase Dingle.

This is where I'm at, and to your other post, there's just nowhere else to go with the accountability. Goaltending has been great to fine in every game except for like two. All the depth players in the forward and defensive ranks have played outstanding. Only guys that could maybe do better are Fehr and Kunitz, and Kunitz has really elevated his game this series and Fehr is still fine. There aren't any holes in the roster except maybe LW and one slot in the top 4, but that's only due to injury and GM Old Man addressed that possibility through trades as best he could, so it's not a team building problem to be laid at the feet of the General Manager. There haven't been any Bylsmanian coaching errors, so it's not on Sullivan. It's only the super stars that haven't been pulling all of their own weight lately. Last game was a start.
- Victoro311

Exactly my point. Ill also this team as exceeded my expectations due to all the adversity they faced this season, and for that this is a team/season to be proud of in so many ways. It's been a roller coaster season but it's also been a fun ride.

Mike Lange is the best

Exactly my point. Ill also this team as exceeded my expectations due to all the adversity they faced this season, and for that this is a team/season to be proud of in so many ways. It's been a roller coaster season but it's also been a fun ride.
- Reverend Killtaker

So true. And that's why every time I've had a criticism about this team this post season, I've qualified it by saying that despite anything negative, this team has shown that it's well constructed and a legit contender and our organization is in much better shape asset wise than it once was. For those reasons, even if we get knocked out there shouldn't be any extremist over reactions about blowing up the core.

Mike Lange is the best
- Marc D

I also think the team they are playing factors into this. The Lightning are very quick and hard to trap anyways. The pens could probably get away with an extended trap against a slower team, but it won't work as well in this case.
- Emperor Filonius

I think the lightning are a better team to play trap against than most. They have one line that is built to grind and cycle and thats the Boyle line. Their other lines are built to carry through the neutral zone, if they are forced to dump they arent very effective.

So true. And that's why every time I've had a criticism about this team this post season, I've qualified it by saying that despite anything negative, this team has shown that it's well constructed and a legit contender and our organization is in much better shape asset wise than it once was. For those reasons, even if we get knocked out there shouldn't be any extremist over reactions about blowing up the core.
- Victoro311

+1

So true. And that's why every time I've had a criticism about this team this post season, I've qualified it by saying that despite anything negative, this team has shown that it's well constructed and a legit contender and our organization is in much better shape asset wise than it once was. For those reasons, even if we get knocked out there shouldn't be any extremist over reactions about blowing up the core.
- Victoro311

but then we won't have anything to female dog about in the offseason. its a double edged sword. I don't think this board will last if there isn't hostility

I also think the team they are playing factors into this. The Lightning are very quick and hard to trap anyways. The pens could probably get away with an extended trap against a slower team, but it won't work as well in this case.
- Emperor Filonius

Don't you need centers that know what they're doing to trap? They're usually the first point of attack. Basically forcing the puck carrier to move the puck to one side of the ice or the other.

That's the thing I've noticed about Sid, Geno and Bones.... None of them do a very good job at pressuring the puck carrier. Hell, Geno looks pathetic trying to defend. Just waving his stick around.

I'm too sober at this time of day to try and decipher this. Anyone else want to take a stab at it?
- Reverend Killtaker

That's your own (frank)ing fault. Its already 2:44!!!!!!