It's not a fact that anyone got fleeced on the trade. It remains to be seen how that "fantastic" value works out.
- MJL

the value is the same as any other prospect or draft pick...what they turn into isnt as relevant as how you get them and what price you pay. They are lottery tickets and gathering them for a piece you dont want anymore is fantastic value

Dreger never missed an opportunity to poop on Luke Schenn but loves him some Gudbranson.

http://www.todaysslapshot...one-in-terms-of-shopping/

Dreger:
- Feanor

Id rather have EG than Russell for sure

Id rather have EG than Russell for sure
- YuenglingJagr

Russell's gonna be an interesting case come FA, as to exactly who signs him and for how much

With the market correction we have seen with defenders like him, that market is going to be interesting to watch

NHL teams consider how the pieces will fit together, to mold a team. I don't think Gudbranson is a star, but Vancouver obviously thinks they have a need for a top 4 defenseman, with size. Ultimately, how all the pieces fit together to form a team, is what matters. Not what each individual player's hero chart looks like, based on bad data.

JVR was far more of an established NHL player than McCann is, so I don't think that's a great comparable.
- MJL

And the team building is just as bad as the trade itself...they were already well below average in offense from defensemen. They are valuing trades like its 2006 and building a team from that era as well

so you're telling me instead of a line like lappy - betts - powe, you wouldnt put coots and raffl in there? lappy - coots - raffl. or forget raffl, just say lappy - coots - betts, so betts could take the faceoffs and stay in the lineup for us for the PK? i mean as a rookie coots shutdown a top 5 player in the world, lets be real here, he absolutely couldve played on this team.

the only question is if he were drafted that year would he even be brought up? i doubt he wouldve just due to the depth, but if he was called up, he definitely couldve played over guys like powe and asham. asham and carcillo both do the same thing, play with energy, limited offensive upside, get under the skin, park in front of the net, their skill sets are almost identical, save for asham taking less stupid penalties. you could easily have lost one of them for coots. once quenneville split up toews and kane after game 4, we never won again. having coots out there against one of those lines allowing the richie line up against the other line wouldve helped us tremendously.

gagne - richie - giroux
hartsy - briere - leino
JVR - carter - giroux
lappy/asham - coots - betts/asham

if coots transported from 2012 to 2010 we win the cup, 100%
- sjk540

You wrote G twice or am I missing something? You can't simply place any player, anywhere. They have the be suited for that position. Carcillo and Coots do not offer the same things but both are effective.

I am interested in what will come of St. Louis now that they missed the cup finals again. Lots of pieces that could move around and make things interesting

And the team building is just as bad as the trade itself...they were already well below average in offense from defensemen. They are valuing trades like its 2006 and building a team from that era as well
- YuenglingJagr

Great, so now there's, like, 13 teams in the west. Even easier to make the playoffs.

Russell's gonna be an interesting case come FA, as to exactly who signs him and for how much

With the market correction we have seen with defenders like him, that market is going to be interesting to watch
- AllInForFlyers

Somebody (Benning) is going to give him AMac money.

Great, so now there's, like, 13 teams in the west. Even easier to make the playoffs.
- Scoob

Who cares how easy it is to make the playoffs when it is an absolute gauntlet to get through them? The west had several teams who looked like cup favorites over really just pittsburgh and tampa

I am interested in what will come of St. Louis now that they missed the cup finals again. Lots of pieces that could move around and make things interesting
- YuenglingJagr

How about reports of them not happy with Tarasanko after they just signed him.

Somebody (Benning) is going to give him AMac money.
- Tomahawk

Ha! It definitely only takes one, but I just have had this feeling for months that the market's gonna be hard on him

That's just my opinion. But I think more and more teams are realizing that the limitations of this kind of player are real

But if the market is hot, maybe AMac gets moved to someone who misses out

That is my secret dream, that MacDonald gets moved to a team that values minutes over metrics

I am hoping that Hextall calls Joe Sakic every day, tbh

Ha! It definitely only takes one, but I just have had this feeling for months that the market's gonna be hard on him

That's just my opinion. But I think more and more teams are realizing that the limitations of this kind of player are real

But if the market is hot, maybe AMac gets moved to someone who misses out

That is my secret dream, that MacDonald gets moved to a team that values minutes over metrics
- AllInForFlyers

I was actually thinking that. Maybe a team prefers one year of Streit over a long term deal to someone like Russel. Also maybe a team desperate for d take someone like MacDonald who can play maybe on a 2nd pairing and log some minutes.

Vancouver did good on Gudy

Who cares how easy it is to make the playoffs when it is an absolute gauntlet to get through them? The west had several teams who looked like cup favorites over really just pittsburgh and tampa
- YuenglingJagr

never mind

You know, that's what makes it odd -- I would very much agree that Gudbranson is more consistent on a shift-by-shift basis than Luke Schenn has been, and if someone hangs their hat on that, by all means

But at the same time, that doesn't make you a player that is worth what Vancouver paid in assets -- youth and size are great, but Gudbranson's played enough where it's fair to say there is some risk in there

As you said earlier: I'd have kept McCann, made the picks, and signed Schenn first, if you had to have a RH defender with some size and youth. But that's just me
- AllInForFlyers

It's also fair to say that there is risk there for Florida also

did they ditch Hitch yet?

One thing is for sure: I am curious to see who Gudbranson plays with out there
- AllInForFlyers

Probably Vancouver's other players.

did they ditch Hitch yet?
- vejim

You think they put that on him? I went back and forth on it. Not sure what the right move is there

In watching that series, you kinda think that maybe it's the goaltending, but last night, it wasn't

So then you look at systems, PK and PP, and nothing stood out to me

Maybe, just maybe...St. Louis just doesn't have enough top-end talent to punch through. I think that might be where I am -- talented, but just weak enough in areas to not beat multiple good teams in a row

the value is the same as any other prospect or draft pick...what they turn into isnt as relevant as how you get them and what price you pay. They are lottery tickets and gathering them for a piece you dont want anymore is fantastic value
- YuenglingJagr

I disagree. Ultimately, how the assets you got turn out, is far more relevant to the outcome of a trade. Obviously that isn't known right now, so all we can look at is the perceived value of an asset, in assessing a trade right now, but that should not be done with finality to it. Also have to look at the overall team effect a deal has. Many aspects to looking at a trade.

You think they put that on him? I went back and forth on it. Not sure what the right move is there
- AllInForFlyers

I think he is out.

They could turnover the roster a little. Backes and Brouwer could be gone. They could move Shattenkirk. Brouwer could get a solid FA deal after having the playoffs he did.

Not his fault but I think they could look in another direction.

I am interested in what will come of St. Louis now that they missed the cup finals again. Lots of pieces that could move around and make things interesting
- YuenglingJagr

I wouldn't make too many changes. They didn't miss by much. Hitchcock stays were it up to me.

You think they put that on him? I went back and forth on it. Not sure what the right move is there
- AllInForFlyers

Blue's fans have to be frustrated another year with no cup

And the team building is just as bad as the trade itself...they were already well below average in offense from defensemen. They are valuing trades like its 2006 and building a team from that era as well
- YuenglingJagr

This doesn't consider other moves that will be made in the future, to rectify other needs. If they didn't feel that Gudbranson filled a need, they wouldn't have made the deal. How you consider they're valuing trades and building a team, all depends on an opinion and perspective that one is looking at it from.

never mind
- Scoob

I disagree. Ultimately, how the assets you got turn out, is far more relevant to the outcome of a trade. Obviously that isn't known right now, so all we can look at is the perceived value of an asset, in assessing a trade right now, but that should not be done with finality to it. Also have to look at the overall team effect a deal has. Many aspects to looking at a trade.
- MJL

To me McCann looks to be a solid 3rd line center. I almost feel like the deal would be like the Flyers moving Laughton, a 2nd and 4th for Gudbranson and a 5th.

I think both teams got things they wanted. Also Gudbranson is only 24. Still plenty of time for him.