It's funny too, last year Eichel and McDavid were both considered generational talents (McDavid obviously better) but now since Matthews is headed to Toronto, it seems like he's clearly much better than Eichel
- sbroads24

I read somewhere their stats are pretty close where they can be compared....no where did I see he is "much" better.

But really, who cares if you have Modano or Sakic? Or Forseberg or Lindros? Or Tkachuck or Kariya?

At the end of the day, all theses players are very close in quality, it's the team around them that makes them successful.

James Tanner: UnderValued Players the Coyotes Should Pursue
- Players the Coyotes Should Get.
- James_Tanner

Hey James
Based on all your blogs from the year Arizona is thin on Centers and D depth.

With the leafs most likely having an extra top three center next year, and 5 NHL d-men fighting for 3 spots (or being subject for waivers), What do you think Arizona would realistically give up for those pieces:

I am assuming the leafs D baring a trade will look like:
Rielly Hunwick
Gardiner Zaitsev
Marincin(Babcock likes this guy) Carrick (played great this year in his audition and in the AHL)
Harrington (brought over in the Kessel trade for a reason)

What would a return look like for:
Bozak, Percy, and Corrado
Would it get the NYR 1st round pick?

What would the return look like for:
Bozak, percy, Corrado, and the Pits 1st round pick
Would it be enough for Arizona's 1st round pick?

Though you would have the best insight being a fan of both teams.

Not really, this is just a real life example of how player's get undervalued. You think McCabe is a better player, and probably so does the coaching staff that plays him ahead of Pysyk. (Or even more likely, the coaching staff has higher hopes for McCabe and wants to use him higher up even they probably do know who is currently the better player).

But he isn't and the stats prove it. End of story. Doesn't matter what you say, what you see with your eyes or whatever. The fact is, Pysyk is a low-event player who is solid and helps his team win. Those players are almost always underrated by fans who overrate high event players with constant regularity.
- James_Tanner

Again, McCabe had more points, less penalties per 60 and lead our team in plus minus, yet you say it is "stats" that make this comparison a no brainer in Pysyk's favor. Keep in mind every Sabres fan on here disagrees with you so far. The Sabres Coaching staff disagrees with you so far. I'll keep "my eyes", you keep your stats...whatever those stats actually are...Corsi? Shot suppression? Possession numbers? McCabe is both, much more valuable than Pysyk and a better player. End of story.

Not trying to be an ass, but I really think you got this one wrong and I have read your articles before, it's not a pattern so I'm suprised/curious why you feel this way.

The only one here entertaining this subject realistically is me.

The Leafs are not trading the pick - 100% chance they select Matthews.

But, if a trade were to go down - which it wouldn't - it would be like the Lindros trade. A trade that may well have actually worked out for Quebec more than the team that got Lindros.

If the Coyotes paid what it would actually cost to get Toronto to pass on a guy who has a chance to be an all-time player, they would ruin their team.

But, just hypothetically speaking, if a trade were to occur, Toronto isn't taking dime-a-dozen- good players like Domi and Strome. They are taking the Hall of fame D man and a hell of a lot more. (to balance out for the fact they already missed out on 7 years of OEL's career).

Which is why there can not be a trade - what it would cost to get the Leafs to pass on Matthews would be way more than any team would ever pay.

The idea they'd pass up a generational player in exchange for a couple really good players is preposterous.
- James_Tanner

Dime-a-dozen?? By your thinking, Tavares, stamps, and even guys like Toews, Kane, Kopitar, Getzlaf, Seguin, Benn...these are all fine a dozen players because they are not Gretzky/Lemieux/Crosby/Mcdavid. First, saying Mathews is in the Mcdavid/Crosby generational class is ridiculous...nothing to suggest that is true. Second, to suggest that second tier of players is useless is ridiculous. I can't even debate with these kinds of claims, and am halfway thinking you are just trying to get a rise for more posts. I will take Tavares and OEL any day over Mathews or Ovechkin or whoever else frankly. I was kind of wanting a trade before, but now I REALLY want one just to rub it in on here thanks for debating

Hey James
Based on all your blogs from the year Arizona is thin on Centers and D depth.

With the leafs most likely having an extra top three center next year, and 5 NHL d-men fighting for 3 spots (or being subject for waivers), What do you think Arizona would realistically give up for those pieces:

I am assuming the leafs D baring a trade will look like:
Rielly Hunwick
Gardiner Zaitsev
Marincin(Babcock likes this guy) Carrick (played great this year in his audition and in the AHL)
Harrington (brought over in the Kessel trade for a reason)

What would a return look like for:
Bozak, Percy, and Corrado
Would it get the NYR 1st round pick?

What would the return look like for:
Bozak, percy, Corrado, and the Pits 1st round pick
Would it be enough for Arizona's 1st round pick?

Though you would have the best insight being a fan of both teams.
- MastaLG

The coyotes would not accept either of those trades, nor anything remotely close to them. The 7th overall is not going anywhere unless Morgan Reilly, Mitch mar we or nylander are part of a package. We'd only be interested in Bozak and would offer maybe a 3rd round pick for him.

If a Generational player only comes around so often , how come there are so many of them all of a sudden ?

If Mathews is a generational talent, what does that make McDavid? On Par?
- Jeropotato

I don't think there are so many of them all of a sudden.

When it comes to guys who are a step above even the best players of their time, there is always a few:


Mike Bossy 1977
Wayne Gretzky 1978
Mario Lemieux 1984
Eric Lindros 1992
Sidney Crosby 2005
Alexander Ovechkin 2005
Conner McDavid 2015
Auston Matthews 2016

I don't think there's an over abundance of 'generational' talents lately, just that people overuse the word.

It's funny too, last year Eichel and McDavid were both considered generational talents (McDavid obviously better) but now since Matthews is headed to Toronto, it seems like he's clearly much better than Eichel
- sbroads24

As far as I can tell, he always was considered to be better. Even last year people where saying if AM was available, he'd go ahead of Eichel.

I read somewhere their stats are pretty close where they can be compared....no where did I see he is "much" better.

But really, who cares if you have Modano or Sakic? Or Forseberg or Lindros? Or Tkachuck or Kariya?

At the end of the day, all theses players are very close in quality, it's the team around them that makes them successful.
- Jeropotato

A good point, but in his prime and while healthy Lindros was a step above all those guys.

Hey James
Based on all your blogs from the year Arizona is thin on Centers and D depth.

With the leafs most likely having an extra top three center next year, and 5 NHL d-men fighting for 3 spots (or being subject for waivers), What do you think Arizona would realistically give up for those pieces:

I am assuming the leafs D baring a trade will look like:
Rielly Hunwick
Gardiner Zaitsev
Marincin(Babcock likes this guy) Carrick (played great this year in his audition and in the AHL)
Harrington (brought over in the Kessel trade for a reason)

What would a return look like for:
Bozak, Percy, and Corrado
Would it get the NYR 1st round pick?

What would the return look like for:
Bozak, percy, Corrado, and the Pits 1st round pick
Would it be enough for Arizona's 1st round pick?

Though you would have the best insight being a fan of both teams.
- MastaLG

1) I highly doubt Hunwick returns to the Leafs. If he does, he'll play in the 6/7 spot where he belongs.

2) I don't know that the Coyotes would want anything to do with Bozak. He's garbage. Percy and Corrado don't have too much trade value, as one was claimed on waivers and the other is perilously close to being a bust. I personally would not trade a first rounder for all three.

That being said, I think both Percy and Corrado are upgrades over what the Coyotes have and they could do worse in getting those players, I just don't know you really want to burn a first to do so.

3) As for the seventh overall, hahahahahah.

As far as I can tell, he always was considered to be better. Even last year people where saying if AM was available, he'd go ahead of Eichel.
- James_Tanner

A few said that, a few said he'd be the clear cut 3rd overall.

He could be the better player no doubt, but JE was considered a generational player along with CM. Now you hear people in Toronto talking about Eichel as if he isn't on the same planet as CM and AM

Again, McCabe had more points, less penalties per 60 and lead our team in plus minus, yet you say it is "stats" that make this comparison a no brainer in Pysyk's favor. Keep in mind every Sabres fan on here disagrees with you so far. The Sabres Coaching staff disagrees with you so far. I'll keep "my eyes", you keep your stats...whatever those stats actually are...Corsi? Shot suppression? Possession numbers? McCabe is both, much more valuable than Pysyk and a better player. End of story.

Not trying to be an ass, but I really think you got this one wrong and I have read your articles before, it's not a pattern so I'm suprised/curious why you feel this way.
- RhinoFan

The reason I would rather have Pysyk is because he has better possession numbers, he demonstrably makes his teammates better and McCabe makes his teamates worse and has lousy possession numbers.

Pysyk has shot suppression and shot generation numbers akin to a top pairing player, while providing roughly the same amount of points per 60 as McCabe.

Plus Minus is not a stat I'd mention if I wanted anyone in 2016 to listen to me.

PS I don't think you're an ass, it's OK to disagree with me haha. You asked for my opinion, and are free to give yours. We do not have to agree. But I definitely would pay more to acquire Pysyk than McCabe.

I don't think there are so many of them all of a sudden.

When it comes to guys who are a step above even the best players of their time, there is always a few:


Mike Bossy 1977
Wayne Gretzky 1978
Mario Lemieux 1984
Eric Lindros 1992
Sidney Crosby 2005
Alexander Ovechkin 2005
Conner McDavid 2015
Auston Matthews 2016

I don't think there's an over abundance of 'generational' talents lately, just that people overuse the word.
- James_Tanner

You call Mathews generational but not Laine or Eichel?

Dime-a-dozen?? By your thinking, Tavares, stamps, and even guys like Toews, Kane, Kopitar, Getzlaf, Seguin, Benn...these are all fine a dozen players because they are not Gretzky/Lemieux/Crosby/Mcdavid. First, saying Mathews is in the Mcdavid/Crosby generational class is ridiculous...nothing to suggest that is true. Second, to suggest that second tier of players is useless is ridiculous. I can't even debate with these kinds of claims, and am halfway thinking you are just trying to get a rise for more posts. I will take Tavares and OEL any day over Mathews or Ovechkin or whoever else frankly. I was kind of wanting a trade before, but now I REALLY want one just to rub it in on here thanks for debating
- Dahlmanyotes

You totally misunderstand. All I am saying is that your second tier non-generational players are not that difficult to aquire in terms of getting an Ovechkin or whoever else. I mean there are about 5 "generational" players to come into the NHL since 1978, and if Matthews is possibly one of those, you wouldn't trade him for anything.

I mean, if it was 2005 and you could somehow get Thornton, Hossa, Bergeron and Lecavelier for Crosby, you'd say no every time. That's my point. You don't ever want to be the team that moves an all-time great, which makes the price ridiculous.

The Leafs could look at an offer of Domi, Strome, 7th pick and say "wow that is pretty amazing for one guy," but when you factor the risk/reward of the situation it's not worth it because, sure, AM could end up being Daigle 2.0, but what if he turns out to be the Mario to Connor's Wayne? What if Strome is a dud and the Seventh pick is wasted?

There is just no situation when you have a player with that kind of upside where it makes sense to pass on him. This doesn't mean I am saying the Coyotes should guy their team to get him, because that is stupid too. It just means there is no trade to do.

A few said that, a few said he'd be the clear cut 3rd overall.

He could be the better player no doubt, but JE was considered a generational player along with CM. Now you hear people in Toronto talking about Eichel as if he isn't on the same planet as CM and AM
- sbroads24

The only people putting the generational tag on Eichel were the same clowns saying that Edmonton might pick him, that it wasn't for sure they were going with McDavid.

It's also the same people now saying how Laine might go #1. He won't. No shame in Eichel being a Lafontaine, a Kariya or Stamkos even. But he isn't on McDavid's level and all it took was to watch them each play once. I mean, out of the gate McDavid is doing things no one else in the NHL can do. He's insane.

You call Mathews generational but not Laine or Eichel?
- Jeropotato

That is what I am saying. Both will be good. I wouldn't call Stamkos or Tavares "generational" either. Just rock-solid superstar players who will end up in the Hall of Fame.

The only people putting the generational tag on Eichel were the same clowns saying that Edmonton might pick him, that it wasn't for sure they were going with McDavid.

It's also the same people now saying how Laine might go #1. He won't. No shame in Eichel being a Lafontaine, a Kariya or Stamkos even. But he isn't on McDavid's level and all it took was to watch them each play once. I mean, out of the gate McDavid is doing things no one else in the NHL can do. He's insane.
- James_Tanner

I guess I'm sort of confused by your definitions then. Tyson Barrie is a superstar, Jack Eichel who is widely considered to be maybe the 2nd or 3rd best prospect to come out in the last decade can't be considered generational?

The only people putting the generational tag on Eichel were the same clowns saying that Edmonton might pick him, that it wasn't for sure they were going with McDavid.

It's also the same people now saying how Laine might go #1. He won't. No shame in Eichel being a Lafontaine, a Kariya or Stamkos even. But he isn't on McDavid's level and all it took was to watch them each play once. I mean, out of the gate McDavid is doing things no one else in the NHL can do. He's insane.
- James_Tanner

Also, people called Eichel generational well before Edmonton won the lottery.

Dylan Strome will be a good player. He could be Tavares good.

Auston Matthews is a freak. He could be Lemieux good.


Players like Matthews just don't come around very often. There is absolutely no reason to think he will be anything less than the Ovechkin to McDavid's Crosby.
- James_Tanner

Really I have heard nothing of Matthews being Lemieux good. Is that true ?

That is what I am saying. Both will be good. I wouldn't call Stamkos or Tavares "generational" either. Just rock-solid superstar players who will end up in the Hall of Fame.
- James_Tanner

I never heard Mathews was projected to be as good as Crosby or McDavid....nor have I heard he would be better than Eichel. In fact, if he had a different birthday I heard he woul likely project 3rd in the 2015 draft.

Really I have heard nothing of Matthews being Lemieux good. Is that true ?
- HamiltonHawk

Is it true? Nobody knows if they don't have a crystal ball.

Also, people called Eichel generational well before Edmonton won the lottery.
- sbroads24

Yes but only in the annoying McEichel crap everyone was going on about in order to make the draft more entertaining. I don't think any serious person ever thought the two were interchangeable.

Yes but only in the annoying McEichel crap everyone was going on about in order to make the draft more entertaining. I don't think any serious person ever thought the two were interchangeable.
- James_Tanner

No but now, in separate draft you're widening the Gap between Mathews and Eichel? Why? Because Eichel didn't score a point per game as a rookie and Mathews is shiny and new?

I never heard Mathews was projected to be as good as Crosby or McDavid....nor have I heard he would be better than Eichel. In fact, if he had a different birthday I heard he woul likely project 3rd in the 2015 draft.
- Jeropotato

That's because he was 2 days too young for last years draft, but had he been available, he'd be almost a full year behind everyone else. I am pretty sure (too lazy to look it up right now) he outperformed Eichel in the college league, then went to Switzerland to play against men where he may end up being league MVP.

You're right though, there is so much dissenting and conflicting information, hyperbole, etc plus the fact that none of us has seen the players play all that much, there aren't many, if any, advanced stats for the leagues they play in etc etc etc.

So he could be anywhere from a decent player to hall of famer to best of his generation. It is impossible to know at this point. Personally, based on the information I have, the people I've talked to and the things I've read, I think he's likely to be the second best player of his generation - but of course, that's a guess and yours is as good as mine.

That's because he was 2 days too young for last years draft, but had he been available, he'd be almost a full year behind everyone else. I am pretty sure (too lazy to look it up right now) he outperformed Eichel in the college league, then went to Switzerland to play against men where he may end up being league MVP.

You're right though, there is so much dissenting and conflicting information, hyperbole, etc plus the fact that none of us has seen the players play all that much, there aren't many, if any, advanced stats for the leagues they play in etc etc etc.

So he could be anywhere from a decent player to hall of famer to best of his generation. It is impossible to know at this point. Personally, based on the information I have, the people I've talked to and the things I've read, I think he's likely to be the second best player of his generation - but of course, that's a guess and yours is as good as mine.
- James_Tanner

Actually, your guess is not as good as mine.


That's been proven with you're ridiculous predictions year after year.


And that " year behind " you speak of occurred when they were 5 and 6 years old.

Is it true? Nobody knows if they don't have a crystal ball.
- Jeropotato

I don't recall reading any reviews of him that compared him to Lemiuex