Only teams that really make sense:

Calgary - Fleury wont waive his NTC.
Dallas - Too much salary tied up in meh goaltenders.
Toronto - Best fit IMO.
Buffalo - Maybe he would like playing for Bylsma again.

Murray is not getting traded. Pens are Cap tight so its worth the risk passing the reigns to Murray if he continues his great play. A deal centered around MAF for JVR would make a lot of sense.
- MacPatty

Calgary who knows. Fleury knows he won't be protected in the expansion draft. So he should be willing to play ball on his no trade list.
Toronto - decent fit. If they sign stamkos then making a move on a goalie makes sense too
Buffalo - looks like great fit to me. Keeps him on the east coast. Close to where he grew up. Buffalo has plenty of assets to move.

flames can't/won't take MAF's deal, even if pittsburgh agreed to take on wideman to balance salaries.

hell, i dont even know if they'll be able to sign Reimer

that's the stupidest comment I have ever heard. Fleury is a top notch goalie and any team would give their 1st round pick plus, plus.
- allaboutpens

Nope.

Looking at the landscape of which teams need a starting goalie, I would suggest Calgary, Vancouver, Edmonton, Toronto, Ottawa, Buffalo in no particular order. Let the bidding begin on Draft Day to see who comes up with the best package or early pick for the rights to Mark Andre Fleury.
- allaboutpens

Pretty sure you'll be disappointed.

Nope.
- TandA4Flames

As a Pens fan, I'd take a late 1st or 2 2nds from Calgary... That seems reasonable.

Pretty sure you'll be disappointed.
- TandA4Flames

also edmonton, ottawa, buffalo already have goalies and vancouver's tied to miller for another year

As a Pens fan, I'd take a late 1st or 2 2nds from Calgary... That seems reasonable.
- hipcheck_goalie

again this rumor is probably pre-empted above all by calgary's cap situation

also, goalies rarely get great returns in trades hth

As a Pens fan, I'd take a late 1st or 2 2nds from Calgary... That seems reasonable.
- hipcheck_goalie

I agree, this is a reasonable trade. Still, I'm not sure MAF would be a guy CGY would be looking at when you consider age, expected timeline to be a true contender etc.

I was reading on another site some offers and value's for our 6th OA. Some pretty good offers. I think my favourite was Kuemper, Zucker and #15 for #6. Another was Osgood (w/ salary retention to put him @ $4mil) Nyquist, Pulkinen and a couple of other assets for #6, Wideman and either Wotherspoon or Jokipakka. Both are nice and bring both a #1 goalie and a top 6 winger.

I agree, this is a reasonable trade. Still, I'm not sure MAF would be a guy CGY would be looking at when you consider age, expected timeline to be a true contender etc.

I was reading on another site some offers and value's for our 6th OA. Some pretty good offers. I think my favourite was Kuemper, Zucker and #15 for #6. Another was Osgood (w/ salary retention to put him @ $4mil) Nyquist, Pulkinen and a couple of other assets for #6, Wideman and either Wotherspoon or Jokipakka. Both are nice and bring both a #1 goalie and a top 6 winger.
- TandA4Flames

this is sarcastic right, kuemper is not a 1 and howard (which is who i assume you mean by osgood) has an absolutely horrendous contract. skeptical detroit would be so generous with the throw-ins, too

i think Reimer and Andersen are still at top of the list for goalie targets

As a Pens fan, I'd take a late 1st or 2 2nds from Calgary... That seems reasonable.
- hipcheck_goalie

Very marginal value for Pittsburgh. Assume Fleury is the guy selected in the expansion draft if we hold on to him. If we trade him someone else is selected. I don't think sprong will be eligible. So we will either have to expose Pouliot, Cole, Schultz (probably resign him) and most of the WBS call-ups. Maybe Hagelin too.

Whatever we get for Fleury has to be better than what we lose. And significant enough to get us to make a deal this offseason instead of keeping him as a tandem for next year.

Very marginal value for Pittsburgh. Assume Fleury is the guy selected in the expansion draft if we hold on to him. If we trade him someone else is selected. I don't think sprong will be eligible. So we will either have to expose Pouliot, Cole, Schultz (probably resign him) and most of the WBS call-ups. Maybe Hagelin too.

Whatever we get for Fleury has to be better than what we lose. And significant enough to get us to make a deal this offseason instead of keeping him as a tandem for next year.
- sditulli

the thing is, aside from cap problems (which might be more pressing) there's no real urgency to moving fleury now. if we assume expansion is announced at NHL Awards or draft this year, that puts expansion draft likely next offseason at earliest. that means Pens and other teams with expansion list questions have another year to figure out deals for these guys.

although, in fleury's case if he's looking at a 1B scenario heading into next year it's probably best to trade him now before his value gets lower because of that. still, though, something to keep in mind when you speculate on guys getting traded due to expansion draft concerns

on the other hand, look at the history last several years of goalie trades and you'll find more often than not, they're not worth that much in trades because there's always only so many vacancies for them

Calgary who knows. Fleury knows he won't be protected in the expansion draft. So he should be willing to play ball on his no trade list.
Toronto - decent fit. If they sign stamkos then making a move on a goalie makes sense too
Buffalo - looks like great fit to me. Keeps him on the east coast. Close to where he grew up. Buffalo has plenty of assets to move.
- sditulli

He literally has to be because he has a NMC. Unless the NHL opens the door to allow players with NMCs to waive and he decides to do so, then you guys have to protect him. As each team in the expansion draft can only protect one goalie, you'd be leaving Murray open to the expansion draft.

EDIT: Source in case you want it.

http://www.sportsnet.ca/h...ughts-players-drop-draft/

He literally has to be because he has a NMC. Unless the NHL opens the door to allow players with NMCs to waive and he decides to do so, then you guys have to protect him.
- MaximumBone

i forgot about this. lotta teams liked the expansion draft a lot less when this rule was made official

i forgot about this. lotta teams liked the expansion draft a lot less when this rule was made official
- S Kaspar Rollins

I've been reading this whole thread like "How did everyone miss this point?"

Very marginal value for Pittsburgh. Assume Fleury is the guy selected in the expansion draft if we hold on to him. If we trade him someone else is selected. I don't think sprong will be eligible. So we will either have to expose Pouliot, Cole, Schultz (probably resign him) and most of the WBS call-ups. Maybe Hagelin too.

Whatever we get for Fleury has to be better than what we lose. And significant enough to get us to make a deal this offseason instead of keeping him as a tandem for next year.
- sditulli

Getting to keep Matt Murray is better than not

I've been reading this whole thread like "How did everyone miss this point?"
- MaximumBone

He has a limited NMC which doesn't require them to protect him... Also I would gladly take a late first and lose a Sheary, Rust, Sundquist... They have value but they are not fetching a first if you tried... Lose a piece that you can replace and that's a forward.

He has a limited NMC which doesn't require them to protect him... Also I would gladly take a late first and lose a Sheary, Rust, Sundquist... They have value but they are not fetching a first if you tried... Lose a piece that you can replace and that's a forward.
- hipcheck_goalie

According to General Fanager, he has a limited NTC, but has a full NMC. It might be wrong and some sites say limited others just mention NMC. Also, I have yet to read anything exempting limited-NMCs. What led you to that conclusion?

http://www.generalfanager.com/players/1588

this is sarcastic right, kuemper is not a 1 and howard (which is who i assume you mean by osgood) has an absolutely horrendous contract. skeptical detroit would be so generous with the throw-ins, too

i think Reimer and Andersen are still at top of the list for goalie targets
- S Kaspar Rollins

Oops, yep I meant Howard. And i realize Kuemper is not currently a #1 buf he has the ability and i think he csn break out this year with the opportunity. He'd cost a bell of a lot less than guys like MAF (apparently). Also with the Howard deal, if it came with those other assets, i would suffer potentially for those 3 years.

According to General Fanager, he has a limited NTC, but has a full NMC. It might be wrong and some sites say limited others just mention NMC.

http://www.generalfanager.com/players/1588
- MaximumBone

Maybe I'm missing something, but how can a guy have a limited ntc, and a full nmc?

Maybe I'm missing something, but how can a guy have a limited ntc, and a full nmc?
- dr_soiledpants

Fair point. My understanding is NMCs are additions to NTCs to avoid being waived or demoted as well. Contracts can be confusing and since we don't know the full details of every contract it doesn't make it any easier.

I agree, this is a reasonable trade. Still, I'm not sure MAF would be a guy CGY would be looking at when you consider age, expected timeline to be a true contender etc.

I was reading on another site some offers and value's for our 6th OA. Some pretty good offers. I think my favourite was Kuemper, Zucker and #15 for #6. Another was Osgood (w/ salary retention to put him @ $4mil) Nyquist, Pulkinen and a couple of other assets for #6, Wideman and either Wotherspoon or Jokipakka. Both are nice and bring both a #1 goalie and a top 6 winger.
- TandA4Flames

Yes true. But Matt Murray will not be available for the number 6 pick. Just look at the #6 picks since 2000 - scott hartnell,mikko koivu,scottie upshall, milan michaelek,al montoya,carey price,derrick brassard, sam gagner, nikita filatov,OEL, Brett Connolly, Mika Zibanejad, Hampus Lindholm, Sean Monahan, Jake virtanen, pavel zacha

Tell me how many guys on that list you would trade for what Matt Murray is showing right now. OEL and Carey Price. And Murray has the potential to match the career of those guys. 6th pick is too late in the draft to get a sure thing can't miss prospect. Something like a 1/8 chance of getting a franchise player. And of the rest of a little over half are filling important roles but not franchise roles.

Fair point. My understanding is NMCs are additions to NTCs to avoid being waived or demoted as well. Contracts can be confusing and since we don't know the full details of every contract it doesn't make it any easier.
- MaximumBone

I was always under the impression that a nmc included trades.

The Pens don't absolutely need to move Fleury. We're in a pretty good place cap wise. I think worse case scenario we can buy out Kunitz and be cap complient. Furthermore losing MAF to expansion isn't the end of the world. That's 6 mil in cap space. If a team wants MAF they're going to have to give us good value. Not necessarily an overpayment but something legitimately enticing. Not a second or third rounder. Having an elite goalie tandum next year with Murray and MAF is worth more to the team than a bellow 1st round pick.

I was always under the impression that a nmc included trades.
- dr_soiledpants

Then why would any contract contain both? If a NMC also covers trades, why include a NTC or limited-NTC?

seems alot of people are REALLY undervaluing maf... people only seems to care about the blunders that maf has made. still a better goalie than most goalies in the nhl