Well no poop they weren't, as you already pointed out, McDavid only played half a season. He also didn't even play with EBS until after he came back from his injury.
What were those players PPG pace when he did play with them??? Again "context". Are you aware of this concept, or just have no capacity to apply it to your thoughts?
- leonkennedy

And what was Kane's PPG pace (shattering his career highs) when playing with Panarin? Is that context enough for you?

Checkmate.

Don't really think your metaphors make sense in this case...

Regardless, my point is for one season I think Panarin's 77pts in 80 games is more useful to a team that wants to win than 48 pts in 45 games. I don't think anyone would argue that Panarin is the better player, but these awards go season by season and this season McDavid wasn't the best in the rookie category. It wasn't his fault because of injury but we can't speculate on what could have happened, we can only go by actual stats and facts.
- 13sundin13

Those metaphors do apply indirectly (Might be a tad bit extreme though).
If you are looking at the view from the top, you won't see the factors underneath. Sure points look cool and all, but you have to dissect and see the attributed measurements of what that player actually did and how it applies towards the award's criteria.

As for the metaphors, russian roulette = hit or miss -> you either see actual factors or not (Just points), with either one going either way.
Shooting blind = being told where to shoot (Told to "aim" at the points) -> there are other factors that should be considered, yet are ignored (This applies the best imo).

And what was Kane's PPG pace when playing with Panarin? Is that context enough for you?

Checkmate.
- As_I_See_It

If context to you is that Kane =Hall, Ebs, Yak, or Pouliot, then good god man.
First you point out that Panini played 80 games, was less than a ppg player, and elevated Kane to a new career high. Then you suggest McDavid didn't do the same when he played with 4 wingers you listed in half a season. Wow? Gee ya think?
Was nice of you to point out something important though, McDavid elevated the game of 4 players on a poopty team, 2 of those players far from being elite. Panini elevated the game of an already established NHL superstar. Clap, Clap, Clap.

this is not a concept the oilers understand..... similar to evaluation of trade value... oilers are in a world of their own
- derm10

Please enlighten me about your worldy mightiness to understand all things eternal...

Anywho, the Calder should go a little something like this.

Ghost>McDavid>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Panarin

and this is coming from an Oiler fan.

Please enlighten me about your worldy mightiness to understand all things eternal...

Anywho, the Calder should go a little something like this.

Ghost>McDavid>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Panarin

and this is coming from an Oiler fan.



- EdmHockeyMan

Its amazing the amount of leafs fans come to an Oilers thead to discuss an award that no one from there team is even in the conversation about. So driven from their insecurity to troll the Oilers.

If context to you is that Kane =Hall, Ebs, Yak, or Pouliot, then good god man.
First you point out that Panini played 80 games, was less than a ppg player, and elevated Kane to a new career high. Then you suggest McDavid didn't do the same when he played with 4 wingers you listed in half a season. Wow? Gee ya think?
Was nice of you to point out something important though, McDavid elevated the game of 4 players on a poopty team, 2 of those players far from being elite. Panini elevated the game of an already established NHL superstar. Clap, Clap, Clap.
- leonkennedy

You might want to reread that post. I clearly stated that McD's impact on those player's seasons was little to nothing considering the numbers they had put up in previous seasons.

Look at you arguing semantics with Leafs and Oilers fans about a player from neither of our teams... Ohhhhh how the all-knowing and mighty Hawks fans have fallen, and quick!

Those metaphors do apply indirectly (Might be a tad bit extreme though).
If you are looking at the view from the top, you won't see the factors underneath. Sure points look cool and all, but you have to dissect and see the attributed measurements of what that player actually did and how it applies towards the award's criteria.

As for the metaphors, russian roulette = hit or miss -> you either see actual factors or not (Just points), with either one going either way.
Shooting blind = being told where to shoot (Told to "aim" at the points) -> there are other factors that should be considered, yet are ignored (This applies the best imo).
- EdmHockeyMan

Still dont think they fully make sense but we'll have to agree to disagree.

You're right, points aren't everything but they are a big part of it, if McDavid did everything he did but had 40 pts in 45 games I dont think he makes the final 3. Sure there are many more factors, but it's all moot if a player doesn't play enough games. Crosby is probably the best player in the league but he's not winning the Hart every year just because of that, he still has to have a great season. I'm actually curious to see what other stats and facts you have that would prove McDavid had the better season that doesn't include his point totals.

Would you guys take on Bickell's contract (1 year at 4.5) if we got Shaw and sent Korpikoski (1 year at 2.5) back? Blackhawks gain 2mil in space from Korpikoski and a likely 3-3.5 from Shaw. Minimum qualifying offer for him is 2.5mil this coming offseason. Fits a role at 3C and might make a perfect compliment to McDavid and Leon down the road.

Man you guys are STILL on about this Calder bullsh!t? Damn. I was hoping I had missed it.

I think Panarin should get award. Just play the hand that has been dealt. Long term you can reason that there is some advantage in McDavid missing out. Despite missing a large part of the season he still ended the year "nearly" winning the Calder.

McDavid is on track to be the highest paid player in the NHL by age 22, perhaps the first to break $100m. Is there any need for people to think he is not being fully recognized.

Please enlighten me about your worldy mightiness to understand all things eternal...

Anywho, the Calder should go a little something like this.

Ghost>McDavid>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Panarin

and this is coming from an Oiler fan.



- EdmHockeyMan

When it comes down to it they are all good players. It is tough to compare a defenseman to a forward. With that said, I think this comes down to Panarin and whether he is the best rookie this year. The people voting are going to look just at this season.

I think we can also agree that McDavid is by far the better player. He won rookie of the month almost every month he played in. By the time he is Panarin's age this will not even be a question. Should Connor win? Maybe. Is he going to? Absolutely not. Look at the people voting. Look at them on a map. Then also read their articles or watch them speak about this subject. I have seen almost no one that thinks it is not hands down Panarin.

With that said. The Oilers DO have the best rookie this year and the future looks brighter than normal for us fans thanks to Connor.

People are all gonna use criteria that supports their bias


I'm hearing "contributes to team success" or "played a full season " a lot lately

Neither of which are in the description of what the Calder is awarded for .

"the player selected as the most proficient in his first year of competition in the National Hockey League (NHL)."

- Ihateallofu

Why didn't Greztky win the Calder in 1980? It was his first year in the NHL.

Garth suggests Hall and 4th overall to Buffalo for 8th, Ennis, Gorges and Pysyk.


I'm not kidding
- lumlums

Deal. no Take Backsies.

(frank) Off!!!
- leonkennedy

I agree with this also.

And what was Kane's PPG pace (shattering his career highs) when playing with Panarin? Is that context enough for you?

Checkmate.
- As_I_See_It

Panarin elevated Kane ? Try other way around

In the 37 games he missed, almost 1/2 the season, McDavid was obviously a non-factor. No way he is deserving of the Calder.

Aw (frank) it!
McDavid only played half a season. Panarin is in his mid 20's with over 200 KHL games to his credit and was Kane's sidekick in a career year.
Just give the Calder to Ghost and be done with it. He lead his team to the playoffs as a rookie D, almost single handedly made Philly's PP an actual scoring danger, and has no reasonable argument against him unlike the other two.

Aw (frank) it!
McDavid only played half a season. Panarin is in his mid 20's with over 200 KHL games to his credit and was Kane's sidekick in a career year.
Just give the Calder to Ghost and be done with it. He lead his team to the playoffs as a rookie D, almost single handedly made Philly's PP an actual scoring danger, and has no reasonable argument against him unlike the other two.
- Wildschwein

That got boring quick, especially with halfwits like derp10 attempting to pontificate in a manner way above his capabilities.
"disprove my statement "

I can't help but feel embarrassed for guys like him when I read his posts that are trying to appear intelligent.

Anyways, if people want to use more games played, all good then.
Fact is that connor is by far the best rookie and even one of the best players in the league for any age.

Who cares what criteria they use to hand out the trophy?

Holy poop there's some retannering going on in this thread.

Holy poop there's some retannering going on in this thread.
- smellmyfinger

Tis the season.

Riding the coat tails of Patrick Kane.
- LittleRickyV2

You don't ride coat tails and collect 77 points. At what point would you give the kid credit for having talent? 100pts? If this were true he would have 30 goals and 10 assists. This would be evidence that he was just tapping goals. Panarin finished with 47 Assists which is great production for a kid that has never played in the NHL. That is called "Chemistry". Its a unique situation but he fit perfectly with his line mates.

That being said, I would take McD on my team any day over the other two finalists but you can't ignore the production of Ghost and Panarin in a season where McD was hurt. Panarin deserves to win.

McDavid is going to win it guys, you can argue all you want about age, stats, quality of competition, being clutch etc until you are blue in the face

Its a stupid award voted on by idiots like Cox and Simmons. Mainstream hockey guys have a hard on for McDavid, he sells papers and stories.

They will vote for him just so they can write abou thim

McDavid is going to win it guys, you can argue all you want about age, stats, quality of competition, being clutch etc until you are blue in the face

Its a stupid award voted on by idiots like Cox and Simmons. Mainstream hockey guys have a hard on for McDavid, he sells papers and stories.

They will vote for him just so they can write abou thim
- DDM-Coga

Stop making sense you fat mother(frank)er. Jack Eichel rulez.

Stop making sense you fat mother(frank)er. Jack Eichel rulez.
- smellmyfinger

you know who doesnt rule, Bob Hartley.

Suck it Whipper and Fake Whippers

As a Flyers fan, I am satisfied that Ghost is a finalist. As for who actually wins the award... while I'm obviously hoping Ghost will win, you can make a case for either of the other two, as numerous posters here have already done. I don't think I would be that disappointed if either Panarin or McDavid won.