I can tell you 100% that what John says is accurate and you can look no further at the GM in Florida. it started then and hasn't stopped since......If/when it does stop it's only because the president is no longer employed at 1901 w Madison.
- SteveRain

I have little faith in the front office to make this team better going into next year. They were handed a very talented group, and they've made some good moves, but just as many, if not more questionable ones. Seems to be far too much hesitation and indecision, probably fueled in large part by all the people who get a say in the process.

Sustained success in the salary cap era isn't easy, but if we had a different captain, not just saying Dale, but maybe Lombardi, or even a Bob Murray to throw a name out there, I wonder where they'd be. What could he have spun out of a Sharp situation for example?

Right wing, good, but a non-physical perimeter guy.

Center, OK, responsible defensively, pretty good in the dot, but only defends with his stick, almost a complete non-factor in the cycle game. Wait, no, complete non-factor.

Left wing, no, he is not good there.

If you make a move for a quality blue liner, I still have a hard time seeing this team win a Cup without Crawford (and I am a Darling fan). Without Teuvo, no problem.
- John Jaeckel

I'm not a Crow hater or all that.

I just think after months and months of reading here by most on how "bad" TT is - but then people assume moving him will get some sort of blue chip D prospect that can/will be more ready than he is or that they have now. I don't see that happening - especially at less than the 1mil he makes.

If a young Dman is out there - 1)who is he and 2) why would a team trade, when young D prospects are valuable?

He'll turn 22 at the start of next season. Went from 9pts in 34gms to 35pts in 78gms this year. While he doesn't "excel" at any of those 3 positions, he's versatile enough to play in them if/when needed. As well as PK and PP - all at less than 900k for a cap strapped team.

With Kruger going up to 3mil and never hit 30pts in a season. Possibly losing Shaw's 30+ pts

Panarin in the KHL at 21yrs old, had 18pts in 43gms. And his game has progressed - why not continue to let TT's and see where he's at while he's still cost controlled at a decent salary?

I'm not saying don't move him if the right deal is available, but he holds way more value for the cost and potential. He'll probably be comparable to Granlund in Minny. A 40pt guy in his career. And there's nothing wrong with that - until he want's 3mil a year. But at 900k on a cap max team.....there's too much value for them here, IMO

Can't say we've ever had a great 2C (Anisimov might be the best), but I largely agree with your points. Maybe we can make another run to the finals near the end of Kane and Toews's careers, assuming they're still playing at a high enough level (like Thornton/Marleau), and that we've drafted really well, but yeah, I think the trading Cups with LA thing is over. It would be nice to get one more down the road.

Just imagine if there was no salary cap though. Man.
- Aroza

The "common man" likely would never be able to afford to go to a game again.

Yes, but it depends on how much Cap benefit there was to his cheater contract while with each team.
- djamon

If it's a legal contract when it was signed (which it was) - how is it a "cheater contract"?

It's going to be tough to win going forward when a 60 point player is taking up $10 mill in cap space.

The "common man" likely would never be able to afford to go to a game again.
- stashu

(A) The "common man" can't afford tickets today in many markets - and in places like Arizona, he doesn't care.

(B) The "common man" would be in no worse of a position - but there might be contraction down to 28 or fewer teams - which would be OK with me.

The "common man" likely would never be able to afford to go to a game again.
- stashu

To be fair, I can't afford tickets to see Chicago right now. What were prices like before 2005? Baseball doesn't have a cap and attendance seems fine.

I'm not arguing for removing the cap. I think it's good. It's just hard letting go of a dynasty...

well said. 100% agreed. Daley saw he wasn't a fit because he wasn't getting top 4 minutes and look....he hasn't been a shut down D man for Pittsburgh. He's getting torched and even more so when Washington exposes him.

Shaw is a guy you can't replace. He gets his role, his versatility is there, and for everyone who loves them some Koo-ga, in a must win game on the road, who does Q bench with 5 minutes to go? Koo-ga and slides Shaw in at center.

Teuvo got benched at times during the 2nd and 3rd and really, this has to end. That kid is so damn small his one armed half @ss attempts on the forecheck dont' do squat and I feared the kid may seriously get hurt during this series. That chapter needs to be closed and move on.....
- SteveRain

All of that said, it wasn't the forward group that lost this series for the Hawks. The well established and successful game plan adopted by NHL teams that go far in the playoffs is to physically pound the opponent's defenceman, which the Blues did and it finally paid dividends by Game 7. And they still only won the series by one puck.

Remember when Bickell pounded Dumba of the Wild into submission and some of the Bruins Dmen in 2013 or when Buff took it to Pronger in 2010? That's what works and this year for once the Hawks D were on the receiving end - Seabs and Rosy took some enormous hits but at least those guys come back to play, unlike a guy like Rundblad who is just plain scared out there. Even if they had won last night to advance, the Hawks defence had been turned into ground meat.

And like I said before the series started, Troy Brouwer was going to play a key role for the Blues and that he might just have the chance to say to Q 'remember me?' And nobody on the Hawks other than Shaw ever took issue with #36's physical play over the 7 games.

My personal belief is the Hawk FO is too crowded, too "procedural," too many cooks in the kitchen for ANYONE to make the best moves in most situations. I suspect Bowman was hamstrung to a large extent by that dynamic except on the Saad deal when the team, and the rest of the FO, had NO CHOICE, but to take the deal.

I can think of at least a couple of guys they could get rid of, without naming names. And maybe one to two more who need to be kept on a shorter leash. If they don't trust Stanley to do the job, get someone else and give him the room to operate.
- John Jaeckel

>Yes, indeed
>And add to the fact that some say Q has a big voice on personnel -- that's a lot of roster "voices"
>Mentioned this before: think this organization got a bit full of itself based on the monumental achievement of 3 Cups in 6 years -- and some very poor decisions were made
>Would love to hear why Oduya was not the offseason priority -- as Al said, you cannot lose Leddy, Oduya, Johns for nothing, but the Hawks did -- and look at their D depth now
>Many of you already mentioned it -- Soupy DOES live in the Western burbs and if he could be had on the cheap would help a lot next year
>This is the biggest offseason of Toews career -- not because the Hawks lost round 1 -- not because he did not score -- as Al said, he had 6 points -- but because of his cap hit
>Toews needs to produce more offensively -- and to do so -- he needs more escape moves from tight spaces, countermoves to the bearhug, more open ice moves, and a better shot -- in short, Toews needs to be more explosive and it's only going to happen if he's willing to develop more moves to be so -- BTW -- Kane does this every summer
>Unless that D gets fixed, next year we will see a lot more unwatchable regular season home games like this year -- ticket holders deserved a refund for those games -- especially for what the Hawks charge for tickets

JJ/Al

Do either of you think Stan is the right person to be the GM going forward? For all of his warts, Tallon is a hockey guy and could judge talent. I think the hawks thought they could make up for Stan not being a real hockey guy by surrounding him with so many top notch hockey people but given what he has done in the last year, my confidence in him is nil. It almost feels like the Savard to Q change, I think we need someone else for this next leg of the journey. I just dont trust Stan to make the right decisions. He was fine when he rarely needed to pull the trigger, and could add pieces here and there, but this year was his first real chance to shine and he failed miserably.
- pierregruska

My Sentiments exactly!! 1miilion percent! Hopefully the Chicago media doesnt give him a pass, he has failed miserably this in his actual 1st year he has had to stir the ship! The last couple of re builds or re tools he still had a lot of Dales assets here, now he's got to move forward with house league players like Gusteffsson, Runblad, Svedberg, Rassmusson, Mashintor ect. NONE, I repeat, NONE of those mentioned could make any of the 29 teams roster, plus he gave up Johns, Now Gave up Danault and Dano, and is gonna lose Ladd and Shaw. The Hawks will have the most elite House league team in the NHL next season! If Bowman doesn't fix this early, Hopefully McD. Will pull the plug on him early enough and get a real hockey GM back in there like they had before!

The FO made all the right moves at the TDL and gave Q the horses to make a run.

Biggest issues for me were:

1. Q outsmarted himself by not putting the best lineup on the ice from game one of the Blues series. The hole was too deep to get out of.

2. TT exposed as a player without a role on this team. Just too physically weak to be an NHL forward on this team. Placed up and down all of the lines and found little if any effectiveness anywhere. Now the rest of the league sees the same, and his value in a deal has been diminished. Should have sold high. Drouin????

3. Bickell......just wasted money. No one will take him. Buy out is the only option.

4. Playing the top four D guys on their wrong sides most of the season.

5. $40MM of forward talent failed to show up. Captain Serious at the top of the list with a big goose egg.

6. Fatigue? Boy they looked a step or more slower for a good part of the season as well as in the Blues series.

7. Special teams hell - PP scheme with no movement and no play in the slot or the crease. A passive collapsing box scheme for the PK which gives too much time and space for opponents to score. Not to mention creating far too many sight line obstructions and redirections. It also prevents breakout opportunities for shorthanded goals.

8. Too much emphasis on stick checking and not enough body checking. Not suggesting they become meatheads, but it is clear hitting is here to stay in the league. Just would like to see some more balance here. Case in point, Seabrook's whiff on Backes feeding Tarasenko's point blank goal the other night which could have been avoided by using the body instead of the stick.

9. Too much perimeter play on the offense. Most of the top six seemed contact avoidant. You need to get in the dirty areas to score in this league.

10. Darling needs more games spread out over more time. I worry Q rode CC too hard in the regular season. A fantastic year for CC kind of lost in the shuffle of subpar play elsewhere. Anyone who thinks this team is helped by trading CC needs their head examined.

We really are spoiled, aren't we?

The 2015-16 Blackhawks were a good team. It's not good luck that saw them finish 6th in the league. Were they largely carried by Kane and Crawford? Absolutely. But that doesn't mean they weren't good. Those guys are part of the team. I would take this iteration over the 2010-11 and 2011-12 teams, and maybe even over the 2013-14 team. Certainly most fans of other teams would have preferred this team to the one they watched this year. But to a Hawks fan, 2015-16 was mediocre.

I love it. That means our expectations are high -- justifiably. But that doesn't mean that they were actually mediocre or bad. It just means that they've been better.

It's very easy to criticize the 2015-16 team when, in the past seven years, they've iced three championship teams. But really, what was the difference between this year's team and last year's team? Johnny Oduya? Maybe. But maybe it was also Brian Elliot, who played as well as any opposing goaltender has against Chicago in the playoffs in a long time. If Elliot saves only 92% of shots instead of 93%, then the Hawks win the series. It Crawford's able to come back across the goalmouth on Brouwer or if Seabrook's shot goes in, we'd have seen overtime last night. If Duncan Keith plays like Duncan Keith in the first period, they spend more time in the Blues' end of the ice, less in their own, and maybe they score one more goal or give up one fewer.

There's no denying that this team had a glaring hole in its defensive depth. It's one that should have been fixed this past summer, and it should be fixed this summer. Don't know how they'll do that, but it's what they've got to do. But you can't point to a team this year that doesn't have a hole, a team that doesn't have a flaw.

We've now had the pleasure of watching the Blackhawks in the playoffs for eight straight seasons, which would have seemed impossible a decade again. We've seen them win the Stanley Cup three times, which no other team has matched in the salary cap era. And I think all of us know that they're not done yet. The window's not closed.

I, for one, am glad to have this team, and I'm going to enjoy every second of it -- even when they fall just short like they did last night.

If it's a legal contract when it was signed (which it was) - how is it a "cheater contract"?
- StLBravesFan

Regardless of how you define it, there are penalties associated to it if he retires early.

I have little faith in the front office to make this team better going into next year. They were handed a very talented group, and they've made some good moves, but just as many, if not more questionable ones. Seems to be far too much hesitation and indecision, probably fueled in large part by all the people who get a say in the process.

Sustained success in the salary cap era isn't easy, but if we had a different captain, not just saying Dale, but maybe Lombardi, or even a Bob Murray to throw a name out there, I wonder where they'd be. What could he have spun out of a Sharp situation for example?
- howiehandles

I can't fault Bowman going for it all. I think at times he held on to guys too long and had no market to trade. if you look at all his salary dumps very little came of it. He has now, 2 times, underestimated opposing GMs with relation to offer sheets with Hammer and then this summer with Saad which he had to move to Columbus quickly to avoid having to only get back picks. That part he is to blame for.....his arrogance as to what the market will bear.

However, he's not issue. It goes higher and will always be there, and thats' why no quality GM will work for this team under this leadership group. I'd be very curious to see how long Bowman would last if his dad left the organization.......I'd give it 2 years....tops.

Sounds kind of like a Bulls front office situation. I think one of the reasons Tallon had success was because there wasn't tons of control over what he was doing. That's the same reason he's had success in Florida-- I think they let him run it and do what he needs to do. I think the Hawks front office is probably super rigid and don't really allow for the GM to be a GM. Kind of like most baseball teams these days; the manager isn't really making the calls anymore, it's the front office running the show and the skip is just a face--forced to "go with the flow"
- Hank3Henshaw

Hank , no one can convince me any different that when mcD and Rocky approached Scotty Bowman about coming on board, he said "only if my kid gets elevated to the GM's position.Dale Tallon should have stayed on as GM regarding player personal and kept Stan Bowman in the back office as the bean counter. Tell me why that wouldn't have worked other than Scotty saying " my kid or no deal!"

It's going to be tough to win going forward when a 60 point player is taking up $10 mill in cap space.
- Stalemate

How many Stanley Cup Championships did the Hawks have before Toews arrived? 3. How many Stanley Cups have the Hawks won with Toews being the leader of this team? 3!! Toews deserves every cent of the contract that he got from the Hawks. Name me 2 better all-around players in the entire world than the Hawks' Captain. He is a fantastic all-around player that could score more, but he has every year that he has played sacrificed for the good of his team. Bashing Toews pisses me off to no end!! The contract is well-deserved and I would not trade him for any player straight up in the entire NHL. Flame away all you want, but fact of the matter somebody would have paid Toews more on the open market if the Hawks would have let him reach unrestricted free agency. His game is so much more about points and the Hawks know that more than anybody!!

All of that said, it wasn't the forward group that lost this series for the Hawks. The well established and successful game plan adopted by NHL teams that go far in the playoffs is to physically pound the opponent's defenceman, which the Blues did and it finally paid dividends by Game 7. And they still only won the series by one puck.

Remember when Bickell pounded Dumba of the Wild into submission and some of the Bruins Dmen in 2013 or when Buff took it to Pronger in 2010? That's what works and this year for once the Hawks D were on the receiving end - Seabs and Rosy took some enormous hits but at least those guys come back to play, unlike a guy like Rundblad who is just plain scared out there. Even if they had won last night to advance, the Hawks defence had been turned into ground meat.

And like I said before the series started, Troy Brouwer was going to play a key role for the Blues and that he might just have the chance to say to Q 'remember me?' And nobody on the Hawks other than Shaw ever took issue with #36's physical play over the 7 games.
- RickJ

well said and I don't disagree. Big guys who hit and skate are gold. Nobody is scared of a physical game by the Hawks and nobody on the back end can hit anyone. They rely on stick checks and gap control which is fine when you're not getting destroyed time and time again.

I'm grateful for the 3 cups and the WCF finish in 2014 but for the 1st time I really see a slow decline about to happen. It was a given at some point but the NHL has caught up to them and neutralized them and I just dont' see enough in house replacements ready to become the next wave of Bollands/ Shaws/Versteegs/ Buffs etc.

With the salary cap being what it is, and the needs of this team being obvious--at least ONE, probably TWO, good, young defensemen...and the cupboard being bare in Rockford....who on this team can be traded for: 1) cap relief and 2) bring something of quality in return.

1) Crawford. But, that will leave a HUUUGE hole if Darling isn't up for the task.

2) TT. But, TT's weaknesses have been exploited by other teams, he may not bring much in return.

3) Shaw. He's a restricted free agent.

4) Hossa. Not gonna happen. He can't finish anymore, but he's too valuable for his 200 foot game.

I think that leaves either Crawford or TT getting moved....

ahh...and they baseball is a game of inches
https://twitter.com/ChiSp...status/724798194253742081
- bogiedoc

Lets play Jeopardy. Answer: A quarter of an inch. Question: What is the difference between a lazy flyout and a home run?

You know luck isn't on your side when twice in one series there is a post to post shot where neither goes in the net. Not saying scoring on both of those changes the outcome, but who knows, eh?

>Yes, indeed
>And add to the fact that some say Q has a big voice on personnel -- that's a lot of roster "voices"
>Mentioned this before: think this organization got a bit full of itself based on the monumental achievement of 3 Cups in 6 years -- and some very poor decisions were made
>Would love to hear why Oduya was not the offseason priority -- as Al said, you cannot lose Leddy, Oduya, Johns for nothing, but the Hawks did -- and look at their D depth now
>Many of you already mentioned it -- Soupy DOES live in the Western burbs and if he could be had on the cheap would help a lot next year
>This is the biggest offseason of Toews career -- not because the Hawks lost round 1 -- not because he did not score -- as Al said, he had 6 points -- but because of his cap hit
>Toews needs to produce more offensively -- and to do so -- he needs more escape moves from tight spaces, countermoves to the bearhug, more open ice moves, and a better shot -- in short, Toews needs to be more explosive and it's only going to happen if he's willing to develop more moves to be so -- BTW -- Kane does this every summer
>Unless that D gets fixed, next year we will see a lot more unwatchable regular season home games like this year -- ticket holders deserved a refund for those games -- especially for what the Hawks charge for tickets
- SnapitUpstairs

All of this. Hundred percent.

Another note, if Bowman can finally get rid of Bickell and convince Soupy to take a cap friendly deal, I will never badmouth that man again.

>Yes, indeed
>And add to the fact that some say Q has a big voice on personnel -- that's a lot of roster "voices"
>Mentioned this before: think this organization got a bit full of itself based on the monumental achievement of 3 Cups in 6 years -- and some very poor decisions were made
>Would love to hear why Oduya was not the offseason priority -- as Al said, you cannot lose Leddy, Oduya, Johns for nothing, but the Hawks did -- and look at their D depth now
>Many of you already mentioned it -- Soupy DOES live in the Western burbs and if he could be had on the cheap would help a lot next year
>This is the biggest offseason of Toews career -- not because the Hawks lost round 1 -- not because he did not score -- as Al said, he had 6 points -- but because of his cap hit
>Toews needs to produce more offensively -- and to do so -- he needs more escape moves from tight spaces, countermoves to the bearhug, more open ice moves, and a better shot -- in short, Toews needs to be more explosive and it's only going to happen if he's willing to develop more moves to be so -- BTW -- Kane does this every summer
>Unless that D gets fixed, next year we will see a lot more unwatchable regular season home games like this year -- ticket holders deserved a refund for those games -- especially for what the Hawks charge for tickets
- SnapitUpstairs

Agree completely on this. You look at Kane's development his shot has improved tremendously. He (when playing all out) throws body checks, wins board battles, forces turnovers, and now has several "power" type moves. When he is on top of his game he is unpredictable and a nightmare for D-men. Toews offensive game has become a bit stale and predictable. He has the skill set. Every O-zone possession does not need to be a grinding cycle down low. He takes a lot of abuse playing that game night in night out. His body has to be worn down.

>Yes, indeed
>And add to the fact that some say Q has a big voice on personnel -- that's a lot of roster "voices"
>Mentioned this before: think this organization got a bit full of itself based on the monumental achievement of 3 Cups in 6 years -- and some very poor decisions were made
>Would love to hear why Oduya was not the offseason priority -- as Al said, you cannot lose Leddy, Oduya, Johns for nothing, but the Hawks did -- and look at their D depth now
>Many of you already mentioned it -- Soupy DOES live in the Western burbs and if he could be had on the cheap would help a lot next year
>This is the biggest offseason of Toews career -- not because the Hawks lost round 1 -- not because he did not score -- as Al said, he had 6 points -- but because of his cap hit
>Toews needs to produce more offensively -- and to do so -- he needs more escape moves from tight spaces, countermoves to the bearhug, more open ice moves, and a better shot -- in short, Toews needs to be more explosive and it's only going to happen if he's willing to develop more moves to be so -- BTW -- Kane does this every summer
>Unless that D gets fixed, next year we will see a lot more unwatchable regular season home games like this year -- ticket holders deserved a refund for those games -- especially for what the Hawks charge for tickets
- SnapitUpstairs

As always spot on.

Problem I also see is Toews doesn't have the talent around him next year to produce like he will need to. Hossa is a great 200 ft player but his elite finishing days are over. In a loaded Hawks team he's probably a 3rd line player. I also dont' think you can bet on Panik to play 1Lw...so again, that's why resigning Shaw has to be a priority.

Otherwise you aren't fixing the same holes from this year, and on top of that are creating new ones.

Biggest offseason in Bowman era has arrived. Should be interesting to see where things go, and shopping Kruger for right return can't be ruled out.

Can't say we've ever had a great 2C (Anisimov might be the best), but I largely agree with your points. Maybe we can make another run to the finals near the end of Kane and Toews's careers, assuming they're still playing at a high enough level (like Thornton/Marleau), and that we've drafted really well, but yeah, I think the trading Cups with LA thing is over. It would be nice to get one more down the road.

Just imagine if there was no salary cap though. Man.
- Aroza

The salary Cap sucks, there's no doubt. You could build a pretty good team around the guys you've had to lose because of it (Sharp, Ladd, Buffy, Daley, Saad off the top of my head).

You guys still have some runs left, with the elite players you have you're still a top 6 team, IMO. But the depth has taken a real hit, and without the ability to backfill from the draft it catches up to you eventually.

I know this, as a Leaf fan the Hawks are the blueprint.

Its funny how in June 2015 Stan was the best GM and Q was the best coach. After one early playoff exit on the past 4 seasons the villagers are out with their pitchforks demanding blood.

Stan and Q are the same GM and coach they were a year ago. They are both among the top of their respective peers and we are fortunate to have them. Are both Stan and Q perfect? No, but there isn't a GM or coach out there who is.

There are lots of potential reasons why the boys lost early this season - fatigue, increased quality of opposition, negative impacts of salary cap, poor coaching decisions. But there are still a lot of positives about this team and realistically there's no reason why they won't contend again next season.

Everyone take a deep breath. Losing hurts but this run is far from over.

Its funny how in June 2015 Stan was the best GM and Q was the best coach. After one early playoff exit on the past 4 seasons the villagers are out with their pitchforks demanding blood.

Stan and Q are the same GM and coach they were a year ago. They are both among the top of their respective peers and we are fortunate to have them. Are both Stan and Q perfect? No, but there isn't a GM or coach out there who is.

There are lots of potential reasons why the boys lost early this season - fatigue, increased quality of opposition, negative impacts of salary cap, poor coaching decisions. But there are still a lot of positives about this team and realistically there's no reason why they won't contend again next season.

Everyone take a deep breath. Losing hurts but this run is far from over.


- DarthKane

I enjoy your posts but I really need to be sold on a realistic level how this team is a cup contender next year given the salary cap issues, etc.

I don't see it, but doesn't mean it can't happen.......