So what?
Everything he says is BS then?
He also said that the Jets wouldn't do the trade without Myers involved
Or did u forget that?
- jdfitz77

If he goes on Jack's wing what is his ceiling? I still think it's less than 20 goals. he might get 20-20-40 playing with Jack with top-6 minutes. Is that enough to take that top-6 spot from a player that is better suited for that position and might get 30 goals?

Because u have NO answer
Almost all good teams do this...
Even us the last time we were good
- jdfitz77

Why bother with you, and you wonder why this team can't make the playoffs. It's because we have a guy that can't play center and should be on the 3rd F$$kin line playing with a star player.

Multiple-Cup champs just signed a guy for 3M/year to do just that.
- stashu

They do every year. Jordan Staal was a big asset because of how he played on the 3rd line. 3rd line centers play big roles. Just because he isn't playing top 6 doesn't mean he isn't valuable, but you have to put the square peg in the square hole and not try to force him to be something that he isn't

So what?
Everything he says is BS then?
He also said that the Jets wouldn't do the trade without Myers involved
Or did u forget that?
- jdfitz77

The GM isn't gonna come out and say we are shopping him.

Just saying he would be a quality piece for a upgrade. Just like we think of Ennis as a trade piece for an upgrade.

So what?
Everything he says is BS then?
He also said that the Jets wouldn't do the trade without Myers involved
Or did u forget that?
- jdfitz77

You're part wrong, they wanted Bailey and Murray said no

we lost ror, mcginn, and ennis


with what's left girgens is not a top 6 guy up front

which IMO is sad
- homiedclown

I responded to that

No reason to break up the foligno-larsson-gionta line with how well it's been playing

And I'm not saying that Girgs MUST be in the top6
Just that it's too soon to tell
And if he ends up fitting with Jack, then GREAT
if not...
That's ok too

But I don't think it's anywhere close to being determined yet

The GM isn't gonna come out and say we are shopping him.

Just saying he would be a quality piece for a upgrade. Just like we think of Ennis as a trade piece for an upgrade.
- cabin

He's got 14 games left to try and come back and see if he can still play hockey.

"He's not top 6"

"He's passed up by a career AHLer on the 3rd line"

"He's not playing the position he was drafted at"

Not exactly stellar talk about a guy to consider not "trash" when talking about trades though. If trade talk is "Girgensons+ for X", then it's a "3rd liner at best" plus pieces worse than that for something good.

I don't see it.
- stashu

this is a good post

I responded to that

No reason to break up the foligno-larsson-gionta line with how well it's been playing

And I'm not saying that Girgs MUST be in the top6
Just that it's too soon to tell
And if he ends up fitting with Jack, then GREAT
if not...
That's ok too

But I don't think it's anywhere close to being determined yet
- jdfitz77

Girgenson's has 5 goals and 9 assists on a team that is better this year then last and he's playing with Eichel. Are we done now ?

That doesn't make them right. They can say they want him to be a 2nd line player but that doesn't mean he is. That means we have a GM/Coach who overvalues his depth players.
- Zschalberg

Or fans who are judging where the kid should be too soon

I'm just saying it's still tbd

I responded to that

No reason to break up the foligno-larsson-gionta line with how well it's been playing

And I'm not saying that Girgs MUST be in the top6
Just that it's too soon to tell
And if he ends up fitting with Jack, then GREAT
if not...
That's ok too

But I don't think it's anywhere close to being determined yet
- jdfitz77

when we have 3 guys out of the lineup (up front)

I really expect to notice girgens on the ice

I don't


he has become the invisible man

He's got 14 games left to try and come back and see if he can still play hockey.
- Zschalberg

Yeah . I wish he was here the whole season playing like last year. I don't know if he is even skating yet.

Still firmly believe that people expected too much out of this team this year... should of known it was going to be the year of experimentation. Next year will be similar but slightly better with possible additions. Might sneak into a playoff spot but most likely finish around 10th year after that no excuses why we shouldn't be in the playoffs.

As for why players weren't moved at TDL... any players worth any weight coaches and GM's are keeping for playoff runs come off-season/ FA knowing who you want or can resign and then having to make space for escalated contracts opens up new doors... perhaps GMTM had some offers for something but declined knowing that something better this off-season, but why get rid of guys just for the sake of doing so? let em finish out the year, give em a chance to raise their stock and then see where we truly are.

Everyone is all about trading 3guys and a pick for something... maybe its me but the shelves are looking thin and unless we want to pull up lame and only give ourselves 2-3 years of a really good team then you have to address that as well and cant trade away everything

I responded to that

No reason to break up the foligno-larsson-gionta line with how well it's been playing

And I'm not saying that Girgs MUST be in the top6
Just that it's too soon to tell
And if he ends up fitting with Jack, then GREAT
if not...
That's ok too

But I don't think it's anywhere close to being determined yet
- jdfitz77

If Girgensons was a rookie I would agree but he's not. You know what you have with him. He's not a sniper, not a playmaker, and not a power forward that can create a ton of space. He's a jack-of-all-trades that can do a little of everything but isn't particularly great at any one thing on offense.

Jack reminds me in this sense (and relax because I'm not comparing them directly just in this) to Crosby where he can take a bad player and make him better because of how good he is. So yes, putting Girgs with him will make him look better. But putting a better player with Jack will make him look even better.

Yeah . I wish he was here the whole season playing like last year. I don't know if he is even skating yet.
- cabin

Pretty sure I saw something earlier this week or maybe last week that he is, he's taking shots, but likely separately from the main group

Girgenson's has 5 goals and 9 assists on a team that is better this year then last and he's playing with Eichel. Are we done now ?
- SABRES 89

How many goals does Helm have playing on the 2nd line with Datsyuk?
How about Abdelkader on the top line with Zetterberg?
And they haven't missed the playoffs in like 25 years!!!

Yeah . I wish he was here the whole season playing like last year. I don't know if he is even skating yet.
- cabin

I'm pretty sure he is, from what I remember Bylsma saying on WGR a bit ago but I could be wrong. Believe he said he expected to see him again this year.

Pretty sure I saw something earlier this week or maybe last week that he is, he's taking shots, but likely separately from the main group
- stashu

Or at least no-contact.

All comes down to whether or not you want to roll 4 lines or take the quality top 2 approach...

How many goals does Helm have playing on the 2nd line with Datsyuk?
How about Abdelkader on the top line with Zetterberg?
And they haven't missed the playoffs in like 25 years!!!
- jdfitz77

IMO that is because the wings ice 9 quality players up front and 4 blue liners every night

we don't have those 13 bodies yet

All comes down to whether or not you want to roll 4 lines or take the quality top 2 approach...
- RhinoFan

Roll 3 lines, 4th is for defense. IMO.

If Girgensons was a rookie I would agree but he's not. You know what you have with him. He's not a sniper, not a playmaker, and not a power forward that can create a ton of space. He's a jack-of-all-trades that can do a little of everything but isn't particularly great at any one thing on offense.

Jack reminds me in this sense (and relax because I'm not comparing them directly just in this) to Crosby where he can take a bad player and make him better because of how good he is. So yes, putting Girgs with him will make him look better. But putting a better player with Jack will make him look even better.
- Zschalberg

We aren't gonna have 9 "top6" forwards though
Can't afford that with the Cap
Doesn't hurt to spread talent out over 3 lines, instead of loading up your top6

almost all good teams have the kind of balance I'm talking about

Still firmly believe that people expected too much out of this team this year... should of known it was going to be the year of experimentation. Next year will be similar but slightly better with possible additions. Might sneak into a playoff spot but most likely finish around 10th year after that no excuses why we shouldn't be in the playoffs.
- Havic3814

Sounds exactly like the timeline I've posted numerous times.

I had no expectations for this season other than for the team to "grow" and figure each other out. Always figured this season to be a 12-16th place sort of thing, next to be a 10-12 (with the possibility of surprising), and then 17/18 to be a 5-9 sort of season

Still firmly believe that people expected too much out of this team this year... should of known it was going to be the year of experimentation. Next year will be similar but slightly better with possible additions. Might sneak into a playoff spot but most likely finish around 10th year after that no excuses why we shouldn't be in the playoffs.

As for why players weren't moved at TDL... any players worth any weight coaches and GM's are keeping for playoff runs come off-season/ FA knowing who you want or can resign and then having to make space for escalated contracts opens up new doors... perhaps GMTM had some offers for something but declined knowing that something better this off-season, but why get rid of guys just for the sake of doing so? let em finish out the year, give em a chance to raise their stock and then see where we truly are.

Everyone is all about trading 3guys and a pick for something... maybe its me but the shelves are looking thin and unless we want to pull up lame and only give ourselves 2-3 years of a really good team then you have to address that as well and cant trade away everything
- Havic3814

We are gonna have to make some room. So many contracts and 11? Draftees coming in. RFA's UFAs ..There will be some shuffling draft day and at the end of the season.

How many goals does Helm have playing on the 2nd line with Datsyuk?
How about Abdelkader on the top line with Zetterberg?
And they haven't missed the playoffs in like 25 years!!!
- jdfitz77

Abdelkader 17 goals 19 assists

Helm 8 goals 11 assist

don't compare the Wings to the Sabres and Helm is there due to injuries.