I just found it. They were 27-25-5 when Therrien was fired. They're currently: 12-8-0. At the rate they're going, I'm pretty sure they'll match that record. They're in 5th place in the Conference. 2 points separates 4th place through 10th. The Pens can slip very quickly if they keep playing the way they are. I don't know about the rest of you, but I don't want to be holding my breath in April to see if the Penguins make it into the playoffs.

Sounds like it's a coaching issue... I've only seen a couple PIT games and I'm just shocked that they can't put the puck Inthe net.
- KINGS67

They play uninspired hockey and are boring to watch ... and this is with Crosby, Malkin, Letang and Kessel. That shouldn't happen.

They play uninspired hockey and are boring to watch ... and this is with Crosby, Malkin, Letang and Kessel. That shouldn't happen.
- Oneonta Penguin

This is nothing new though. The past 4 playoff years have just been brutal with no shows from all hte stars. Im not sure a new coach changes any of that.

I just found it. They were 27-25-5 when Therrien was fired. They're currently: 12-8-0. At the rate they're going, I'm pretty sure they'll match that record. They're in 5th place in the Conference. 2 points separates 4th place through 10th. The Pens can slip very quickly if they keep playing the way they are. I don't know about the rest of you, but I don't want to be holding my breath in April to see if the Penguins make it into the playoffs.
- simethos

I remember being angry as a new to hockey fan that they fired the coach. But they were in the 10th seed in February so I don't blame them. It obviously worked out pretty well. Haha. I hope they don't think they can have the same luck again.

This is nothing new though. The past 4 playoff years have just been brutal with no shows from all hte stars. Im not sure a new coach changes any of that.
- sammy87

Here's what bothers me about this conversation and why it's so unbearable to even come to these type of sites anymore, fans(and even the bloggers) spend hours bashing, complaining about and blaming things they don't understand for what is happening on the ice. System, system, system is all you hear and it's becoming more evident by the article that most don't truly understand what systems are in hockey yet they blame them non stop. Systems are about positioning on the ice and players responsibilities at each individual position, examples of this are the 2-1-2 forecheck, the box +1 sag, the umbrella etc, things like stretch passes, blocking shots, pinching are philosophies not systems. Going back to game 1 of last season all the way through the last game the Pens have been running basically the same systems, what has changed is the philosophies they're employing within the system and those philosophies were adjusted around the midpoint of last season to compensate for the injuries. People like RW pointing out a heavier emphasis on blocking shots as a change to the "system" are doing nothing more than exhibiting an ignorance to the game, I guess that makes sense though because that won't show up in the stat line or on a graph and apparently that's all you need anymore to know hockey.

Tomorrow nights tickets still up for sale. Face value, sec 201 row C seats 17 & 18.


Damn MJ defensive system is hurting my selling of my tickets

Here's what bothers me about this conversation and why it's so unbearable to even come to these type of sites anymore, fans(and even the bloggers) spend hours bashing, complaining about and blaming things they don't understand for what is happening on the ice. System, system, system is all you hear and it's becoming more evident by the article that most don't truly understand what systems are in hockey yet they blame them non stop. Systems are about positioning on the ice and players responsibilities at each individual position, examples of this are the 2-1-2 forecheck, the box +1 sag, the umbrella etc, things like stretch passes, blocking shots, pinching are philosophies not systems. Going back to game 1 of last season all the way through the last game the Pens have been running basically the same systems, what has changed is the philosophies they're employing within the system and those philosophies were adjusted around the midpoint of last season to compensate for the injuries. People like RW pointing out a heavier emphasis on blocking shots as a change to the "system" are doing nothing more than exhibiting an ignorance to the game, I guess that makes sense though because that won't show up in the stat line or on a graph and apparently that's all you need anymore to know hockey.
- jaydogg1974

Tomorrow nights tickets still up for sale. Face value, sec 201 row C seats 17 & 18.


Damn MJ defensive system is hurting my selling of my tickets
- nh4442

How do you guys feel about the apparently new and in affect next season 5 day bye week in the NHL?

How close does Pouliot get to landing Tyson Barrie? And would you make that trade?

How close does Pouliot get to landing Tyson Barrie? And would you make that trade?
- YouMeAndDupuis9

Yes, 1 is in the NHL the other is not and gets arrested. Not sure if that trade would ever happen.

How do you guys feel about the apparently new and in affect next season 5 day bye week in the NHL?
- Zac_O

I like it myself.

Here's what bothers me about this conversation and why it's so unbearable to even come to these type of sites anymore, fans(and even the bloggers) spend hours bashing, complaining about and blaming things they don't understand for what is happening on the ice. System, system, system is all you hear and it's becoming more evident by the article that most don't truly understand what systems are in hockey yet they blame them non stop. Systems are about positioning on the ice and players responsibilities at each individual position, examples of this are the 2-1-2 forecheck, the box +1 sag, the umbrella etc, things like stretch passes, blocking shots, pinching are philosophies not systems. Going back to game 1 of last season all the way through the last game the Pens have been running basically the same systems, what has changed is the philosophies they're employing within the system and those philosophies were adjusted around the midpoint of last season to compensate for the injuries. People like RW pointing out a heavier emphasis on blocking shots as a change to the "system" are doing nothing more than exhibiting an ignorance to the game, I guess that makes sense though because that won't show up in the stat line or on a graph and apparently that's all you need anymore to know hockey.
- jaydogg1974

My thoughts on coaches are you fire MJ if you have a replacement ready. I believe Trotz, Vignault were available the yr Disco was fired. It seemed like forever to find a coach and they had to dig deep to find MJ. If they do go that route, I hope they have someone in mind. If not 4 coaches in 6.5 yrs is pretty bad.

Yes, 1 is in the NHL the other is not and gets arrested. Not sure if that trade would ever happen.
- sammy87

One is likely to not get resigned and command pretty big money next year. The other has years left on ELC.

I wasnt saying 1 for 1. But as centerpieces in a trade. Colorado needs to be thinking of futures anyway.

Gotta agree with the guy who said his problem is with 87 and 58. Watch next game how many passes they fumble or giveaways they make. I have never seen either of these guys play like this. Sid doesn't want to skate. I have only seen him flying in 1 or 2 games all season. Maybe the system/philosophies aren't working but sid and letang should both be held accountable. Even if the system doesn't play to their strengths, they can still play well. Make crisp passes, focus on receiving passes and stop randomly losing the puck along the boards. Pay attention next game and see if you agree with me.

There are two ways to look at it. 1) You buy into the "system" in which they are 12 - 8. A winning record. A playoff position. No one is to blame what so ever. Lack of production is just a part of this system and you have to come to terms with stars not performing like you are accustomed. #87 and #58 do not stick, they are playing the system 2) You dont buy into the "system". Now the pens are ONLY 12-8, which is under performing by their standards. And every single player on the team is not producing as you are accustomed. In which you can't blame every player on the team, so the only logical problem is johnston and his poopey system.
- joecool2931

Winning games is all that matters. Goal differential is the objective. I think you missed my point however. By under performing, I'm talking about defensive responsibilities. Ironically, we're talking about 2 players that have two-way utilization. I'm not the least bit concerned w/ individual production (pts) and/or accolades. The '09 Pens were the last team to win the Cup w/ an Art Ross winner. Its not a prerequisite for post season success. And with how the game is being played today, I'd rather have Kopitar, Bergeron, Toews type players anyways. Enter HCMJ's on-ice tactics (200ft). Winning games 6-2 in Oct/Nov/Dec does nothing to help a team (mentally) prepare for Apr-Jun (where every game is decided by 1 goal margin).

Back to #58 and #87. You realize they've been on the ice for a majority of goals against? No Pens fan should be okay w/ these numbers (especially #58 - ridiculously insane)!

#58 All - 52% 5v5 - 57%
#87 All - 43% 5v5 - 54%

That is under-performing. What makes it even worse, is that they receive favorable OZ starts. Add-in the delta for any possession proxy of your choice, and one can deduce from it losing puck battles, turnovers, one-shot and done scenarios, etc... w/ the opposing team (and puck) going right back down in front of #29. These guys need to be better away from the puck/ make improvements to their positioning + coverage assignments. And fix their non-existent transition game. Offense from defense...

#58 is struggling (under statement) and needs his ice-time cut. #87 needs to realize this team's weakness is on D and that reality will force him (and others) to play more responsible (200ft) and execute better puck management decisions. At the end of the day, team results are the additive contributions from the individual parts.

Here's what bothers me about this conversation and why it's so unbearable to even come to these type of sites anymore, fans(and even the bloggers) spend hours bashing, complaining about and blaming things they don't understand for what is happening on the ice. System, system, system is all you hear and it's becoming more evident by the article that most don't truly understand what systems are in hockey yet they blame them non stop. Systems are about positioning on the ice and players responsibilities at each individual position, examples of this are the 2-1-2 forecheck, the box +1 sag, the umbrella etc, things like stretch passes, blocking shots, pinching are philosophies not systems. Going back to game 1 of last season all the way through the last game the Pens have been running basically the same systems, what has changed is the philosophies they're employing within the system and those philosophies were adjusted around the midpoint of last season to compensate for the injuries. People like RW pointing out a heavier emphasis on blocking shots as a change to the "system" are doing nothing more than exhibiting an ignorance to the game, I guess that makes sense though because that won't show up in the stat line or on a graph and apparently that's all you need anymore to know hockey.
- jaydogg1974

The Pens don't forecheck as aggressively as they did last year.
The dmen don't get involved in the rush as much.
Puck movement from the D zone to the O zone is slower and more deliberate. Players are carrying the puck from D zone to O zone more than last year where they would often execute short controlled passes. Yes, that would lead to turnovers at a higher rate, but it also leads to more offense.
Dmen aren't pinching down as often in the O zone. They also aren't challenging opponents up at the blue line. It's drop back at the blue line and collapse down in the defensive zone.

The Pens don't forecheck as aggressively as they did last year.
The dmen don't get involved in the rush as much.
Puck movement from the D zone to the O zone is slower and more deliberate. Players are carrying the puck from D zone to O zone more than last year where they would often execute short controlled passes. Yes, that would lead to turnovers at a higher rate, but it also leads to more offense.
Dmen aren't pinching down as often in the O zone. They also aren't challenging opponents up at the blue line. It's drop back at the blue line and collapse down in the defensive zone.
- jfkst1

I think hte question is should a coach be married to a system or should a coach be able to apply a system to the pieces he has to work with? Can you make guys like Kessel, Malkin, Crosby 200ft players? Are the D good enough to handle a defensive system? In hte NHL it would take way too long to acquire the pieces needed to work in 1 paticular system for a coach to last through the trials.

You look at the Hawks and Q has had a good run but they also can use players then dump them and move on similar to Belichek with the Pats. Pens decided to hang on to too many guys for hte long haul.

The Pens don't forecheck as aggressively as they did last year.
The dmen don't get involved in the rush as much.
Puck movement from the D zone to the O zone is slower and more deliberate. Players are carrying the puck from D zone to O zone more than last year where they would often execute short controlled passes. Yes, that would lead to turnovers at a higher rate, but it also leads to more offense.
Dmen aren't pinching down as often in the O zone. They also aren't challenging opponents up at the blue line. It's drop back at the blue line and collapse down in the defensive zone.
- jfkst1

What I notice about the team is that when they do forecheck they often make mistakes with a simple thing like which side of the net to attack...two guys going same side when it's clear one of them should take the other.

And the forwards are not particularly good at protecting the puck once they have possession. Sure the game has changed...and all kinds of illegal stuff is now ok...but still.

And lastly...from the forwards...we just don't really ever see them own it in the offensive zone for very long...if at all anymore.

These things tell me this team should go more north and south...shoot...look for rebounds and backcheck hard. I think if they do this...and still play sound defensively...other opportunities will arise. (I know...I know... north and south usually leads to more chances back the other way too)

They need to change things up because it seems every team knows what to expect against the Pens.

Seriously...the Minny game...Perron's goal...shot to net by Geno (not a high percentage chance of scoring but) rebound goes to a guy driving toward the net and the puck is in.

Just sayin...

Seriously...the Minny game...Perron's goal...shot to net by Geno (not a high percentage chance of scoring but) rebound goes to a guy driving toward the net and the puck is in.
- icedog97

Think this explains about ~99.7% of goals scored in today's ("dirty goal era") NHL.

Think this explains about ~99.7% of goals scored in today's ("dirty goal era") NHL.
- out_of_market

Yeah, outside of the PP, there aren't that many pretty goals. Also think it gets even more pronounced in the playoffs. All the more reason to reinforce having a team strong at dictating play rather than one that relies on high percentages for wins.

I like it myself.
- acdc1206

It doesnt seem to bad. Players made it because they were tired of working during the all star break. Or at least thats the rumor. I wonder if there are rules about practice within that 5 days?

I don't think there is a good enough replacement to fire MJ right now. It would have been nice to offer a huge deal to Babcock, but that didn't happen. It would have killed a guy to get Lindy Ruff but that didn't happen either. Carlyle is out there, and so is that Bond-villain looking Boucher. Ron Wilson. Are you getting queasy yet? Craig Berube.

The Penguins are a team that needs a coach which will call attention to obvious things which are hard to say. The stars are all 10+ years into the NHL and think that things should come easier for them. A coach who doesn't use cutesy nicknames for his players. I'm sick of Kooney and Duper. A coach that will tell 87 that his CHL days are behind him in front of his teammates during the second intermission. The men I have in mind which could change this culture enough are still employed by NHL teams.

It's either that or get a coach who lets the forwards get out there and go free-for-all and try to make the Penguins "fun to watch" before being destroyed in the Eastern quarters.

I don't think there is a good enough replacement to fire MJ right now. It would have been nice to offer a huge deal to Babcock, but that didn't happen. It would have killed a guy to get Lindy Ruff but that didn't happen either. Carlyle is out there, and so is that Bond-villain looking Boucher. Ron Wilson. Are you getting queasy yet? Craig Berube.

The Penguins are a team that needs a coach which will call attention to obvious things which are hard to say. The stars are all 10+ years into the NHL and think that things should come easier for them. A coach who doesn't use cutesy nicknames for his players. I'm sick of Kooney and Duper. A coach that will tell 87 that his CHL days are behind him in front of his teammates during the second intermission. The men I have in mind which could change this culture enough are still employed by NHL teams.

It's either that or get a coach who lets the forwards get out there and go free-for-all and try to make the Penguins "fun to watch" before being destroyed in the Eastern quarters.
- Johnny Wrath

I agree with you, hte problem is if the Pens get a hardass and if the players dont respond well, its back to square 1. When you have those levels of talent, can you really coach them at that level? Is Crosby willing to take a Yzerman role?

I just realized the 87/71 era has now lasted longer than the 66/68 era.