Colorado is one of the few organizations out there that may just be stupid enough to take a Kunitz deal and think they've won. Trading away Hornqvist at the moment is just swapping holes and shouldn't be done unless it's a stupid return like Shattenkirk or Headman or something.
- Victoro311

Avs didnt trade trade for Lovejoy, so lets look into the mirror about your own team first

Colorado traded ROR for mostly futures. Their season is already over in the Central. They will probably want the same from Duchene or Barrie. So goodbye two of Murray, Pouliot, Sprong. Kunitz would be the cap dump portion. Also, Hornqvist, Kunitz, Hornqvist, and Scuderi all have NTCs so there is zero guarantee the Pens could even trade any cap dumps to Colorado to begin with.
- jfkst1

Futures if thats what you want to call it, but they are going to pay off in the very near future. Grigorenko looks solid and is a Top 9 forward, Zadorov needed AHL time and hes excelling down there. Never mind Compher, AJ Greer and 2016 2nd that the got from it.

They needed to boost their prospect pipeline and added some really high level pieces. Both teams got what they needed.

They are 4 points out of the Wild card, trailing the Hawks. they are not out of it yet. So come on at least look up some of this stuff before making assumptions

Avs didnt trade trade for Lovejoy, so lets look into the mirror about your own team first
- DDM-Coga

That was dumb, no question. Fortunately, however, Rutherford has made a plethora of sound moves for us. The Lovejoy trade is really the only unquestionably bad move he's made. The difference between our two organizations is that you guys have a top down philosophy of discarding modern analytics and putting your faith in grit over all else. The Avs are the only organization in the NHL that we have a shot of getting something of value back for Kunitz or dumping Scuderi on. I don't believe it will happen, but if there's any organization it's the Avs

Colorado traded ROR for mostly futures. Their season is already over in the Central. They will probably want the same from Duchene or Barrie. So goodbye two of Murray, Pouliot, Sprong. Kunitz would be the cap dump portion. Also, Hornqvist, Kunitz, Hornqvist, and Scuderi all have NTCs so there is zero guarantee the Pens could even trade any cap dumps to Colorado to begin with.
- jfkst1

The pick was really the only concrete future in there. Grigorinko is young and the Avs took a flyer on him, but he's not really a future since he's in the sink or swim phase of his NHL development. Zadorov will be ready for the show soon. Since McKinon, Duchene, Landeskog, and Barrie are all pretty young, those two guys fit into their current window.

Futures if thats what you want to call it, but they are going to pay off in the very near future. Grigorenko looks solid and is a Top 9 forward, Zadorov needed AHL time and hes excelling down there. Never mind Compher, AJ Greer and 2016 2nd that the got from it.

They needed to boost their prospect pipeline and added some really high level pieces. Both teams got what they needed.

They are 4 points out of the Wild card, trailing the Hawks. they are not out of it yet. So come on at least look up some of this stuff before making assumptions
- DDM-Coga

Futures = non NHL assets. Which is exactly what they were.

Colorado is on a 3 game win streak and still dead last in their division. They are D-O-N-E.

That was dumb, no question. Fortunately, however, Rutherford has made a plethora of sound moves for us. The Lovejoy trade is really the only unquestionably bad move he's made. The difference between our two organizations is that you guys have a top down philosophy of discarding modern analytics and putting your faith in grit over all else. The Avs are the only organization in the NHL that we have a shot of getting something of value back for Kunitz or dumping Scuderi on. I don't believe it will happen, but if there's any organization it's the Avs
- Victoro311

Avs have made many great moves and trades this offseason. ROR was a good trade as they got a haul for him, especially for a guy who didn't want to play for them.
Soderberg, Beauchemin, Comeau, Skille signings have all be paying off.

The Gormley trade has been great too, hes been a solid puck moving D who good possession numbers.

As soon as Sakic got himself another Assistant GM in McFarland they have been pulling off solid moves. Trust me they are not going after Kunitz and Scuderi, not what Roy and Sakic talk about in their interviews about the vision of the organization.

Its not Sakic who is laughing in the face of analytics, its Roy, and end of the day its Sakic who is making the trade calls since he is the main main in charge and has final say in all moves. Besides Montreal (3rd game in 5 nights) they have been playing some solid fundamental hockey and having really strong possession games. Roy has changed his system lately and its paying off

Futures if thats what you want to call it, but they are going to pay off in the very near future. Grigorenko looks solid and is a Top 9 forward, Zadorov needed AHL time and hes excelling down there. Never mind Compher, AJ Greer and 2016 2nd that the got from it.

They needed to boost their prospect pipeline and added some really high level pieces. Both teams got what they needed.

They are 4 points out of the Wild card, trailing the Hawks. they are not out of it yet. So come on at least look up some of this stuff before making assumptions
- DDM-Coga

Futures is what that package is. Sure, they should pay off. I've seen Compher play the last two years and he will disappoint. Like Grigorenko and Zadorov. So, you agree that your prospect pool sucked and needed an influx of talent?

The pick was really the only concrete future in there. Grigorinko is young and the Avs took a flyer on him, but he's not really a future since he's in the sink or swim phase of his NHL development. Zadorov will be ready for the show soon. Since McKinon, Duchene, Landeskog, and Barrie are all pretty young, those two guys fit into their current window.
- Victoro311

All the more reason to NOT trade them.

Futures = non NHL assets. Which is exactly what they were.

Colorado is on a 3 game win streak and still dead last in their division. They are D-O-N-E.
- jfkst1

Is it unlikely they make ground in the central? probably, but they are not done. They are 7-9-1, 4 points out the wild card chasing the Hawls. They havent even played in their division yet, only 2 games. They are not even close to being done in their division. Come on dude use a little common sense here

As I said in the previous blog I'd love to get Barrie but realistically the pieces we'd need to move to get him would do more harm then good. There needs to be a coaching change immediately and then maybe give Clendening a shot even if sheltered minutes.

Move Maatta and Letang to the top pair, leave the Dumo/Lovejoy pair as 2 and then Clendening/Cole as the 3rd pair. Let that ride for a few games with a competent coach. As for the forward lines I'm lost, I think you put the energy guys together and maybe shift Crosby/Kuni/Dupes to the 3rd line or 2nd if need be, while Malkin's line takes first line shifts.

I'd like Sprong to get more minutes maybe 2nd line with Fehr and Bonino...I don't know I'm not going to pretend to know more than the GM's etc but I do know that I've seen enough of HCMJ/Tocchet to realize they have no answer to the current NHL and are absolutely wasting this season with this roster.
- iworkatinitech

Coaching change does nothing until the players are willing to play within the system the coach employs and according to the players they are not running the current system properly so I'm not sure there's any evidence to suggest they will do so with a new coach and new system.

Letang/Maata have been the #1 pairing for 2+ games now and have been as big of a disaster as Letang/Cole was, Maata is still not 100% back to form and shouldn't be logging top pairing minutes against top competition right now and for whatever reason Letang is a complete train wreck so keeping them together and playing them 20+ minutes against the other team's top players is solving nothing.

Bonino and Fehr aren't the 2nd line so I'm not sure where you were going with that one but if it was just a typo and you meant 3rd line then I would agree but Sprong is not ready for a top 6 role. He's been spotty at best in his limited bottom 6 role and the shifts he took in the top 6 against NJ he looked completely overwhelmed and made a horrible turnover trying to defer to Sid.

Futures is what that package is. Sure, they should pay off. I've seen Compher play the last two years and he will disappoint. Like Grigorenko and Zadorov. So, you agree that your prospect pool sucked and needed an influx of talent?
- Oneonta Penguin

yes it was one of the worst in the league before Roy and Sakic got involved. They hit with their lottery picks and thats it. Now they have some really solid and interesting prospects in the system...Dmen like Bigras, Zadorov, Geertsen. Forwards like Rantanen. Goalies like Pickard and Martin. Bleakley is meh so hopefully he figures it out

Compher has been playing really well for Michigan, so I wouldnt say he "will disappoint"

Just using opinion to discredit Avalanche moves doesn't make it any logical of Pens getting Barrie for Kunitz and Scuderi type trades. I don't get whats your end game here

Is it unlikely they make ground in the central? probably, but they are not done. They are 7-9-1, 4 points out the wild card chasing the Hawls. They havent even played in their division yet, only 2 games. They are not even close to being done in their division. Come on dude use a little common sense here
- DDM-Coga

I am using common sense. They are last in by far the best division in hockey where every single team is better than them. They have terrible underlying numbers, and historically teams that are 4+ points out of a playoff spot by November 1st generally don't make the playoffs.

I am using common sense. They are last in by far the best division in hockey where every single team is better than them. They have terrible underlying numbers, and historically teams that are 4+ points out of a playoff spot by November 1st generally don't make the playoffs.
- jfkst1

Like I said, its unlikely they won't make the wild card, but chasing a division rival in november by 4 points when they havent even played in their division yet. There is still underlying hope. So there is still a chance, they are not 8 points out or something crazy like that.

Saying they are done doesn't mean they are gong to trade Barrie away or something crazy like that. They are not in the selling off assets world.

Avs have made many great moves and trades this offseason. ROR was a good trade as they got a haul for him, especially for a guy who didn't want to play for them.
Soderberg, Beauchemin, Comeau, Skille signings have all be paying off.

The Gormley trade has been great too, hes been a solid puck moving D who good possession numbers.

As soon as Sakic got himself another Assistant GM in McFarland they have been pulling off solid moves. Trust me they are not going after Kunitz and Scuderi, not what Roy and Sakic talk about in their interviews about the vision of the organization.

Its not Sakic who is laughing in the face of analytics, its Roy, and end of the day its Sakic who is making the trade calls since he is the main main in charge and has final say in all moves. Besides Montreal (3rd game in 5 nights) they have been playing some solid fundamental hockey and having really strong possession games. Roy has changed his system lately and its paying off
- DDM-Coga

Not trying to nitpick but if all these moves were so good and all these players are so great why is the team only 7-9-1? With the solid core they already had in place you would think a bunch of good moves for players that are playing great would result in something better than 7-9-1.

point is, its a fabricated story out of really nothing. Like Duchene being shopped. The avs ex-beat writer Dater, who was fired last year for being a creep to girls on Twitter, tweets out that Duchene will be traded...he also went on in his rant about Iggy and Varly being shopped.

TSN buddies pick up on his "report" and he so happens to be on the Avs 7 game Eastern road swing "working for Bleacher Report" while he is stopping in at Boston, Montreal, and Toronto to talk Av trade talk, getting on all the radio shows, etc.

Sakic already came out and said they were not shopping him, the rumour came out of right field and he has no idea how this stuff starts, but they havent had any trade talks.

Now Dater has deleted all his tweets about Duchene trade, and yet its still a story?
- DDM-Coga

Isn't that pretty much they same things he said when the ROR rumors started surfacing? I'm by no means suggesting that Barrie is being shopped or is on the market but if he was Sakic surely isn't going to make it public knowledge so that it becomes a distraction to the team, he's going to talk about how much they love him and how he's not available until the day he announces the trade.

Not trying to nitpick but if all these moves were so good and all these players are so great why is the team only 7-9-1? With the solid core they already had in place you would think a bunch of good moves for players that are playing great would result in something better than 7-9-1.
- jaydogg1974

when the team was was shooting 1.5% when Duchene is on the ice, that wasn't helping their scoring issues. However that is a statical anomaly and over time it will start to correct itself. Which it has bounced back.

They are solid moves, they are NHL caliber players that they added. They turned over 1/3 of their roster from last season, with vastly no line or D pairings being carried over form last season. It would take time for them to find their roles and build chemistry. I was fully expecting a slow start from them bc of that.

Im not saying they are a perfect team and every move is the best thing out there, but the fact that there is just this blanket label of the Avalanche are bad at running an organization is a bit mind boggling since They had one heck of an offseason trying to fix the wrongs they did the previous offseason.

Letang + ?
for
Duchene + Barrie

yes it was one of the worst in the league before Roy and Sakic got involved. They hit with their lottery picks and thats it. Now they have some really solid and interesting prospects in the system...Dmen like Bigras, Zadorov, Geertsen. Forwards like Rantanen. Goalies like Pickard and Martin. Bleakley is meh so hopefully he figures it out

Compher has been playing really well for Michigan, so I wouldnt say he "will disappoint"

Just using opinion to discredit Avalanche moves doesn't make it any logical of Pens getting Barrie for Kunitz and Scuderi type trades. I don't get whats your end game here
- DDM-Coga

Compher is grossly overrated. I don't give a poop how he is playing with 20 other draft picks. I've seen him four games and think he will more than likely disappoint.

I didn't say Barrie for Kunitz and Scuderi. I mentioned Sprong and Pouliot, or can't you read?

Letang + ?
for
Duchene + Barrie
- YouMeAndDupuis9

that other piece will be significant going back. Don't overrate Letang.

Isn't that pretty much they same things he said when the ROR rumors started surfacing? I'm by no means suggesting that Barrie is being shopped or is on the market but if he was Sakic surely isn't going to make it public knowledge so that it becomes a distraction to the team, he's going to talk about how much they love him and how he's not available until the day he announces the trade.
- jaydogg1974

No with ROR they always said they both want to make it work but they know its a business. They were saying all the generic things to the media but it always seems like ROR just wanted to get to UFA since he wanted to be a 1C on a team, and he would never be that with the Avs.

The point about Sakic having to come out and say that is bc one terrible ex-beater writer tossed out a bunch of trade rumours in a late night twitter rant, and somehow it became a hot story. This is the same guy who used to publish reports saying Stsatny is being shopped after favouriting tweeted from twitter rumour guys like HockeyyInsidder. As soon as Dater is the source of any trade talk, there is 0 credibility to it

that other piece will be significant going back. Don't overrate Letang.
- Oneonta Penguin

For sure....just throwing it out there as I dont know COL's needs all that well.

Like I said, its unlikely they won't make the wild card, but chasing a division rival in november by 4 points when they havent even played in their division yet. There is still underlying hope. So there is still a chance, they are not 8 points out or something crazy like that.

Saying they are done doesn't mean they are gong to trade Barrie away or something crazy like that. They are not in the selling off assets world.
- DDM-Coga

You can look at my other posts and get a good idea of how likely I think this deal is.

Compher is grossly overrated. I don't give a poop how he is playing with 20 other draft picks. I've seen him four games and think he will more than likely disappoint.

I didn't say Barrie for Kunitz and Scuderi. I mentioned Sprong and Pouliot, or can't you read?
- Oneonta Penguin

I was saying Kunitz and Scuderi as pieces in a trade in general as its been tossed out in other posts in here.

You are one negative and sensitive guy aren't you...also 4 games, thanks Tips, are you scout on the side as well?

Not trying to nitpick but if all these moves were so good and all these players are so great why is the team only 7-9-1? With the solid core they already had in place you would think a bunch of good moves for players that are playing great would result in something better than 7-9-1.
- jaydogg1974

You do realize we're asking the same questions about the pens with their solid core?

I was saying Kunitz and Scuderi as pieces in a trade in general as its been tossed out in other posts in here.

You are one negative and sensitive guy aren't you...also 4 games, thanks Tips, are you scout on the side as well?
- DDM-Coga

I know good hockey players when I see them ... he isn't one I think will do anything. Nothing negative ... nothing sensitive. Compher is grossly overrated. I don't like idiots making posts insinuating I said Kunitz and Scuderi for Barrie (which it seemed like you were doing with me), a piece that doesn't help us. I do happen to know values of players.