As long as there is a hockey related subject matter in the post, I see nothing wrong with a short comment of appreciation/support for war veterans today.

sooo I assume Mashinter will be in the lineup Saturday

Dano-Toews-Hossa
BreadMan-AA-Kane
Shaw-Kero-TT
Garbutt-Kruger-Mashinter



- EnzoD

In the spirit of spreading out the scoring, why not swap Kane and tt. Kane makes any line dangerous.

Call the penalties.

Right after the lost season, average PPs per game were 5.83 per team; aferage GPG were 3.06 per team.

Last year, average PPs per game (after steadily decreasing year after year) were down to 3.06 per team - a little more than half of what they were; average GPG was 2.52 per team.

Call the penalties, get the PPs - and, more important, flow the game so that penalties aren't continuously thwarting scoring chances.
- StLBravesFan

I agree that obstruction impedes the flow of the game, but so do penalty parades. Plus games decided by special teams is a bit fluky although not as much as the shootout.

I don't disagree that refs need to whistle obstruction but 5 on 5 hockey is the best most exciting hockey.

There is an immediate way to increase scoring and that's to go to an Olympic size surface, but that costs money so we know it won't happen. These guys are so big and so fast the surface is just too small for enough chances to be created.

Seems like this conversation comes up every couple years. One thing is certain, ya don't need to be a hockey historian to know that goalie equipment has grown in size over the decades while the net opening has been static since the dawn of the game.

Compare the equipment of Tony Esposito circa 1970 to Corey Crawford today.

It needs to also be noted that the players today are physically much larger as well. Heck Ken Dryden was a monster back in the day at what...6'4" and 200 lbs.?

My opinion if the desire is to increase scoring, DO NOT increase the size of the net opening and focus on goalie equipment instead...without sacrificing protection and safety of course.
- ArlingtonRob

How about Bishop v Pang?
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BkpHePIIUAA54ge.jpg

I get what you're saying about flow of the game, but if the officials would really stick to a a strict interpretation of interference rules in both the regular season and playoffs, the result would be more PP's initially, eventually followed by increased scoring chances once the players adapted to the "new" rules and stopped interfering.
- Ogilthorpe2

In theory yes but what happened in the 3 years following the lockout??
I don't recall scoring exploding...

The fact is the game has evolved and kids are coached differently from a young age and the NCAA has been a way for players to get to the NHL. They coach the game to be played defense first...

Plus the most understated person in a franchise in the public eye's is the video coach. But they are a huge part of everything, including analytics as is the case here. The video coach works about as much or more than the training staff...which is a bunch of hours. The players on playoff teams understand what it takes to limit scoring chances.

In theory yes but what happened in the 3 years following the lockout??
I don't recall scoring exploding...

The fact is the game has evolved and kids are coached differently from a young age and the NCAA has been a way for players to get to the NHL. They coach the game to be played defense first...

Plus the most understated person in a franchise in the public eye's is the video coach. But they are a huge part of everything, including analytics as is the case here. The video coach works about as much or more than the training staff...which is a bunch of hours. The players on playoff teams understand what it takes to limit scoring chances.
- Al

It took a few years to weed out the goons and slugs. Then just when the game was getting fast and beautiful, they let the obstruction creep back in. Gotta stick with it.

He's a useless plug with hands of stone. He's a poor man's Ben Eager...without the scoring touch.

The Sharp trade is shaping up to be Stan's worst yet.
- Ogilthorpe2

He was good when up on the Toews' line for that spell. Beauty assist to the captain.
Would like to see him a bury a few, but i'm good with the energy Garbutt brings.

It will be interesting to see if Daley can ever get going. If he does, that trade
might look better down the road. We'll see.

If you restricted the size of the goalie equipment to an absolute limit, instead of a limit that is proportional to the size of the goalie, then the average size of the goalie would shrink.

Also, why does the frontal profile of a goalie's leg pads need to extend 5 inches beyond the width of the goalie's shin? The goalie could be safely protected with much thinner leg pads.
- Ogilthorpe2

Why should big guys who play goalie not be fully protected, or simply get pushed out of the game?

I don't think the width of the pads today is a problem. What is the limit, 11 inches? I don't think that is excessive. If they made them skinnier, they would have to add more protection around the leg as the sides of the leg would be more prone to being hit.

It took a few years to weed out the goons and slugs. Then just when the game was getting fast and beautiful, they let the obstruction creep back in. Gotta stick with it.
- Ogilthorpe2

Immediately after the lockout a single hook/free hand grab was called a penalty. Today, it takes 3-4 grabs/hooks for a penalty to be called. There is as much stick work on the hands and grappling from defenders today as there was in 2003-04, IMO. Then, to "even it up" they will call a SOFT AS COTTON slash....NHL officiating is so inconsistent its nauseating.

How about Bishop v Pang?
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BkpHePIIUAA54ge.jpg
- Marlowe

Pang doesn't even reach Bishop's shoulders.

Compare two goalies the exact same height.

He was good when up on the Toews' line for that spell. Beauty assist to the captain.
Would like to see him a bury a few, but i'm good with the energy Garbutt brings.

It will be interesting to see if Daley can ever get going. If he does, that trade
might look better down the road. We'll see.
- philco28

I've liked Garbutt's game. He has been flying around the ice, hitting, making simple plays, and has at least 4-5 PRIMETIME looks at the net but hasn't found the twine...I don't get the Garbutt hate. I thought Tikhonov looked slow last game and I have disliked Desjardans' game more than Garbutt's.

Instead of trying to explain how much safer goalie equipment is than 15-20 years ago to help get the point across that they are the safest people in the building I'll use your point about the sticks the shooters use these days. As you mention they propel the puck so much faster than a decade + ago.

Why is it that most every single player blocks shots nowadays even though the puck moves so much faster? That wasn't the case 20 years ago. The reason is the forwards and D have equipment that's nearly as safe as what a goalie wore 25 years ago.

So if the forwards/Dmen are safer today the goalies must be too, no?

The goalie is safe, Spector points out there were few puck injuries to goalies even 20 years ago. .......... Reduce the size of jerseys, catching glove, pad height, shoulder pads, chest protector width, pants and scoring will bump up.

What it will do is weed out those with a blob body and little skill and open spots to players with skill. And, again as you mention with the sticks, there just aren't that many in the world who can play NHL goalie. When those players get spots on a roster, in place of low skill blob bodied goalies, is when scoring will rise to a point that it will register a difference.
- Mr Ricochet

Which goalies today fall into the low skill blob body goaltenders?

I've liked Garbutt's game. He has been flying around the ice, hitting, making simple plays, and has at least 4-5 PRIMETIME looks at the net but hasn't found the twine...I don't get the Garbutt hate. I thought Tikhonov looked slow last game and I have disliked Desjardans' game more than Garbutt's.
- EnzoD

Me either, but we all have our whipping boys. We need MORE from a lot of guys, especially Desi, but he's a good pro and gives a good effort most nights. Hopefully some modest production will come eventually.

Which goalies today fall into the low skill blob body goaltenders?
- carcus

IDK about "low skill blobs goalies" but I do know that its a matter of simple math. the puck is the same size and the goal is the same size but the goalie pads are 5x as large. Its pretty straightforward, IMO. Obviously we need to continute providing the essentials for protection on the human body, but minimizing the extra width and length that the chest, leg, blocker and glove pads gives a goalie seems like something only a goalie would be opposed to

Me either, but we all have our whipping boys. We need MORE from a lot of guys, especially Desi, but he's a good pro and gives a good effort most nights. Hopefully some modest production will come eventually.
- philco28

They just need to bury one. I don't have the possession/shots for vs against statistics for our bottom 2 lines, but I feel like they would be in the + for advanced statistics.....nobody in the bottom 6 can finish right now. Hopefully that changes tomorrow!

IDK about "low skill blobs goalies" but I do know that its a matter of simple math. the puck is the same size and the goal is the same size but the goalie pads are 5x as large. Its pretty straightforward, IMO. Obviously we need to continute providing the essentials for protection on the human body, but minimizing the extra width and length that the chest, leg, blocker and glove pads gives a goalie seems like something only a goalie would be opposed to
- EnzoD

I am sure me being a goalie has something to do with it, yes.



Pads are not 5 times as large. Maybe I push back at the thought of reducing the goalie equipment because the arguement is always exaggerated. 5 times, Bishop vs Pang, etc.

Which goalies today fall into the low skill blob body goaltenders?
- carcus

Bishop, Linback, Kuemper off the top of my head. Sure Bishop stops some pucks but most are just on his knees taking up space (blocking). The guy played on one leg v the Hawks in the Finals and still stopped pucks, 90% from his knees.

Point is take the extra equipment away and those who can't play without the help will show themselves through play.

Same as when they started calling obstruction penalties and instituted the instigator. Guess we could have guessed who would be out of the league in a few years but just waiting answered that question.

The term blocking goalie (just kneel there and take up space) wasn't born until the size of the goalie AND equipment grew. Can't stop the size of the player but you can the equipment.

I realize you're wedded to the size of the equipment is needed to keep a goalie safe, although there is no way experience has shown you that, but I could not possibly disagree more. Agree to disagree.

I've liked Garbutt's game. He has been flying around the ice, hitting, making simple plays, and has at least 4-5 PRIMETIME looks at the net but hasn't found the twine...I don't get the Garbutt hate. I thought Tikhonov looked slow last game and I have disliked Desjardans' game more than Garbutt's.
- EnzoD

Because that's the narrative constructed by a few and it will stay that way until the end. Little if anything to do with hockey.

If you just take up space, you will not last. Bishop is huge, but he is also athletic.

In the spirit of spreading out the scoring, why not swap Kane and tt. Kane makes any line dangerous.
- hocktock

Q would rather double-shift him than permanently move him there.

I'm hearing a fire sale situation there is coming with vets..

Bottom line is what you said..The team taking Bickell has to be a believer.
Chatter I heard involved David Jones...Same cap hit but this is the last year of his deal.
- Al

If I were the Hawks I would be looking at Dennis Wideman but the money probably doesn't fit and the asking price in players in addition to Bickell wouldn't excite Stanbo.

So it would probably end up being some ugly deal like Bickell for Bollig and Derek Engelland.

In theory yes but what happened in the 3 years following the lockout??
I don't recall scoring exploding...

The fact is the game has evolved and kids are coached differently from a young age and the NCAA has been a way for players to get to the NHL. They coach the game to be played defense first...

Plus the most understated person in a franchise in the public eye's is the video coach. But they are a huge part of everything, including analytics as is the case here. The video coach works about as much or more than the training staff...which is a bunch of hours. The players on playoff teams understand what it takes to limit scoring chances.
- Al

The video coaches that I have known (3 so far) put in ridiculous hours as do the people actually cleaning/moving the equipment around. Frankly, it's insane and you have to love the team/sport to do those jobs (not to mention have understanding families).

They just need to bury one. I don't have the possession/shots for vs against statistics for our bottom 2 lines, but I feel like they would be in the + for advanced statistics.....nobody in the bottom 6 can finish right now. Hopefully that changes tomorrow!
- EnzoD

If your at our players' stats....there not much production at all in the bottom half of the roster. Glaring hole right now.

How about Bishop v Pang?
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BkpHePIIUAA54ge.jpg
- Marlowe

Note in that picture that Pang's pads are WIDER than Bishop's. Pad height is much more of a goal deterrent than width imho. Give a goalie 1 inch above the top of his knee.

If you just take up space, you will not last. Bishop is huge, but he is also athletic.
- carcus

Guy can handle the puck and skate, no doubt. Take away those extra inches on his catching glove, the inches in the length of his pads to where the stick has to cover the 5 hole pulling that right shoulder down opening space up top, the extra inches on the width of those shoulder pads, the size of the jersey and puffy pants and there is a lot more to shoot at when a guy his playing the sport on his knees.

Force these guys to play the sport on their feet and if not the blocking style will cover less, meaning more goals. Guys who can play the sport on their feet will pull closer/ahead of guys who can only block.

Note in that picture that Pang's pads are WIDER than Bishop's. Pad height is much more of a goal deterrent than width imho. Give a goalie 1 inch above the top of his knee.
- stljam

Even Pang's pads went more than 1 inch above his knees.

I don't know about you, but I hated wearing knee pads under my leg pads. If you are only 1 inch above the knee, you have to have bulky knee pads as pucks are going to hit you there.