I think it's hilarious that Dump and DP still aren't living up to expectations and playing worse than Scuds at this point. Lovejoy is the 3rd best Dman the Pens have..Yikes!

Lets say neither DP or Dumo make the team, that would make Maata and Staal as Shero's only NHL regulars?
- sammy87

They aren't worse than Scuderi or Gonchar. Those two can't even move anymore. It's sad watching them try to skate. Cole is the 3rd best dman the Pens have.

We complain and complain about young players never getting a shot, and then when they look a little shaky in a couple preseason games, we want to make a deal for a dman.

I really don't see JR making any moves on defense for a while. Let the kids play with a full team and some stability.

I think after like Thanksgiving, we'll have a much better feel about these young players, and how their season will progress. Don't make any rash decision based on some split squad exhibition games.

I'm not as big on Fowler as others. I'd much rather have Lindholm or Vatanen than Fowler. Rags defense IMO isn't as good as ANA, NSH, MIN, or LAK. Lundqvist covers up a lot of failures too.
- jfkst1

Those two definitely have more upside but as of last season Fowler was their best and should have been top pairing. And yeah all those teams have better d than NYR. I'd throw the Flames in there too. I was just talking about the Met though. I don't think it's up for debate that as of now the Rags have the best D but in the Met that's like being the tallest midget.

They aren't worse than Scuderi or Gonchar. Those two can't even move anymore. It's sad watching them try to skate. Cole is the 3rd best dman the Pens have.
- jfkst1

Thing with Cole, he played well his time here but his career has been a bottom Dman and healthy scratch. I hope he can carry it over from last yr.

I think it's hilarious that Dump and DP still aren't living up to expectations and playing worse than Scuds at this point. Lovejoy is the 3rd best Dman the Pens have..Yikes!

Lets say neither DP or Dumo make the team, that would make Maata and Staal as Shero's only NHL regulars?
- sammy87

Hilarious that a 21 year old dman in his second year of pro hockey isn't playing like a top pairing stud... I mean, that never happens, all legit top 4 NHL defensemen have just looked great from the start...

Fowler is a 1D playing in a 3D role. I think Lovejoy was a decent compliment to him but I think Fowler also propped him up a good bit. I think it's evident that Anaheim was unimpressed with Lovejoy last season, at least enough to scratch him and eventually trade him for an upgrade at 4D. I think Lovejoy is a pretty good bottom pairing defenseman and is cost effective, but I think he is a very mediocre second pairing guy. He needs to be sheltered.

EDIT: think of Lovejoy in this light: in the Met, who has better bottom pairing D than Lovejoy? For the most part, they're all on par or worse. Even the vaunted NYR D core. I'd certainly take Lovejoy ove Boyle. For now, I would take Yandle over Rev because Yandle would be a great fit in our system but after he gets whatever insane new contract he gets, I'd probably take Lovejoy.
- Victoro311

Lovejoy over Yandle?

Woah.

I'm not as big on Fowler as others. I'd much rather have Lindholm or Vatanen than Fowler. Rags defense IMO isn't as good as ANA, NSH, MIN, or LAK. Lundqvist covers up a lot of failures too.
- jfkst1

So you're saying our defense is still top 5?

I think it's hilarious that Dump and DP still aren't living up to expectations and playing worse than Scuds at this point. Lovejoy is the 3rd best Dman the Pens have..Yikes!

Lets say neither DP or Dumo make the team, that would make Maata and Staal as Shero's only NHL regulars?
- sammy87

Hey hey he's back! it's been a while since I've seen you make an overly exaggerated pessimistic post.

Right now Dump is playing nervous as (frank) with a half AHL roster. I don't think it's fair to pass judgement on him until he's playing in his appropriate role with the full might of the Penguins' forward brigade in front of him.

As for Pouliot, nothing about him says bust so far. He may need some more time in the oven but he'll be fine.

Lovejoy is not currently our third best defenseman. Letang, Maatta, and Cole are all better than him and capable top 4 guys and Clendening has been about on par throughout the preseason. We're really not in that bad of shape.

Lovejoy over Yandle?

Woah.
- rangerdanger94

Only because value. Yandle is worth in the 4-5 mil range. He'll be extended between 6-7 most like by some team. I'd rather have Lovejoy in 1-1.5 range than Yandle anywhere north of 5.

Only because value. Yandle is worth in the 4-5 mil range. He'll be extended between 6-7 most like by some team. I'd rather have Lovejoy in 1-1.5 range than Yandle anywhere north of 5.
- Victoro311

I'd agree with that. I do think Yandle at 5.5 is a good deal but once you push 6 it gets too much.

The guy is one of the top 10 offensive defensemen in the league but he's still a tier below Letang, Subban, and Karlsson and doesn't have much playoff success or history in general.

I'd agree with that. I do think Yandle at 5.5 is a good deal but once you push 6 it gets too much.

The guy is one of the top 10 offensive defensemen in the league but he's still a tier below Letang, Subban, and Karlsson and doesn't have much playoff success or history in general.
- rangerdanger94

Yandle is talented but I don't like him for a top pairing role at all and his performance on the Rangers in a bottom pairing role and PP specialist solidified that opinion. Im not gonna pay him top pairing money.

So you're saying our defense is still top 5?
- rangerdanger94

They have a good one. Not the best. It's be better without Girardi playing on the top pair. Capitals would be better without Orpik in their top pair too.

They have a good one. Not the best. It's be better without Girardi playing on the top pair. Capitals would be better without Orpik in their top pair too.
- jfkst1

Imagine if they had extended Stralman instead of Girardi. Wow. I will eternally be greatful.

Imagine if they had extended Stralman instead of Girardi. Wow. I will eternally be greatful.
- Victoro311

Yeah, I know. I still wish Pens traded Martin and signed Stralman. Staal is a declining asset as well but certainly better than Girardi.

Line rushes and d pairings of significance: Perron-Crosby-Kessel; Dupuis-Bonino-Bennett; Erixon-Letang.

Time to see what Perron can bring to that line. This has major implications on who's potentially expendable if we truly get backed into a corner and we have to make a move for d help. Right now Kunitz and Perron are the moveable parts.

Dupuis-Bonino-Bennett is a very plausible 3rd line if one of Kunitz or Perron get moved. Their play together will also affect how expendable Kunitz and Perron become.

Erixon gets a shot with a really, really good partner and top pairing minutes. We'll have a much better idea of what this mystery guy brings to the table after this game.

And then as always, excited to see Sprong and Sundqvist in action. I think they're the two currently competing for the vacant spot on the fourth line. And honestly, after watching Cullen last night, wouldn't be too surprised to see both on the squad of chemistry is shown.

Yeah, I know. I still wish Pens traded Martin and signed Stralman. Staal is a declining asset as well but certainly better than Girardi.
- jfkst1

Rags fans will absolutely loathe those contracts sooner than later and that makes me feel warm and fuzzy inside.

Rags fans will absolutely loathe those contracts sooner than later and that makes me feel warm and fuzzy inside.
- madmike71

As much as we complain about it, Pens are not in a bad spot with ugly contracts. Scuderi is the only really bad one and it clears in two years. Kunitz and Dupuis still might be quality value contracts if they play solid this season. Nothing kills a team's competitiveness like bad contracts.

I'm not as big on Fowler as others. I'd much rather have Lindholm or Vatanen than Fowler. Rags defense IMO isn't as good as ANA, NSH, MIN, or LAK. Lundqvist covers up a lot of failures too.
- jfkst1

The Rags defense isn't as good as those, but it's still very good.

Yandle is talented but I don't like him for a top pairing role at all and his performance on the Rangers in a bottom pairing role and PP specialist solidified that opinion. Im not gonna pay him top pairing money.
- Victoro311

He's not really 3rd pairing though. It's kinda of a 2A/2B situation with our bottom 2 lines. He'll get his 20 minutes of ice time a night.

Line rushes and d pairings of significance: Perron-Crosby-Kessel; Dupuis-Bonino-Bennett; Erixon-Letang.

Time to see what Perron can bring to that line. This has major implications on who's potentially expendable if we truly get backed into a corner and we have to make a move for d help. Right now Kunitz and Perron are the moveable parts.

Dupuis-Bonino-Bennett is a very plausible 3rd line if one of Kunitz or Perron get moved. Their play together will also affect how expendable Kunitz and Perron become.

Erixon gets a shot with a really, really good partner and top pairing minutes. We'll have a much better idea of what this mystery guy brings to the table after this game.

And then as always, excited to see Sprong and Sundqvist in action. I think they're the two currently competing for the vacant spot on the fourth line. And honestly, after watching Cullen last night, wouldn't be too surprised to see both on the squad of chemistry is shown.
- Victoro311

Who's ready to be mad at me for saying this?

If we need D help bad our best bet would be to trade Matt Murray or Triston Jarry.

Rags fans will absolutely loathe those contracts sooner than later and that makes me feel warm and fuzzy inside.
- madmike71

The Tampa Bay Rangers, sorry Tampa Bay Lightning should make you giggle as well seeing it grow into a contender.

Just imagine if the Rags just kept....don't worry it's better watching their expectations grow & their talent reduce each year - each year the Lundqvist 'dynasty' comes closer to falling!? Wait what....they didn't I mean they haven't .....but Lundqvist.........

As much as we complain about it, Pens are not in a bad spot with ugly contracts. Scuderi is the only really bad one and it clears in two years. Kunitz and Dupuis still might be quality value contracts if they play solid this season. Nothing kills a team's competitiveness like bad contracts.
- jfkst1

Scuds will be bought out after this year. Book it. It will be less than a mil for two years. They can eat that without much of a problem.

Agree about Kuni and Duper. Not bad 3rd liners at worst. Overpaid if they fall into that roll, but livable. If Sprong proves to be an NHL player sooner rather than later, we are in a very good situation next few years.

Rags fans will absolutely loathe those contracts sooner than later and that makes me feel warm and fuzzy inside.
- madmike71

As long as we get another 3 or 4 runs at the cup I'm okay with it

He's not really 3rd pairing though. It's kinda of a 2A/2B situation with our bottom 2 lines. He'll get his 20 minutes of ice time a night.
- rangerdanger94

I'd like to see him paired with Mark Staal or McD to make an actual assessment on him.

Who's ready to be mad at me for saying this?

If we need D help bad our best bet would be to trade Matt Murray or Triston Jarry.
- Zac_O

Goalies are erratic in development. Murray was a relative nothing until last season. I'm not very comfortable with unloading them before the org. has a good idea on what they have with them.