Follow your wife. She is a smart woman. So, you were half Penguins, half Flyers in the 1990s and now we are third? Who is second? You seriously act like more of a Penguin fan than a Flyer fan after reading your posts.
- Oneonta Penguin

Second is Nashville. I like the team, I like the city, and Shea Weber has been my favorite player for a number of years (well before the offer sheet business).

I originally liked the Penguins 2nd because of the roster. After the Tarnstrom/Fata years, I stopped following them.

Edit: Make no mistake, I want the Flyers to win every game against the Penguins 159-0, but I realize that, right now, the Penguins are a far better team both on paper and on the ice. I'm not going to lie/delude myself just because that's the case.

I think he was being superstarcastic.
- BulliesPhan87

Nonsense. Darling is almost as much of a superstar as Michael Leighton, possibly the second best goalie of all time after Patrick Lalime.

More than just the removal of Downie. Also the removal of guys like Bortuzzo (68PIM) Comeau (65PIM) Zach Sill (60PIM in only 40 games). Really the leader in penalty minutes next year based on history will probably be Letang. Thats of course in farnham isn't on the NHL roster.
- Zac_O

It's gross because I am one of the biggest anti-Farnham guys out there and I find that I've defended him severa times over the past week and am going to do so again... Farnham actually has a good penalties to penalties drawn ratio. It's actually his one good trate. He's a rare clean pest. I hope Sundqvist can develop that quality.

It's gross because I am one of the biggest anti-Farnham guys out there and I find that I've defended him severa times over the past week and am going to do so again... Farnham actually has a good penalties to penalties drawn ratio. It's actually his one good trate. He's a rare clean pest. I hope Sundqvist can develop that quality.
- Victoro311

And if he had a shred of hockey skill in him, he'd probably be in the lineup.

Second is Nashville. I like the team, I like the city, and Shea Weber has been my favorite player for a number of years (well before the offer sheet business).

I originally liked the Penguins 2nd because of the roster. After the Tarnstrom/Fata years, I stopped following them.

Edit: Make no mistake, I want the Flyers to win every game against the Penguins 159-0, but I realize that, right now, the Penguins are a far better team both on paper and on the ice. I'm not going to lie/delude myself just because that's the case.
- jmatchett383

Tarnstrom and Fata were enough for people to run away.

It's gross because I am one of the biggest anti-Farnham guys out there and I find that I've defended him severa times over the past week and am going to do so again... Farnham actually has a good penalties to penalties drawn ratio. It's actually his one good trate. He's a rare clean pest. I hope Sundqvist can develop that quality.
- Victoro311

It's just a shame he looks like he is handling the puck for the first time every time.

And if he had a shred of hockey skill in him, he'd probably be in the lineup.
- jmatchett383

Yeah but he doesn't. I like Bobby. He obviously has a tremendous work ethic and definitely gives it his all every time on the ice and being able to pester people without committing many penalties is a rare talent. But he has stone hands and can't skate. I'm happy he's a fan favorite in WBS because he's not even a fourth line NHL talent despite how much Yohe wants to suck his Richard.

Yeah but he doesn't. I like Bobby. He obviously has a tremendous work ethic and definitely gives it his all every time on the ice and being able to pester people without committing many penalties is a rare talent. But he has stone hands and can't skate. I'm happy he's a fan favorite in WBS because he's not even a fourth line NHL talent despite how much Yohe wants to suck his Richard.
- Victoro311

Like a lot of AHL players, he's relied almost solely on hard work to get where he's at. He's got ECHL talent with an NHL heart, and has worked hard enough to earn a few games in the NHL. That in itself should be a huge win for him. Sadly, at some point, talent wins out, and he just doesn't have enough talent to hang at the highest level. There's nothing bad about a being a career AHLer, as it still means you're better at hockey than 99.9% of the people in the world.

Yeah but he doesn't. I like Bobby. He obviously has a tremendous work ethic and definitely gives it his all every time on the ice and being able to pester people without committing many penalties is a rare talent. But he has stone hands and can't skate. I'm happy he's a fan favorite in WBS because he's not even a fourth line NHL talent despite how much Yohe wants to suck his Richard.
- Victoro311

I'd argue Farnham has good mobility. Not that it changes the fact that he is inept. Hell, Glass isn't a bad skater and he's the worst player in the league.

It's gross because I am one of the biggest anti-Farnham guys out there and I find that I've defended him severa times over the past week and am going to do so again... Farnham actually has a good penalties to penalties drawn ratio. It's actually his one good trate. He's a rare clean pest. I hope Sundqvist can develop that quality.
- Victoro311

I agree but his game style has him walking a fine line. It wouldnt be hard for him to end up on the wrong side of that line.

I'd argue Farnham has good mobility. Not that it changes the fact that he is inept. Hell, Glass isn't a bad skater and he's the worst player in the league.
- jfkst1

Just cus he's fast doesn't mean he can skate. I hate to over use the D2 reference but think Luis Mendoza. Just look at that completely botched check he had where he almost concussed himself on the boards the other game.

Most fans of other teams don't know anything about the Pens. They think of the 2012 Flyers series and base their opinions off of that (Fleury sucks, Pens don't play defense, team has zero discipline). The reality is that the defense last year was very good when healthy. Granted losing Ehrhoff and Martin will hurt, but even when Pens had injuries last year the defense was still at least average overall.
- jfkst1

I hear it a lot from ranger and islander fans... However I can tell you from experience that many of these so called ranger fans start watching hockey in April.... Example: Mike (sports pope) franscesa show last spring many rangers fans wanted talbot in for Hank ... Some. After each loss

I hear it a lot from ranger and islander fans... However I can tell you from experience ( Living in New York) that many of these so called ranger fans start watching hockey in April.... Example: Mike (sports pope) franscesa show last spring many rangers fans wanted talbot in for Hank ... Some. After each loss
- Brianandr1

Like a lot of AHL players, he's relied almost solely on hard work to get where he's at. He's got ECHL talent with an NHL heart, and has worked hard enough to earn a few games in the NHL. That in itself should be a huge win for him. Sadly, at some point, talent wins out, and he just doesn't have enough talent to hang at the highest level. There's nothing bad about a being a career AHLer, as it still means you're better at hockey than 99.9% of the people in the world.
- jmatchett383

100% agree and that's why I think the "but he gives 150% every game so he deserves a look in the NHL" argument is so lame. His hard work has allowed him a career playing the game he loves. He makes something like 575k a year in the AHL. My dad is a partner in a small town cardio-pulmonary practice and I'm pretty sure he makes less than Bobby Farnham a year. His hardwork has given him financial success. Isn't that enough? I think it's enough of a reward for a good guy's honest work ethic and I don't think an undeserved spot on an NHL roster is necessary to further reward the guy. Yes sometimes the bad guys win and undeserving bums like Radulov, Kostisyn, Marcus Duprise, Andrew Bynum and Kwame Brown are given roster spots in the big league due to their talent and decide to piss it away and steal money from their franchise but that's just the way the cookie crumbles. The big league is for talent and those who make it without hard work are few and far between. Even Allen Iverson who everyone likes to peg as a bum who didn't give a poop dedicated the vast majority of his life to perfecting his craft. Might have been on his own and not at official team practices but still.

TL;DNR: Bobby Farnham isn't the only person who goes all out. The majority of professional athletes also give 110%, you just tend to notice Farnham is giving it his all because the his lack of ability accents the fact that he's trying really, really hard. So giving 110% doesn't make him special. I'm glad he's found financial success in the AHL, but I'm not about to give him an NHL roster spot.

The removal of Steve Downie will do wonders in this area.
- jmatchett383

I still liked him... for the amount of points he put up with the ice time he had, including penalty minutes... really hard to beat that skill in depth. If only he'd realize he is tiny and not threatening to anyone and would just play hockey.

I hear it a lot from ranger and islander fans... However I can tell you from experience that many of these so called ranger fans start watching hockey in April.... Example: Mike (sports pope) franscesa show last spring many rangers fans wanted talbot in for Hank ... Some. After each loss
- Brianandr1

The Rangers fan base calls for Talbot were embarrassing. Simply considering starting Talbot over Lundqvist was embarrassing.

I still liked him... for the amount of points he put up with the ice time he had, including penalty minutes... really hard to beat that skill in depth. If only he'd realize he is tiny and not threatening to anyone and would just play hockey.
- Guile

He's an okay hockey player with a huge Napoleon complex.

Just cus he's fast doesn't mean he can skate. I hate to over use the D2 reference but think Luis Mendoza. Just look at that completely botched check he had where he almost concussed himself on the boards the other game.
- Victoro311

True, but more often it will be in accordance. There are definitely anomalies with some players having better athleticism than edge work/stability and vice versa. I just don't think skating in general is that important compared to other aspects of the game.

The Rangers fan base calls for Talbot were embarrassing. Simply considering starting Talbot over Lundqvist was embarrassing.
- Victoro311

I have no special love or hate for Talbot individually, but I kind of hope he fails in Edmonton. Because every time there's the young(esque) unproven backup who plays fairly well in a small sample of games, fans league-wide annoint them as superstars. There's a big difference between being the starting goalie with the pressure and playing 60-65 games as opposed to the young guys playing 15-20 games. Just because you play well as a backup doesn't mean you're automatically going to translate that into success as the full-time starter.

Again, it's nothing personal against him, more about the perception of backup numbers automatically translating to starter numbers.

True, but more often it will be in accordance. There are definitely anomalies with some players having better athleticism than edge work/stability and vice versa. I just don't think skating in general is that important compared to other aspects of the game.
- jfkst1

I mean combining not being able to skate with not having hands normally equals not an NHL talent which was the point I was trying to get across. You're right that not being able to skate well doesn't mean he's not an NHL talent. Beau Bennett is a self-admittedly bad skate but I think he's still an NHL talent. Prime Brooks Orpik didn't have great hands but I still think he was an NHL talent. Technically still is even though he's not close to worth his contract. But combine the two and you're in serious trouble

True, but more often it will be in accordance. There are definitely anomalies with some players having better athleticism than edge work/stability and vice versa. I just don't think skating in general is that important compared to other aspects of the game.
- jfkst1

I think skating is vastly important in today's game. Even with this board's implied insistence that players can be lassoed in the neutral zone without a penalty being called, the game today is much less clutch-and-grab than it was pre-lockout, or in the mid 90s. Being able to skate well is paramount to success in today's NHL. Sadly for Farnham, it is only one key to success, and having talent with and without the puck are equally important.

I like Farnham as a 13 F but with the roster we have today employing him would be a waste of roster spot. With Ferh out we have 1 spot available and I would prefer to give that spot to a number of players ahead of farnham. Sundqvist, Sprong, Wilson and Sheary would be better picks considering we are going with 4 lines capable of scoring.

Hell, if I'm Sundqvist or Sprong I'd be going nuts if Farnham was ahead of me for a spot with the big club...

I think skating is vastly important in today's game. Even with this board's implied insistence that players can be lassoed in the neutral zone without a penalty being called, the game today is much less clutch-and-grab than it was pre-lockout, or in the mid 90s. Being able to skate well is paramount to success in today's NHL. Sadly for Farnham, it is only one key to success, and having talent with and without the puck are equally important.
- jmatchett383

It absolutely helps. But there's tons of limited skaters that have success (Bergeron, palat, jagr, Tavares, horvat, Neal). Pens aren't really a great skating team either. Hornqvist, Kunitz, Perron, Bennett, Plotnikov, Bonino are all average or below average. I do not think any player can succeed if they don't have the mental aptitude for the NHL. I do think sub par skating is a weakness that can be mitigated. Of course ideally the player has both (along with puck skills).

I like Farnham as a 13 F but with the roster we have today employing him would be a waste of roster spot. With Ferh out we have 1 spot available and I would prefer to give that spot to a number of players ahead of farnham. Sundqvist, Sprong, Wilson and Sheary would be better picks considering we are going with 4 lines capable of scoring.

Hell, if I'm Sundqvist or Sprong I'd be going nuts if Farnham was ahead of me for a spot with the big club...
- Conse

They may want more talented players to get consistent play time rather than be 13F and end up sitting for extended periods. Farnham doesn't seem like the kind of player you'd worry about missing time.

They may want more talented players to get consistent play time rather than be 13F and end up sitting for extended periods. Farnham doesn't seem like the kind of player you'd worry about missing time.
- BulliesPhan87

This is true. Although Sprong/Sundqvist could get good practice time with the big boys. Still would much rather have them getting good quality playing time elsewhere (AHL/Juniors) though.