This subject aside-So u know the way it has been for years-
You can post pretty much what you want hockey wise and can question anyone about anything at anytime-Just don't let it get personal or insultive. Which you did neither.

....And in case anyone is wondering I am who I say I am, not that anyone else would ever be interested in being me.
- Al

Al you are much more interesting than me. I might give being you a whirl!

Serious in terms of how much time it will take or serious in the sense that he's in trouble? My gut says the DA will subpoena as many witnesses as humanly possible in order to get an indictment.
- Sandus

Definitely the first, maybe the second.

I think the Grand Jury calling the young lady to testify suggests this Kane thing is as serious as some have alleged. Does not prove guilt or innocence, but definitely suggests this will go on for a while and Kane will likely not start the season with the Hawks.
- John Jaeckel

I dont think it has anything to do with how serious the alleged crime may or may not have been.

I do agree that as this drags on Kane will most likely sit out, not sure about the details involving the cap if that happens, but its bound to be the case if they keep taking their time to solve this mystery.

I think the DA is taking his sweet time and doing his due diligence exploring all avenues until they find irrefutable evidence to press criminal charges simply because of the high profile nature of the case. The last thing they want to do is put charges on someone famous like that if there is even the slightest chance he may be found innocent in court.

http://espn.go.com/nhl/story/_/id/13576886/nhl-chicago-blackhawks-daniel-carcillo-day-stanley-cup-tribute-steve-montador

Not sure if this made its way in here. Very good read.
- Pecafan Fan

Great read. Thanks for posting.

Even in the best case for Kane I wouldn't bet he is playing at the UC before Santa comes.
- Al

So let me put on my Pollyanna persona and let's discuss "the best case", first disclaiming that this bit of optimistic crystal balling is predicated on that Kane doesn't end up playing RW on the local prison team.

Let's say that by the time the legal aspects of this case are behind us, and Kane spends some time in some type of personality modification indoctrination camp, Santa has already made his rounds and and the calendar has turned a new leaf, not unlike Kane at that point. So essentially half the season is gone before Kane comes off LTIR and his AAV starts counting again. What that means in terms of the Cap is that Stan has ~$5M more in the kitty that wouldn't have been there had Kane been active to start the season. That surplus would have been used to re-sign Kruger and really to not HAVE to move Bickell or Versteeg or anyone unless it makes sense to do so at the time - effectively the gun was removed from Stan's head because Kane's AAV was reduced by half for this season. This will mean that Versteeg will be gone when his contract expires after this season and Bickell will have only 1 year to go when the buyout window opens again next June.

What this would also mean from a positive spin perspective is that someone (TT or Panarin or Dano or ??) would have spent the time Kane was out playing "his minutes" on the 2nd line and the 1st PP unit. Now, the results in the standings would probably suffer with that downgrade, but it gives that player or those players valuable experience that will be fruitful when Kane returns. In other words - the Hawks will assuredly not win as many games with Kane out but as long as they don't dig too deep of a hole for themselves in the standings, they should be a stronger team heading into the playoffs than they would have been if TT/Panarin/Dano had gotten the reduced minutes if Kane had been in the lineup.

I see the possibility that much like last season when Kane was out of the lineup due to an unfortunate injury, this could again result in a positive situation for the Hawks in the long run.

C'mon ... are ya with me?

Serious in terms of how much time it will take or serious in the sense that he's in trouble? My gut says the DA will subpoena as many witnesses as humanly possible in order to get an indictment.
- Sandus

"Serious in the sense that he is in trouble", the new witness that has come forward allegedly has "eye witness" evidence to what has been alleged by the "plaintiff". As JJ said, at the very least, this ensures that this thing is going to be around for a while, perhaps a LONG time. What looked like it might be wrapped up soon just a week and a half ago, now looks completely different. So now what to do if you are the Hawks as the allegations are very serious through both the "plaintiff" and this new witness???

Again, just because this testimony is very serious and graphic, doesn't make it true; however, it does mean the authorities will move slowly to be very sure on this matter.

I dont think it has anything to do with how serious the alleged crime may or may not have been.

I do agree that as this drags on Kane will most likely sit out, not sure about the details involving the cap if that happens, but its bound to be the case if they keep taking their time to solve this mystery.

I think the DA is taking his sweet time and doing his due diligence exploring all avenues until they find irrefutable evidence to press criminal charges simply because of the high profile nature of the case. The last thing they want to do is put charges on someone famous like that if there is even the slightest chance he may be found innocent in court.
- SimpleJack

Serious in that all felony cases must be presented to the Grand Jury in New York. The DA has no choice in this matter.

Chicago Sports News (@ChiSportUpdates)
9/4/15, 4:03 PM
Everyone at #Patrickkane Hamburg home on the night of an alleged rape has been subpoeaned. ( Per @WGRZ) #Blackhawks

Chicago Sports News (@ChiSportUpdates)
9/4/15, 4:03 PM
Everyone at #Patrickkane Hamburg home on the night of an alleged rape has been subpoeaned. ( Per @WGRZ) #Blackhawks
- walleyeb1

I know its well reported that there was Kane, his friend, the alleged victim and her friend.....but i wonder if we find out more, or who else was there....

"Serious in the sense that he is in trouble", the new witness that has come forward allegedly has "eye witness" evidence to what has been alleged by the "plaintiff". As JJ said, at the very least, this ensures that this thing is going to be around for a while, perhaps a LONG time. What looked like it might be wrapped up soon just a week and a half ago, now looks completely different. So now what to do if you are the Hawks as the allegations are very serious through both the "plaintiff" and this new witness???

Again, just because this testimony is very serious and graphic, doesn't make it true; however, it does mean the authorities will move slowly to be very sure on this matter.
- MexicoHawk

I agree with yours/JJ's conclusions about the seriousness and length of time, but:

Is this a NEW witness - or is this the accuser's friend who (we've known all along) was at the house at the time of the incident?

I thought the latter.

http://espn.go.com/nhl/story/_/id/13576886/nhl-chicago-blackhawks-daniel-carcillo-day-stanley-cup-tribute-steve-montador

Not sure if this made its way in here. Very good read.
- Pecafan Fan

http://www.theplayerstrib...llo-steve-montador-video/

Link that was in the link you gave....Note at the 4minute mark or so of the Carcillo video, Carcillo notes that Toews was one of the guys who reached out to him regularly. This is exactly why, even as a Blues fan, I got my wife a Toews 1st winter classic authentic sweater. Regardless of the sweater, I have much respect for Toews. He has replaced Lidstrom and Yzerman in that status.

Serious in that all felony cases must be presented to the Grand Jury in New York. The DA has no choice in this matter.
- walleyeb1

Meaning - they can't to trial without a grand jury?

I agree with yours/JJ's conclusions about the seriousness and length of time, but:

Is this a NEW witness - or is this the accuser's friend who (we've known all along) was at the house at the time of the incident?

I thought the latter.
- StLBravesFan

I think this misses the point. It's serious in that a Grand Jury has been impanelled and everyone that was at Kane's home has now been subpoenaed.

Meaning - they can't to trial without a grand jury?
- StLBravesFan

Posted this before but here you go:

The Grand Jury
What is a Grand Jury?
Under New York State law, unless the defendant consents, all felony cases must be presented to the Grand Jury. Grand Juries are empowered to hear evidence presented by prosecutors, and to take various actions regarding the evidence and legal charges they are to consider. The Grand Jury can also conduct independent investigations. Grand Juries sit for a term of approximately one month. Each Grand Jury is comprised of 23 citizens who hear and examine evidence concerning offenses and take action based on such evidence.

I dont think it has anything to do with how serious the alleged crime may or may not have been.

I do agree that as this drags on Kane will most likely sit out, not sure about the details involving the cap if that happens, but its bound to be the case if they keep taking their time to solve this mystery.

I think the DA is taking his sweet time and doing his due diligence exploring all avenues until they find irrefutable evidence to press criminal charges simply because of the high profile nature of the case. The last thing they want to do is put charges on someone famous like that if there is even the slightest chance he may be found innocent in court.
- SimpleJack

Serious to the extent that some of the best case scenarios for Kane are becoming less likely.

She has not recanted her testimony.
She has not (at least yet) cut a deal.
The DA did not decide there was nothing to her allegations and has taken them to one of the possible next levels.

It's still a long way from an indictment, let alone trial or conviction but it's a lot closer than a few weeks ago.

Serious to the extent that some of the best case scenarios for Kane are becoming less likely.

She has not recanted her testimony.
She has not (at least yet) cut a deal.
The DA did not decide there was nothing to her allegations and has taken them to one of the possible next levels.

It's still a long way from an indictment, let alone trial or conviction but it's a lot closer than a few weeks ago.
- Canada Cup

I dont think it has anything to do with how serious the alleged crime may or may not have been.

I do agree that as this drags on Kane will most likely sit out, not sure about the details involving the cap if that happens, but its bound to be the case if they keep taking their time to solve this mystery.

I think the DA is taking his sweet time and doing his due diligence exploring all avenues until they find irrefutable evidence to press criminal charges simply because of the high profile nature of the case. The last thing they want to do is put charges on someone famous like that if there is even the slightest chance he may be found innocent in court.
- SimpleJack

Well if you've been alleging that he is guilty of nothing more than being a "partier," the girl being called before the grand jury suggests something a lot more serious.

I think this misses the point. It's serious in that a Grand Jury has been impanelled and everyone that was at Kane's home has now been subpoenaed.
- walleyeb1

No, different point:

Another witness - a "new" witness - would (could) make the situation more serious than it already is.

No, different point:

Another witness - a "new" witness - would (could) make the situation more serious than it already is.
- StLBravesFan

Got ya, which brings a couple things up that I've been thinking about. Where'd Kane's driver go, did he just drop them off and leave or did he hang around? The alledged victim called family right away and went to the hospital and had the rape kit done. How'd she get their, did she call a cab, family come and get her, Kane's driver?

If so, then the can't use the Kane space to sign Kruger until October 7 - and he would miss camp - unless he could sign a PTO as an RFA.
- StLBravesFan

Did the new CBA change things or are teams still allowed to be 10% over the cap until the day the season starts? Kruger's salary isn't going to be $7M+.

"Serious in the sense that he is in trouble", the new witness that has come forward allegedly has "eye witness" evidence to what has been alleged by the "plaintiff". As JJ said, at the very least, this ensures that this thing is going to be around for a while, perhaps a LONG time. What looked like it might be wrapped up soon just a week and a half ago, now looks completely different. So now what to do if you are the Hawks as the allegations are very serious through both the "plaintiff" and this new witness???

Again, just because this testimony is very serious and graphic, doesn't make it true; however, it does mean the authorities will move slowly to be very sure on this matter.
- MexicoHawk

Source?

So let me put on my Pollyanna persona and let's discuss "the best case", first disclaiming that this bit of optimistic crystal balling is predicated on that Kane doesn't end up playing RW on the local prison team.

Let's say that by the time the legal aspects of this case are behind us, and Kane spends some time in some type of personality modification indoctrination camp, Santa has already made his rounds and and the calendar has turned a new leaf, not unlike Kane at that point. So essentially half the season is gone before Kane comes off LTIR and his AAV starts counting again. What that means in terms of the Cap is that Stan has ~$5M more in the kitty that wouldn't have been there had Kane been active to start the season. That surplus would have been used to re-sign Kruger and really to not HAVE to move Bickell or Versteeg or anyone unless it makes sense to do so at the time - effectively the gun was removed from Stan's head because Kane's AAV was reduced by half for this season. This will mean that Versteeg will be gone when his contract expires after this season and Bickell will have only 1 year to go when the buyout window opens again next June.

What this would also mean from a positive spin perspective is that someone (TT or Panarin or Dano or ??) would have spent the time Kane was out playing "his minutes" on the 2nd line and the 1st PP unit. Now, the results in the standings would probably suffer with that downgrade, but it gives that player or those players valuable experience that will be fruitful when Kane returns. In other words - the Hawks will assuredly not win as many games with Kane out but as long as they don't dig too deep of a hole for themselves in the standings, they should be a stronger team heading into the playoffs than they would have been if TT/Panarin/Dano had gotten the reduced minutes if Kane had been in the lineup.

I see the possibility that much like last season when Kane was out of the lineup due to an unfortunate injury, this could again result in a positive situation for the Hawks in the long run.

C'mon ... are ya with me?
- EbonyRaptor

That's not how I understand LTIR.

If Kane is on LTIR, his cap hit still counts against the Hawks. They are allowed to go over the cap by the amount of his cap hit for the duration of his stay on LTIR. Anything that isn't used is lost. There is no banking of cap hit from LTIR.

The day that Kane was activated from LTIR, they would have to be cap compliant with their current roster (no pro rating) assuming they were over the cap while he was on LTIR.

More news:

http://mobile.buffalonews...iple-sources-say-20150904

That's not how I understand LTIR.

If Kane is on LTIR, his cap hit still counts against the Hawks. They are allowed to go over the cap by the amount of his cap hit for the duration of his stay on LTIR. Anything that isn't used is lost. There is no banking of cap hit from LTIR.

The day that Kane was activated from LTIR, they would have to be cap compliant with their current roster (no pro rating) assuming they were over the cap while he was on LTIR.
- NewToHockey

For LTIR, yes. A player on LTIR is considered a rostered player for the purpose of cap calculation, therefore his entire hit applies and then there is an exemption for the AAV of replacement players. For an SABH excusal or a suspension (with league consideration and approval), Kane is considered non-rostered and therefore his cap hit would be calculated based on the number of days he spends on the roster, similar to a midseason acquisition or two way contract player. Likewise, any replacement players using his cap space would have to be paid little enough to leave cap room for his addition later in the season.

http://www.theplayerstribune.com/nhl-daniel-carcillo-steve-montador-video/

Link that was in the link you gave....Note at the 4minute mark or so of the Carcillo video, Carcillo notes that Toews was one of the guys who reached out to him regularly. This is exactly why, even as a Blues fan, I got my wife a Toews 1st winter classic authentic sweater. Regardless of the sweater, I have much respect for Toews. He has replaced Lidstrom and Yzerman in that status.
- stljam

Just seconding the respect for Toews. "Hate him" in the sense that he plays for a rival; but respect how classy of a guy he shows himself to be. Still hope he decides he would be happiest retiring from hockey to go play baseball tomorrow, of course.