Anyone take New Jersey yet? I could see Shero going for it considering NJ's distinct lack of offensive fire power
- the_dough_boy

What in the hell would be coming back that would be acceptable?

Jordan = Toews (all they think about is winning)
Pippen = Keith (winning it is -- and are the least well-spoken of the three)
Rodman = Kane (flair for the dramatic and getting in the papers for the wrong reasons)

I think we're more in agreement than disagreement. Not saying they CANNOT win another Cup w/o Kane -- but I think it will be awfully tough to do so and will depend on the outcome if he is guilty (and supsended, with cap hit coming off?), not guilty and traded -- need to plug in a piece or pieces that make it work.

Let's reverse this -- and say it was Toews being traded.
Do Hawks win replacing him?

Really, my question is: who is Michael Jordan and who is Scotty Pippen?
And don't forget, we saw Jordan, w/o Pippen (and w/o the "right" supporting cast) and that Jordan did not win much of anything.
- savvyone-1

I'd say it's also going to be awfully tough to win another cup WITH Kane. The Blackhawks have lost a lot of talented guys - and more to come - who know the system and replaced them with cheaper but talented younger players. There will be an adjustment period for them to get it up to speed. Add to that the uncertainty of the Kane situation and this year is looking rocky already. As Q said earlier this summer (maybe at the convention?) the first order of business is to make the playoffs.

Then as things stand, there are more salary cap issues to deal with next offseason (Seabrook) and still more the season after that (Teuvo, Dano, Paranin, etc.)

I think the Blackhawks CAN contend and win more cups going forward but money is going to be tight without Kane, tighter with him. There are a lot of question marks in the supporting cast. I like them but we need to see how this team plays together before we know what the Blackhawks really have.

In what way(s)? Different players, totally different players.
- blackhawk24

Sayers as a pure runner was better than Payton. Sayers had better acceleration, better lateral quickness and better top end speed. He was like a gazelle - beautiful to watch run. Payton was shifty but he was also a battering ram and his best asset was his heart - he wouldn't go down without gaining another yard or two. And then there were all the other things Payton did like block and catch passes which made him the best all around back in history, in my opinion.

Panarin might end up scoring a LOT of goals in the NHL and in a lot of different ways. Sharpie was a nice do it all kind of forward who could score for sure. The Hawks are SKY high on Panarin and the tape thats out there suggests why.

i will just say, for all the plays he makes at high speed and with finish, I saw one where he took a puck from a guy down low, used his body to shield the guy off and then scored a goal that i thought was pretty remarkable, because those are NHL-style goals.

Marko Dano too. There are NHL people who think the Hawks stole him from CBJ FWIW, and that's taking the return into account. Dano ALSO projects at RW.
- John Jaeckel

that's all really exciting

The problem is we'll never know if he's innocent, unless the woman recants. There will always be a level of doubt.
- walleyeb1

I doubt that will be enough to remove the doubt. There will alway be doubt.

I do agree, I do not want to see Kane traded.. But remember, this is a business.
- 93Joe

No, one of the reasons he MAY be traded, even if nothing sticks, is that the Blackhawks have no way of knowing if PK gets in trouble again in the future. And his history indicates that another incident is just around the corner, no matter his 'assurances' to the team.

Say nothing sticks and they keep him. And then in February 2016 he beats up a cabbie/gets drunk with college girls/exposes himself in a bar/ swings from the rafters with a Hooters girl/takes hostages. What's he worth then? And based on his history, how can the Blackhawks have confidence he won't go off the rails again?

The Blackhawks are now basically using game theory to determine their optimal move. And it MAY mean that moving a volatile asset for more stable assets gives the team the best chance to win.

Sayers was a different runner, a lot faster. More like Barry Sanders.
- Al

Not just fast - quick, with the ability to get to places that tacklers couldn't get at him.

Not just fast - quick, with the ability to get to places that tacklers couldn't get at him.
- StLBravesFan

Theres a famous highlight of one of his awesome runs where he double jukes to the left. On the second juke to the left, I have no clue how in the hell he knew there was a defender coming at him because the defender basically was coming from his like 8 o clock position. He just had a sense or something.

I didn't have the pleasure of seeing him or Walter live. From all the highlights and video I have seen though, it was a real pleasure to watch them.

Top 10 is a completely subjective list. One persons #1 is another persons #5.

Forget all the current crap, eliminate the off ice issues and look at Kanes career on the ice, his age, his abilities, etc. Then ask yourself who in the league would you consider fair value if trading him? Crosby, Stamkos, Doughty, Tavares, Hedman, Seguin, Karlsson, Tarasenko, Giroux? I'm sure there are others people can come up with. This list is just guys around the same age, and doesn't even include any goalies, doesnt include guys like Ovechkin and Malkin who are a few years older.

My point is you can rank a bunch of guys in a "tier" near the top, say as many as 20 guys who you would consider in a trade straight up for Kane, or at least make an argument thereof.

If you were to ask who the best player in the league is you would get arguments for Crosby, Toews, Price, Ovechkin and a few others, each being chosen for slightly different criteria but all with validity in their choice.
- TheTrob

Pretty interesting if you choose to include "all time" or just at evens.

http://stats.hockeyanalys...p=1&sort=PCT&sortdir=DESC

Am I out of line to say that Arty Panarin reminds me a little of... can I say it? Pavel B? not projecting him to be that good necessarily, but they way he moves is familiar.
- DirkGraham

The Hawks could have 3 ROI candidates which is kind of fun to think about.

Jordan = Toews (all they think about is winning)
Pippen = Keith (winning it is -- and are the least well-spoken of the three)
Rodman = Kane (flair for the dramatic and getting in the papers for the wrong reasons)
- DMChi2010

I am still adamant that Keith is the key like Lidstrom was for Detroit. The "elite" forwards changed but when he was on the team it was a constant winner. I think the same is true for the Hawks.

Which is why I think if you move Kane, you do it with the intention of putting yourself in a position to find the next "keith" who can take over that role in 5 years and have Toews "Lead" the team for another 5 or whatever.

I am still adamant that Keith is the key like Lidstrom was for Detroit. The "elite" forwards changed but when he was on the team it was a constant winner. I think the same is true for the Hawks.

Which is why I think if you move Kane, you do it with the intention of putting yourself in a position to find the next "keith" who can take over that role in 5 years and have Toews "Lead" the team for another 5 or whatever.
- fattybeef

I also think that it's important to keep Seabrook long term; especially if Kane is gone, Bickell and/or Versteeg and/or Shaw goes too and then the possibility of Crawford,… that's a lot of veteran leadership. Seabs is a leader and I think he's earned that second A.

The Hawks could have 3 ROI candidates which is kind of fun to think about.
- fattybeef

I think TT and Dano played too many games last year to be ROY eligible. But - who cares about the reward that McDavid will probably get anyway - as long as they all play like rookies of the year it will be good.

Not just fast - quick, with the ability to get to places that tacklers couldn't get at him.
- StLBravesFan

Yes..Shifty on grass like Barry Sanders was on turf.

I am still adamant that Keith is the key like Lidstrom was for Detroit. The "elite" forwards changed but when he was on the team it was a constant winner. I think the same is true for the Hawks.

Which is why I think if you move Kane, you do it with the intention of putting yourself in a position to find the next "keith" who can take over that role in 5 years and have Toews "Lead" the team for another 5 or whatever.
- fattybeef

That's a very difficult challenge to replace Keith...There have been only 2 Hawk defensemen that could be considered somewhat similar as far as offensive flare-Pierre Pilote who is in the HOF and Doug Wilson who isn't a HOf player.

....And Keith is much better than Wilson and better defensively than Pilote.
Keith is a multi generational player.....Same with Toews/Kane.

I don't disagree with your thinking about Keith but I would add the foundation was set with both Keith and Seabrook being established players before Toews and Kane arrived.

I would say higher than top 10 closer to top 6 but I think this club fit him better than any other situation in the NHL.
- Al

I hope you and JJ just mean forwards. Not actual top 10.

I hope you and JJ just mean forwards. Not actual top 10.
- stljam

I was only thinking forwards.

The Hawks could have 3 ROI candidates which is kind of fun to think about.
- fattybeef

I for one am excited to see how Dano and Panarin do in their rookie seasons and the development TT will have in a full season at the NHL level. I'm also interested to see if Gustafsson or Pokka can be a surprise coming out of training camp like TVR was last year. It's much more fun to talk about hockey than legal stuff.

If he's an effective player, couldn't he thrive on either the left or right side? I never understood that about projections of players. Saying he would be best on the left or right wing specifically, but not both.
- BlazinMike

Generally, with skilled players, they want to receive the puck with a wider range of shooting angles—which they have on their off wing. So lefty shot playing right wing and vice versa. Doesn't mean they can't play either side, it's just that they're more comfortable and productive on their off side.

Am I out of line to say that Arty Panarin reminds me a little of... can I say it? Pavel B? not projecting him to be that good necessarily, but they way he moves is familiar.
- DirkGraham

Actually, my first thought when I first saw him on tape.

Actually, my first thought when I first saw him on tape.
- John Jaeckel

If it is possible for a HOF player to be underrated I would put Bure in that category.
When he was healthy he was a scoring machine and usually didn't have a lot of help doing so...

Over a point a game player so anything close to Bure would mean the Hawks hit a home run.

Am I out of line to say that Arty Panarin reminds me a little of... can I say it? Pavel B? not projecting him to be that good necessarily, but they way he moves is familiar.
- DirkGraham

Actually, my first thought when I first saw him on tape.
- John Jaeckel

Pavel Bure
http://youtu.be/VFbSpvb8QUA

Artemi Panarin
http://youtu.be/Mj-QmiX0ls8

It is my contention that 88's biggest contribution to the 2015 cup was breaking his collarbone at just the right time. He is great fun to watch and was always a guy we could count on in the clutch. But this is too much to overcome. This idiot would have had a statue placed in front of the uc after his career. Now, he'll be a footnote. We will win without him. Hockey is a team game and I no longer want him on my team. There are some really exciting players to watch this season. I don't think we'll miss him in a year or so. I just don't know how this log jam breaks. How and when can we move forward? I hope you enjoyed your final cup celebration mr. Kane. Fare ye well.

If it is possible for a HOF player to be underrated I would put Bure in that category.
When he was healthy he was a scoring machine and usually didn't have a lot of help doing so...

Over a point a game player so anything close to Bure would mean the Hawks hit a home run.
- Al

At 1/2 as capable of what Bure could do on the ice would make Panarin an excellent NHL player. Bure was a goal scoring predator with speed and moves few could match. Too bad he ended up in that hockey wasteland of Florida.