Berube got poopcanned in mid-April. Where is he working now?
- PLindbergh31

Berubeville

Imo, if that was truly understood, then Read would hold more value. The sample size is not too small. What Read is, is a a strong skating, 2 way forward, capable of scoring 20+ goals and 2nd line level point production at ES, while playing in tough defensive matchups, and against top lines. That's a pretty valuable player, and all of that makes him more than decent in my view.
The attached to Couturier's hip comment, doesn't make a lot of sense.
- MJL

Yeah, you know, unless he tries to play through an injury. Then he gets a pass, and goes from being an above average, top six forward in the way you describe him to a middling third liner at best.

All I'm trying to say is he's actually somewhere in between the two, and that's where he'll always be. I'll leave it at that.

They are making a NHL legacy edition for PS3 and Xbox 360, but moving the yearly games to the new consoles
- aflyerpower8

Explain the legacy thing, please.

You're absolutely right. He's a good top-9 forward who has proven he can play in the top-6. Not only that, he's a great 200ft player who has proven versatility.

All of this extra "but he scores a lot at evens" stuff is what I don't care about. We're not talking about Patrice Bergeron. We're talking about Matt Read.
- mochoson

You can say you don't care about it all you want, what that really means is that you just don't want to consider how he's used, what situations he plays in, and how he produces comparable numbers to many players who are considered better offensive players, who play in easier situations. How Read produces in combination with how he is used, is the value he brings to the team.

Read being hurt and largely ineffective last season, is a big reason why the team struggles as badly as they did last season.

Nick Bonino. Maybe not a "litany", but wasn't hard at all.

What exactly does "produce like Read has" even mean? We're talking about a guy who in 3 full NHL seasons has topped 30 points 3 times but never scored 50? I mean, I like Matt Read, but I feel like we've become enamored with him.

I don't know if it's because he was an undrafted FA that we signed out of college who turned out to be a diamond in the rough or what. Am I the only person that doesn't expect Read to even finish out his deal here in Philly? Regardless of whether he sucks again or if he has a 50 point season (like I am predicting) he's a prime trade candidate in the next 2 seasons.
- mochoson

I'm with you. I like Read, hopefully his down performance this past season was due almost entirely to injury, and he bounces back this year. We'll see. But the idea that a 29 year old whose career year was 47 points in 2011/12 is irreplaceable doesn't seem reasonable.

Yeah, you know, unless he tries to play through an injury. Then he gets a pass, and goes from being an above average, top six forward in the way you describe him to a middling third liner at best.

All I'm trying to say is he's actually somewhere in between the two, and that's where he'll always be. I'll leave it at that.
- mochoson

He doesn't deserve the benefit of the doubt with the high ankle sprain he had last season?

Matt Read is a person. Agreed?

Matt Read is a person. Agreed?
- jmatchett383

That's debatable

Explain the legacy thing, please.
- jmatchett383

I don't know much about it, but based on what ea has on their website it looks like a $60 roster update

I don't know much about it, but based on what ea has on their website it looks like a $60 roster update
- aflyerpower8

That's essentially what they all are.

edit:

EA SPORTS NHL Legacy Edition brings together the most popular modes and award-winning gameplay features from nine years of NHL hockey. Featuring updated rosters and authentic schedules, it’s the perfect experience for fans looking to get that complete hockey fix on Xbox 360 or PlayStation 3.

AND authentic schedules!?? Take my money!

Nothing you've offered makes him a prime trade candidate imo. There aren't many similar players available in Free Agency.
- MJL

lol

So if I had a player internally to replace Read, the fact that the FA market is barren is the perfect reason to trade him. He's on a cheap deal if he continues to produce 20 goals, 40+ points, and would bring in a solid return.

That would be why I said "over the next 2 seasons"; currently, the Flyers have no one to replace Read internally. And, to be fair, neither of us have any idea what the FA market will look like over the next 2 summers. This is only hypothetical.

If Read scores 50+ points the next 3 seasons, he's priced himself way out of town. If he scores closer to last seasons numbers, there's no reason to resign him. If he lands somewhere in the middle (aka closer to his previous production), he's still likely priced himself out of Philly.

Basically, there is no Matt Read extension waiting 3 years down the line. If he has productive seasons the next 2 years, they absolutely will explore trading him. Even if Matt Read wanted to stay here, I don't see the Flyers paying him what he would want with guys like Konecny and Aube Kubel coming up. He'd be taking up a spot and wasting valuable cap.

He is absolutely a trade candidate the next 2 seasons, more so in 16-17.

lol

So if I had a player internally to replace Read, the fact that the FA market is barren is the perfect reason to trade him. He's on a cheap deal if he continues to produce 20 goals, 40+ points, and would bring in a solid return.

That would be why I said "over the next 2 seasons"; currently, the Flyers have no one to replace Read internally. And, to be fair, neither of us have any idea what the FA market will look like over the next 2 summers. This is only hypothetical.

If Read scores 50+ points the next 3 seasons, he's priced himself way out of town. If he scores closer to last seasons numbers, there's no reason to resign him. If he lands somewhere in the middle (aka closer to his previous production), he's still likely priced himself out of Philly.

Basically, there is no Matt Read extension waiting 3 years down the line. If he has productive seasons the next 2 years, they absolutely will explore trading him. Even if Matt Read wanted to stay here, I don't see the Flyers paying him what he would want with guys like Konecny and Aube Kubel coming up. He'd be taking up a spot and wasting valuable cap.

He is absolutely a trade candidate the next 2 seasons, more so in 16-17.
- mochoson

I approve this message.

You can say you don't care about it all you want, what that really means is that you just don't want to consider how he's used, what situations he plays in, and how he produces comparable numbers to many players who are considered better offensive players, who play in easier situations. How Read produces in combination with how he is used, is the value he brings to the team.

Read being hurt and largely ineffective last season, is a big reason why the team struggles as badly as they did last season.
- MJL

I'm well aware of how he's used, the situations he plays in, and who he compares to. You're the one that decided to point out he was the "24th ranked ES scoring right wing in 13-14". Me saying I don't care is realizing he was the 99th ranked overall forward in even strength scoring.

He's a very good hockey player. I haven't disputed that once today. I'm actually totally lost on the overall point you're trying to make at this point. If you're trying to convince me Read isn't a trade candidate at some point before his deal is done, you can stop now. You wont succeed.

He doesn't deserve the benefit of the doubt with the high ankle sprain he had last season?
- MJL

I've already said numerous times I expect him to score upwards of 45-50 points this season. I truly don't know what you're trying to convince me of at this point.

I like Matt Read a lot. But he's a middle 6 forward who has probably reached the ceiling of his development, on a team with a lot of money tied up in its blueline and top forwards. And although we're getting good value on our goalies we're not pinching pennies in net either. I think we have cheap replacements for him in the system/on the roster who would be almost as good as him (guys like Laughton and Bellemare and, to a lesser extent, VDV and White)

Matt Read is a person. Agreed?
- jmatchett383

Well, he's Canadian, so.....maybe?

I like Matt Read a lot. But he's a middle 6 forward who has probably reached the ceiling of his development, on a team with a lot of money tied up in its blueline and top forwards. And although we're getting good value on our goalies we're not pinching pennies in net either. I think we have cheap replacements for him in the system/on the roster who would be almost as good as him (guys like Laughton and Bellemare and, to a lesser extent, VDV and White)
- Coburns_Nose

Everything here is spot on minus the bold. Read is an exceptionally better player than everyone listed, save Laughton. Laughton could very well be a guy that eventually moves Read off the roster, but that remains to be seen as of this writing.

I am sure AMAC is happy that today the merits of Matt Read are being thrashed over and he has been forgotten momentarily at the least.

IMO ( and agreeing with many others) he should have been shut down to heal and do see a bounce back year from him.

I like Matt Read a lot. But he's a middle 6 forward who has probably reached the ceiling of his development, on a team with a lot of money tied up in its blueline and top forwards. And although we're getting good value on our goalies we're not pinching pennies in net either. I think we have cheap replacements for him in the system/on the roster who would be almost as good as him (guys like Laughton and Bellemare and, to a lesser extent, VDV and White)
- Coburns_Nose

I couldn't disagree with this more. None of those players, including Laughton, will ever score 20 plus goals in this league. Nor will they do it playing the types of minutes Read does.

Nick Bonino. Maybe not a "litany", but wasn't hard at all.

What exactly does "produce like Read has" even mean? We're talking about a guy who in 3 full NHL seasons has topped 30 points 3 times but never scored 50? I mean, I like Matt Read, but I feel like we've become enamored with him.

I don't know if it's because he was an undrafted FA that we signed out of college who turned out to be a diamond in the rough or what. Am I the only person that doesn't expect Read to even finish out his deal here in Philly? Regardless of whether he sucks again or if he has a 50 point season (like I am predicting) he's a prime trade candidate in the next 2 seasons.
- mochoson

You are being a little disingenuous here. In his first year here, Read very nearly hit your 50 point plateau (24-23-47). His second year was on par, pro-rated over the full year (lockout year) would have been in the 46-48 point range.

Compare that to Raffl's 2 year totals (30-20-50). Oh, and Raffl played top-line minutes for a good chunk of last season.

Read has been playing with Couturier for the last 2 years. His high-ankle sprain clearly affected his performance. But there is a chicken and egg thing as well - is Read hurting Couturier's development or has Cout's lack of an offensive game hindered Read's performance?

Everything here is spot on minus the bold. Read is an exceptionally better player than everyone listed, save Laughton. Laughton could very well be a guy that eventually moves Read off the roster, but that remains to be seen as of this writing.
- mochoson

You kidding me? I suggested Konecny was a higher ranked prospect than Laughton just the other day and it was treated as a slight on Laughton. Scott is already a star!

I couldn't disagree with this more. None of those players, including Laughton, will ever score 20 plus goals in this league. Nor will they do it playing the types of minutes Read does.
- MBFlyerfan

I generally agree with your statement, but your point is maybe a little strong on Laughton. He could score 20 in a given year. The bigger issue is that he is not a LW, and clearly the organization views him as a center. Considering the lack of real prospects on the left side there has been no drive to move him to the left (so far).

You kidding me? I suggested Konecny was a higher ranked prospect than Laughton just the other day and it was treated as a slight on Laughton. Scott is already a star!


- hereticpride

I backread your comment the other day, but for the record I agree. Konecny has a higher ceiling. Rankings are subjective, so it comes down to whether a person values ceiling, timeframe to reach NHL, or likelihood to reach it.

I generally agree with your statement, but your point is maybe a little strong on Laughton. He could score 20 in a given year. The bigger issue is that he is not a LW, and clearly the organization views him as a center. Considering the lack of real prospects on the left side there has been no drive to move him to the left (so far).
- TheGreat28

I wonder if Hakstol will have any semi-shocking moves in store for us in camp, like moving Laughton to LW.

You are being a little disingenuous here. In his first year here, Read very nearly hit your 50 point plateau (24-23-47). His second year was on par, pro-rated over the full year (lockout year) would have been in the 46-48 point range.

Compare that to Raffl's 2 year totals (30-20-50). Oh, and Raffl played top-line minutes for a good chunk of last season.

Read has been playing with Couturier for the last 2 years. His high-ankle sprain clearly affected his performance. But there is a chicken and egg thing as well - is Read hurting Couturier's development or has Cout's lack of an offensive game hindered Read's performance?
- TheGreat28

Read averaged 3 more minutes per game, and averaged 1:36 in PP time to Raffls 25 seconds. Raffl is also 3 years younger, and likely hasn't hit his ceiling yet.