If it provides any clarity, Giroux would take the faceoff. But technically, If I'm the coach, I'd immediately have them swap off the face-off if it's won. Given how good Giroux is at face-offs, I'm expecting this to happen. I wouldn't have them change spots until there was established puck possession in the offensive zone.

Alternatively, I'd consider Bellemare and Raffl over Couturier in the last minute of the game. I consider Giroux, Voracek, and Couturier to be the Flyers 3 best forwards as of this writing, so that's probably the first 3 I'd go with. Streit and MDZ on D if we're down a goal.
- mochoson

Please explain your infatuation with Bellemare. I think he's a very good, solid 4th line player who can provide complimentary offense in that role. What makes you think he's suited to a 3rd line wing role or why he is a player you'd want out in the last minute over a guy like Couturier, Simmonds, Schenn, Gagner, Read, or even Lecavalier (if he's in the lineup).

If it provides any clarity, Giroux would take the faceoff. But technically, If I'm the coach, I'd immediately have them swap off the face-off if it's won. Given how good Giroux is at face-offs, I'm expecting this to happen. I wouldn't have them change spots until there was established puck possession in the offensive zone.

Alternatively, I'd consider Bellemare and Raffl over Couturier in the last minute of the game. I consider Giroux, Voracek, and Couturier to be the Flyers 3 best forwards as of this writing, so that's probably the first 3 I'd go with. Streit and MDZ on D if we're down a goal.
- mochoson

Why would you want Giroux to move to the wing? Depending on the situation, if the goaltender is pulled, and the faceoff is on Giroux's weak hand, I may put Couturier out to take the draw, but I'm not moving Giroux out of the center spot other than for that reason. We're paying him 8+M a year to be the team's #1 center, and he's one of the top playmaking centers in the league, why move him out of position?
Bellemare wouldn't be on my list down a goal, he's not much of an offensive player. He's a checking 4th line center.

Attention, all: The Eagles (the band) were nothing special.

Attention, all: The Eagles (the band) were nothing special.
- jmatchett383

Jesus, man, could you change the channel? I had a rough night and I hate the ________ Eagles, man!

Lol I have no idea where to inject myself into this Raffl-Read discourse....but I just want to defend Raffl for a minute on what someone said earlier about his 7 assists and saying he's a bad playmaker and making a statement about him playing on the first line relative to that stat. Guy isn't Adam Oates, but I'm going to call that a REALLY fluky thing.

Raffl this year had the worst First Assists per 60 min (evens) on the team at .14. That's just bad haha. In terms of 2A/60, he finished respectably 5th. Yet, as good as G and Jake are, they both finished 9th and 10th in goals/60 on the team. Umberger was 8. (Pukes on screen. Wipes it off). As an aside, I don't think must people realize how average-mediocre G and Jake performed at even scoring relative to their talent level and total points numbers. In terms of even strength points per 60 among qualified players, Jake was 34 and G 188 in the NHL in P/60 at evens. To be fair, that was probably a bit fluky (for G a LOT fluky) as well. I would think Raffl's assist numbers and those two's goal numbers fed off one another. Bad meets bad.

Raffl, season before and his first in NHL, he had the HIGHEST 1A/60 on the Flyers...and the second lowest 2A. I don't discount secondary assists, just like it favored Raffl this past sesaon, but inarguably first assists are more important in judging a player's work.

What to make of this? Raffl is probably the second best possession driver behind Jake at evens. All the analytics I've delved into pretty much back up that. He's a beast at driving play. His first assist totals were paltry this year, really good last year. I just can't help but think of Jeff Carter who in the lockout year I continually was baffled at how he registered 26 goals and 7 assists in 48 games. It seemed weird to look at. Carter is a much better player than Raffl but that was pretty much Raffl's stat line in 15 more games with no powerplay. That was fluky. So, I think Raffl is a better playmaker than he gets credit for and his stats this year will no doubt improve in terms of assists. I mean they have to, those numbers are ridiculous. You HAVE to be a good playmaker if you're a monster possession player. Maybe not the most skilled playmaker, but a good one nevertheless. It means you read and anticipate play well.

Moral: I'd like to see what he does this season. His numbers have been puzzling. I err on the side of unsustainably fluky.

Jesus, man, could you change the channel? I had a rough night and I hate the ________ Eagles, man!
- countreeman28

Some dude here at work is playing his Old Dinosaur Man Music Mix which has about 800 Eagles songs on it, each worse than the one before.

http://thehockeywriters.c...50-drafted-nhl-prospects/

13. D Ivan Provorov
19. D Travis Sanheim (Philadelphia Flyers)
40. D Samuel Morin
44. D Shayne Gostisbehere

Lol I have no idea where to inject myself into this Raffl-Read discourse....but I just want to defend Raffl for a minute on what someone said earlier about his 7 assists and saying he's a bad playmaker and making a statement about him playing on the first line relative to that stat. Guy isn't Adam Oates, but I'm going to call that a REALLY fluky thing.

Raffl this year had the worst First Assists per 60 min (evens) on the team at .14. That's just bad haha. In terms of 2A/60, he finished respectably 5th. Yet, as good as G and Jake are, they both finished 9th and 10th in goals/60 on the team. Umberger was 8. (Pukes on screen. Wipes it off). As an aside, I don't think must people realize how average-mediocre G and Jake performed at even scoring relative to their talent level and total points numbers. In terms of even strength points per 60 among qualified players, Jake was 34 and G 188 in the NHL in P/60 at evens. To be fair, that was probably a bit fluky (for G a LOT fluky) as well. I would think Raffl's assist numbers and those two's goal numbers fed off one another. Bad meets bad.

Raffl, season before and his first in NHL, he had the HIGHEST 1A/60 on the Flyers...and the second lowest 2A. I don't discount secondary assists, just like it favored Raffl this past sesaon, but inarguably first assists are more important in judging a player's work.

What to make of this? Raffl is probably the second best possession driver behind Jake at evens. All the analytics I've delved into pretty much back up that. He's a beast at driving play. His first assist totals were paltry this year, really good last year. I just can't help but think of Jeff Carter who in the lockout year I continually was baffled at how he registered 26 goals and 7 assists in 48 games. It seemed weird to look at. Carter is a much better player than Raffl but that was pretty much Raffl's stat line in 15 more games with no powerplay. That was fluky. So, I think Raffl is a better playmaker than he gets credit for and his stats this year will no doubt improve in terms of assists. I mean they have to, those numbers are ridiculous. You HAVE to be a good playmaker if you're a monster possession player. Maybe not the most skilled playmaker, but a good one nevertheless. It means you read and anticipate play well.

Moral: I'd like to see what he does this season. His numbers have been puzzling. I err on the side of unsustainably fluky.
- Mononoke

Giroux had a subpar year scoring at ES for him, like everyone I'm sure, I expect that to change. Voracek was 15th overall in the NHL in ES points, so I don't think it's fair to say that he was average to mediocre at ES scoring. He was extremely good at ES scoring in my opinion.

Lol I have no idea where to inject myself into this Raffl-Read discourse....but I just want to defend Raffl for a minute on what someone said earlier about his 7 assists and saying he's a bad playmaker and making a statement about him playing on the first line relative to that stat. Guy isn't Adam Oates, but I'm going to call that a REALLY fluky thing.

Raffl this year had the worst First Assists per 60 min (evens) on the team at .14. That's just bad haha. In terms of 2A/60, he finished respectably 5th. Yet, as good as G and Jake are, they both finished 9th and 10th in goals/60 on the team. Umberger was 8. (Pukes on screen. Wipes it off). As an aside, I don't think must people realize how average-mediocre G and Jake performed at even scoring relative to their talent level and total points numbers. In terms of even strength points per 60 among qualified players, Jake was 34 and G 188 in the NHL in P/60 at evens. To be fair, that was probably a bit fluky (for G a LOT fluky) as well. I would think Raffl's assist numbers and those two's goal numbers fed off one another. Bad meets bad.

Raffl, season before and his first in NHL, he had the HIGHEST 1A/60 on the Flyers...and the second lowest 2A. I don't discount secondary assists, just like it favored Raffl this past sesaon, but inarguably first assists are more important in judging a player's work.

What to make of this? Raffl is probably the second best possession driver behind Jake at evens. All the analytics I've delved into pretty much back up that. He's a beast at driving play. His first assist totals were paltry this year, really good last year. I just can't help but think of Jeff Carter who in the lockout year I continually was baffled at how he registered 26 goals and 7 assists in 48 games. It seemed weird to look at. Carter is a much better player than Raffl but that was pretty much Raffl's stat line in 15 more games with no powerplay. That was fluky. So, I think Raffl is a better playmaker than he gets credit for and his stats this year will no doubt improve in terms of assists. I mean they have to, those numbers are ridiculous. You HAVE to be a good playmaker if you're a monster possession player. Maybe not the most skilled playmaker, but a good one nevertheless. It means you read and anticipate play well.

Moral: I'd like to see what he does this season. His numbers have been puzzling. I err on the side of unsustainably fluky.
- Mononoke

OK, so I was the guy who made the point. And I get it, you're an advanced analytics guy. The thing with advanced analytics...they are best used as leading indicators, not performance measures. Case in point...any statistic that suggests that Umberger's performance last year was better in any possible way than G or Jake is clearly misleading.

Perhaps Jake and G's even strength woes were due in part to having no one on the other side for the better part of the year that truly complemented their high level of play.

Raffl is a great value for the money plus the acquisition cost. As Bill said, he is a strong role player that can move up and down the line while still performing at a high level. I still question whether he's the best fit, short and long term, on the top line. If there were any level of competition in the entire organization, I'd say his job (on the top line) would be in jeopardy.

Earlier we were talking about possible changes Hakstol might make. A feasible change might be to flip Read and Raffl at some point.

Yes, Matt Read is all those things, and I'm really fond of him as a player.

But out of all the players on the team that I wouldn't want to see traded, he's the guy I could most easily let go of, and for one simple reason: his age.

Even though he had a late start to his career, 29/30 is historically the beginning of the end for peak production from forwards -- even if he rebounds from last season, who's to say how many years he has left of 40-ish points/20-ish goals?

When his legs start declining, does he have enough game/talent to keep being that steady middle-6 guy? I don't know.
- Tomahawk

Pretty much. I love the guy, but when the legs go, can he still be an effective player? Not sold. The trouble is, right now, if Read produces and plays like he did his first 3 seasons, there's nothing that is on hand to replace that combination of production, defensive ability and special teams play.

Lol I have no idea where to inject myself into this Raffl-Read discourse....but I just want to defend Raffl for a minute on what someone said earlier about his 7 assists and saying he's a bad playmaker and making a statement about him playing on the first line relative to that stat. Guy isn't Adam Oates, but I'm going to call that a REALLY fluky thing.

Raffl this year had the worst First Assists per 60 min (evens) on the team at .14. That's just bad haha. In terms of 2A/60, he finished respectably 5th. Yet, as good as G and Jake are, they both finished 9th and 10th in goals/60 on the team. Umberger was 8. (Pukes on screen. Wipes it off). As an aside, I don't think must people realize how average-mediocre G and Jake performed at even scoring relative to their talent level and total points numbers. In terms of even strength points per 60 among qualified players, Jake was 34 and G 188 in the NHL in P/60 at evens. To be fair, that was probably a bit fluky (for G a LOT fluky) as well. I would think Raffl's assist numbers and those two's goal numbers fed off one another. Bad meets bad.

Raffl, season before and his first in NHL, he had the HIGHEST 1A/60 on the Flyers...and the second lowest 2A. I don't discount secondary assists, just like it favored Raffl this past sesaon, but inarguably first assists are more important in judging a player's work.

What to make of this? Raffl is probably the second best possession driver behind Jake at evens. All the analytics I've delved into pretty much back up that. He's a beast at driving play. His first assist totals were paltry this year, really good last year. I just can't help but think of Jeff Carter who in the lockout year I continually was baffled at how he registered 26 goals and 7 assists in 48 games. It seemed weird to look at. Carter is a much better player than Raffl but that was pretty much Raffl's stat line in 15 more games with no powerplay. That was fluky. So, I think Raffl is a better playmaker than he gets credit for and his stats this year will no doubt improve in terms of assists. I mean they have to, those numbers are ridiculous. You HAVE to be a good playmaker if you're a monster possession player. Maybe not the most skilled playmaker, but a good one nevertheless. It means you read and anticipate play well.

Moral: I'd like to see what he does this season. His numbers have been puzzling. I err on the side of unsustainably fluky.
- Mononoke

Excellent post! Raffl also wins battles in the offensive zone corners that often lead to scoring opportunities and powerplays. Stats only show part of the puzzle, my eyes tell me that Raffl is a very valuable player.

Excellent post! Raffl also wins battles in the offensive zone corners that often lead to scoring opportunities and powerplays. Stats only show part of the puzzle, my eyes tell me that Raffl is a very valuable player.
- BiggE

Ha! MY eyes tell me he is a 2nd / 3rd line forward thrust into a role due an absolute dearth of players who are comfortable on the left side within the organ-EYE-zation.

OK, so I was the guy who made the point. And I get it, you're an advanced analytics guy. The thing with advanced analytics...they are best used as leading indicators, not performance measures. Case in point...any statistic that suggests that Umberger's performance last year was better in any possible way than G or Jake is clearly misleading.

Perhaps Jake and G's even strength woes were due in part to having no one on the other side for the better part of the year that truly complemented their high level of play.


- TheGreat28

Tons of factors come into play, when looking at the numbers. Your point concerning Umberger is fantastic, and really eye opening. I don't think using points per 60 is the best way to look at it. I watched Voracek play all season long. If the conclusing being drawn from looking at some stats is that Voracek was average to mediocre at ES scoring, I think that points to some questionable stats.

Please explain your infatuation with Bellemare. I think he's a very good, solid 4th line player who can provide complimentary offense in that role. What makes you think he's suited to a 3rd line wing role or why he is a player you'd want out in the last minute over a guy like Couturier, Simmonds, Schenn, Gagner, Read, or even Lecavalier (if he's in the lineup).
- jmatchett383

I personally like what I saw from him this year a lot. It's highly unusual that a player like Bellemare, who's never played on North American professional ice, comes over and adjusts that well to the tougher aspects of the game. I definitely think there is a little more to his game. He only averaged 12 minutes a game, and 2 minutes of that was playing on the PK. Our PK was awful, but it wasn't because of Bellemare.

I like the way he thinks the game quite a bit. I think that's why he's able to come over to a smaller ice surface and play 12 minutes a night. The fact that he understands the game well enough defensively to come over and average 2 minutes a game on the PK in the best professional league in the world as a 29 year old rookie was pretty impressive to me.

I dont think there's much more to his game, but I do think there's another 2 minutes or so of even strength ice time in his legs for sure. If he's placed on the 3rd line as a wing, I think we'd like the results. I see him as a guy that can easily move around in the bottom 6, where as I see Schenn as a guy that easily moves around in the top 6. I don't think 20-30 points for Bellemare is very unrealistic if he's playing 14+ minutes a game. How Hakstol chooses to use him remains to be seen.

Call it personal preference. In the last minute of the game, I want at least one player with those kind of attributes on the ice. If we can't score a goal with Giroux, Voracek, Streit, and MDZ, I don't think we were meant to win.

But again, personally, I like Bellemare a lot. I definitely don't think we've figured out quite how useful he is yet, not all that different from what some thought of Raffl last summer (and were right).

Lol I have no idea where to inject myself into this Raffl-Read discourse....but I just want to defend Raffl for a minute on what someone said earlier about his 7 assists and saying he's a bad playmaker and making a statement about him playing on the first line relative to that stat. Guy isn't Adam Oates, but I'm going to call that a REALLY fluky thing.

Raffl this year had the worst First Assists per 60 min (evens) on the team at .14. That's just bad haha. In terms of 2A/60, he finished respectably 5th. Yet, as good as G and Jake are, they both finished 9th and 10th in goals/60 on the team. Umberger was 8. (Pukes on screen. Wipes it off). As an aside, I don't think must people realize how average-mediocre G and Jake performed at even scoring relative to their talent level and total points numbers. In terms of even strength points per 60 among qualified players, Jake was 34 and G 188 in the NHL in P/60 at evens. To be fair, that was probably a bit fluky (for G a LOT fluky) as well. I would think Raffl's assist numbers and those two's goal numbers fed off one another. Bad meets bad.

Raffl, season before and his first in NHL, he had the HIGHEST 1A/60 on the Flyers...and the second lowest 2A. I don't discount secondary assists, just like it favored Raffl this past sesaon, but inarguably first assists are more important in judging a player's work.

What to make of this? Raffl is probably the second best possession driver behind Jake at evens. All the analytics I've delved into pretty much back up that. He's a beast at driving play. His first assist totals were paltry this year, really good last year. I just can't help but think of Jeff Carter who in the lockout year I continually was baffled at how he registered 26 goals and 7 assists in 48 games. It seemed weird to look at. Carter is a much better player than Raffl but that was pretty much Raffl's stat line in 15 more games with no powerplay. That was fluky. So, I think Raffl is a better playmaker than he gets credit for and his stats this year will no doubt improve in terms of assists. I mean they have to, those numbers are ridiculous. You HAVE to be a good playmaker if you're a monster possession player. Maybe not the most skilled playmaker, but a good one nevertheless. It means you read and anticipate play well.

Moral: I'd like to see what he does this season. His numbers have been puzzling. I err on the side of unsustainably fluky.
- Mononoke

Giroux's ES goal scoring drought no doubt played a role, as did Raffl's lack of PP time. I think it's more a fluke among a season of flukes. There were a lot of strange trends last season for this team.

I think if he's given a stead role, playing in the top six, he could end up being a consistent 20-25 G, 40-45 point threat, who plays a solid two way game.

Ha! MY eyes tell me he is a 2nd / 3rd line forward thrust into a role due an absolute dearth of players who are comfortable on the left side within the organ-EYE-zation.
- TheGreat28

That's OK, we'd probably just trade a guy who could be a top line LW for a 4-5 defenseman or washed up 4th liner or a bad, but shorter, contract

Beisbol news:

Ken Rosenthal says sources have told him Chase Utley has cleared waivers and could be traded to any team, depending on his 10-5 no trade protection

Beisbol news:

Ken Rosenthal says sources have told him Chase Utley has cleared waivers and could be traded to any team, depending on his 10-5 no trade protection
- Jsaquella

Thats surprising. I thought someone would claim him

[quote=mochoson]

His salary isn't a fact? The salary cap isn't a fact?

Flyers cap issues are much to do about nothing. Hyperbole. As far as player salaries, Andrew MacDonald will be a bargain in 2068

Thats surprising. I thought someone would claim him
- PhillySportsGuy

I thought it'd be 50-50...thee years left at $15mm per. Might be worth a mid level prospect or two to get the Phillies to eat 25-50% of that

Pretty much. I love the guy, but when the legs go, can he still be an effective player? Not sold. The trouble is, right now, if Read produces and plays like he did his first 3 seasons, there's nothing that is on hand to replace that combination of production, defensive ability and special teams play.
- Jsaquella

Moving Matt Read really depends on what the trade offers look like. I'd definitely like to move his deal next summer if the returns look good.

One guy that can definitely help make the decision easier, at least for me, is Scott Laughton. What do we think is best for his development at this point? Flyers, or start the year off in the AHL?

His salary isn't a fact? The salary cap isn't a fact?

Flyers cap issues are much to do about nothing. Hyperbole. As far as player salaries, Andrew MacDonald will be a bargain in 2068
- PLindbergh31

Yep. The cap only rose this season because the players voted to use the 5% escalator. Had they refused to do so, which happened before last season, the cap would have gone down from last season

Giroux's ES goal scoring drought no doubt played a role, as did Raffl's lack of PP time. I think it's more a fluke among a season of flukes. There were a lot of strange trends last season for this team.

I think if he's given a stead role, playing in the top six, he could end up being a consistent 20-25 G, 40-45 point threat, who plays a solid two way game.
- Jsaquella

Brandon Perlini. Sonny Milano. Paul Bittner. Anthony Duclair. Vladislav Kamenev.

Just picking out some names. Bottom line, if any of their teams offered up any of those guys straight up for Raffl, would you say no?

Moving Matt Read really depends on what the trade offers look like. I'd definitely like to move his deal next summer if the returns look good.

One guy that can definitely help make the decision easier, at least for me, is Scott Laughton. What do we think is best for his development at this point? Flyers, or start the year off in the AHL?
- mochoson

It's hard to read. He looked NHL ready before he got lit up by Niskanen, wasn't the same player after and struggled in AHL following his demotion. Really depends how his camp goes and how he looks in pre-season.

Thats surprising. I thought someone would claim him
- PhillySportsGuy

Remember, in baseball you still have to trade for him if you win the claim.