Ironically, the owner of the Flyers is the Chairman of the company the league has its US TV deal with......
- furso27

Not a conflict of interest, is it? But then again, the league owning a team?

Anyone seeing a team making minor trades that might indicate they're clearing cap space (to get Sharp)? I'm not seeing anything. JJ - you seeing anything?

Mercy.

Good to see the board's Oliver Stone is out this morning. Who cares what Arizona did? Toronto did the same thing at the deadline taking on Nathan Horton. Florida did the same thing with Savard. I am sure that rule will be tweaked in the next CBA just like signing guys for 30 years to lower cap hits, and ditching guys in the minors or france, hello Huet, to get rid of "bad deals". None of this matters to the legitimacy that is the Hawks cup win. Dear god.

As far as Sharp goes.....I don't really even care more. Until he is actually traded, I don't care to read about where or why he wasn't. Seems to me some information is coming out to spin a failed, if it happened, negotiation to put more pressure on the player or team(s) involved. I'm not buying Sharp would demand to be traded out of Florida 8 months after getting there IF they weren't in contention. In the offseason, with a 1 year to go, and his buddy Campbell signing elsewhere, sure.....Again, I am 99.99% sure the hawks are trying to do the right thing for them AND for Sharp as to where he lands for his days in the Indian head. will that work out? Who the hell knows. It' getting late, the market is shrinking, but I'm sure Bowman has a few options still in the chamber........and...........

For every trade that is forecasted, Vermette, how many aren't? Saad? Point is, I don't think anyone, anywhere has ALL the pieces to any rumor or deal that comes out of 1901 w Madison. I'm not diminishing John as John more often then not has MORE pieces then some so called experts, but would just caution everyone not to buy everything being said. Nobody like private conversations, and details leaked, and when pieces that are factual are, spin control always takes place.

Until a Kruger or Oduya sign or get traded (Kruger) elsewhere I think we can assume Bowman is closing in on something. If they are no longer options for the hawks, then we can start questioning the time frame Stan is operating under.

It's a game of chicken, and so far Stan is winning because the pieces he COVETS (Oduya, Kruger) are STILL there for him to have. Until those are gone, or give a firm deadline for the Hawks to hit, this could continue to linger.

Not a conflict of interest, is it? But then again, the league owning a team?
- powerenforcer

Wasn't Tampa supposed to win the cup, and the league was going to make it that happen?

Come on.......I'm not saying there aren't some things at play to draw out ratings, but some of this stuff is way out there....

One is a replacement for an injured player. How is that circumventing the cap?

Perhaps you need to refresh your memory on the meaning of the word:

Fits the Pronger and Savard deals much better wouldn't you say?

As you say, they're both allowed, but one is legit and one really is not. I expect the NHL to close that loophole eventually.
- darkman

Had Kane not been injured and on LTIR until the play-offs began, they would not have been able to do the TDL deals and they would not have had Vermette etc. on the roster for the play-offs - BECAUSE OF THE CAP.

Because of Kane's injury, they were able to "get around (the cap) in a clever...way" (certainly not dishonest).

Completely fits your definition of "circumvent".

Both are allowed - BOTH ARE LEGIT because they are allowed.

Had Kane not been injured and on LTIR until the play-offs began, they would not have been able to do the TDL deals and they would not have had Vermette etc. on the roster for the play-offs - BECAUSE OF THE CAP.

Because of Kane's injury, they were able to "get around (the cap) in a clever...way" (certainly not dishonest).

Completely fits your definition of "circumvent".

Both are allowed - BOTH ARE LEGIT because they are allowed.
- StLBravesFan

I'd argue that the Progner/Savard ones are a lot more dishonest as those kinds of contracts are now banned... yet a team is still using a low actual salary/high cap hit to get up to the floor while not actually paying out that salary. The injury one is a lgit replacement for an injured player.

Win if you can, lose if you must, but always cheat.
- Dunconn_Smythe

"A man who wouldn't cheat for a poke don't want one bad enough."

Augustus McCrae (courtesy of Larry McMurtry)

And I heard form a third independent source this morning (from FL, covers the Panthers) there was/is something to this.

With all due respect, Brian Hedger has no more credibility in shooting something down than I do in going out with a story. In fact, if he's getting his info from a team pr hack . . .
- John Jaeckel

All different stories going around...When someone has the correct story they get bragging rights otherwise it can be a merry go around of hearsay. I also think stories are planted with a purpose....More often than most think.

I told u Seabrook rumors would be coming...Got asked about him yesterday.

All different stories going around...When someone has the correct story they get bragging rights otherwise it can be a merry go around of hearsay. I also think stories are planted with a purpose....More often than most think.

I told u Seabrook rumors would be coming...Got asked about him yesterday.
- Al

I remember Seabrook rumors going around last year. People get desperate for news when nothing is happening. Stan could honestly hold out until September/October liek he did with Leddy. He might lose Oduya, but he could still do it.

Anyone else eager for some trades?

I think Kruger is a good long-term investment for 5 years at $2.2M. Johnny Oduya maybe for another 2-3 years at $3.5-4M.

Hopefully Stan Bowman gets them signed as his "return" for trading Sharp. According to Hockeyscap.com the Hawks are about $2M over the cap. If they can be 10% over the cap, doesn't that allow them to be about $7M over the cap? With that extra $5M, can't they sign Oduya now and still be okay? Or, does the 10% overage include future performance bonuses, which is about $3.3M? It must, right, as that would put the Hawks over by $5.3M... And we know Kruger and Oduya ain't signin' for $1.8M… Anyone know for sure??

This being said, if they trade Bickell and two prospects to a team for nothing in return, that alone would give them $5.8M to work with, including the performance bonuses. Engineer a trade for Versteeg for nothing in return, and that gives them $8M to work with, also including the bonuses… That $8M easily lets you sign Kruger and Oduya.

If I'm Stan Bowman, maybe I seriously explore these options just to get Kruger and Oduya signed. Then, moving Sharp for just the right return can be my summer project. Either way, the roster is basically complete for next year aside from moving Sharp. Will it be a Nick Leddy situation? Probably… but the roster is basically set for the next year.

Every team can do what Arizona did.

It's a "joke" that a team can replace injured players and then have them stay on the play-off roster when the injured player returns.

I'm not demeaning the Hawks' Cup win - they did it legitimately and within the rules - but the rules seem a little stupid to me sometimes.
- StLBravesFan

Two different situations entirely...

Check time stamp:

Just heard this.

Panthers want Sharp, in a BIG WAY, but that makes it hard for them to accept his condition. They want him long term as part of their marketing the team in South FL, "face of the franchise," trust me Panthers fans, that is a good role for him.

His condition is the problem. he wants an assurance if they're not competitive that he can go elsewhere. It is at a "standstill" over this.

There is another team, possibly the Islanders, that has given Bowman a drop dead date for their deal. Something could happen soon.
- John Jaeckel

Hey JJ, What happened with this.

There is another team, possibly the Islanders, that has given Bowman a drop dead date for their deal. Something could happen soon.

Had Kane not been injured and on LTIR until the play-offs began, they would not have been able to do the TDL deals and they would not have had Vermette etc. on the roster for the play-offs - BECAUSE OF THE CAP.

Because of Kane's injury, they were able to "get around (the cap) in a clever...way" (certainly not dishonest).

Completely fits your definition of "circumvent".

Both are allowed - BOTH ARE LEGIT because they are allowed.
- StLBravesFan

They would have had Vermette on roster but not others most likely.
Also if Kane wasn't hurt matchups could have been different too...Maybe they finish higher...

Two different situations entirely...
- Al

But both apparently legal and within the rules of the CBA.

Remind me again how the Pronger trade is a fiasco?

Are fans really mad that Arizona used his contact to get to the floor? Really?
- carcus

Agreed. I guess some think injuries should be allowed to destroy a team for years or at least keep them from making the playoffs. The cap was established supposedly to create parity. A player gets injured and teams are allowed to use that cap space to maintain parity. What's the difference? Kane had a legit injury that required surgery. In order to make the playoffs the Hawks were allowed to use his cap space. They did and won the Cup. All teams are allowed to carry more players in the playoffs - not just the Hawks - so where is the cheat? Unless an injury was faked it isn't illegal and the way it was used actually fulfills the general purpose of the rule.

Pronger had a severe long term injury and the cap space (which is a commodity in every sport a cap exists) can be traded to a team that has it. AZ has added some solid assets with their extra cap space. The picks and prospects to rent Vermette and Michalek. Duclair for Yandle. They got Grossman with Pronger and will probably move him at this year's TDL for a haul. Both sides get what they want and the lesser team collects assets to achieve parity.

I'd argue that the Progner/Savard ones are a lot more dishonest as those kinds of contracts are now banned... yet a team is still using a low actual salary/high cap hit to get up to the floor while not actually paying out that salary. The injury one is a lgit replacement for an injured player.
- JRoenick97

Hey....let me know if you need help getting down from that high horse.

Anyone else eager for some trades?

I think Kruger is a good long-term investment for 5 years at $2.2M. Johnny Oduya maybe for another 2-3 years at $3.5-4M.

Hopefully Stan Bowman gets them signed as his "return" for trading Sharp. According to Hockeyscap.com the Hawks are about $2M over the cap. If they can be 10% over the cap, doesn't that allow them to be about $7M over the cap? With that extra $5M, can't they sign Oduya now and still be okay? Or, does the 10% overage include future performance bonuses, which is about $3.3M? It must, right, as that would put the Hawks over by $5.3M... And we know Kruger and Oduya ain't signin' for $1.8M… Anyone know for sure??

This being said, if they trade Bickell and two prospects to a team for nothing in return, that alone would give them $5.8M to work with, including the performance bonuses. Engineer a trade for Versteeg for nothing in return, and that gives them $8M to work with, also including the bonuses… That $8M easily lets you sign Kruger and Oduya.

If I'm Stan Bowman, maybe I seriously explore these options just to get Kruger and Oduya signed. Then, moving Sharp for just the right return can be my summer project. Either way, the roster is basically complete for next year aside from moving Sharp. Will it be a Nick Leddy situation? Probably… but the roster is basically set for the next year.
- DMChi2010

The 10% overage does not include the bonus cushion. When calculating, you would calculate the same as you would the actual cap number, excluding all bonuses at the beginning of the season.

Mercy.

Good to see the board's Oliver Stone is out this morning. Who cares what Arizona did? Toronto did the same thing at the deadline taking on Nathan Horton. Florida did the same thing with Savard. I am sure that rule will be tweaked in the next CBA just like signing guys for 30 years to lower cap hits, and ditching guys in the minors or france, hello Huet, to get rid of "bad deals". None of this matters to the legitimacy that is the Hawks cup win. Dear god.

As far as Sharp goes.....I don't really even care more. Until he is actually traded, I don't care to read about where or why he wasn't. Seems to me some information is coming out to spin a failed, if it happened, negotiation to put more pressure on the player or team(s) involved. I'm not buying Sharp would demand to be traded out of Florida 8 months after getting there IF they weren't in contention. In the offseason, with a 1 year to go, and his buddy Campbell signing elsewhere, sure.....Again, I am 99.99% sure the hawks are trying to do the right thing for them AND for Sharp as to where he lands for his days in the Indian head. will that work out? Who the hell knows. It' getting late, the market is shrinking, but I'm sure Bowman has a few options still in the chamber........and...........

For every trade that is forecasted, Vermette, how many aren't? Saad? Point is, I don't think anyone, anywhere has ALL the pieces to any rumor or deal that comes out of 1901 w Madison. I'm not diminishing John as John more often then not has MORE pieces then some so called experts, but would just caution everyone not to buy everything being said. Nobody like private conversations, and details leaked, and when pieces that are factual are, spin control always takes place.

Until a Kruger or Oduya sign or get traded (Kruger) elsewhere I think we can assume Bowman is closing in on something. If they are no longer options for the hawks, then we can start questioning the time frame Stan is operating under.

It's a game of chicken, and so far Stan is winning because the pieces he COVETS (Oduya, Kruger) are STILL there for him to have. Until those are gone, or give a firm deadline for the Hawks to hit, this could continue to linger.
- SteveRain

THIS x 1,000,000

But both apparently legal and within the rules of the CBA.
- StLBravesFan

Yes, but Pronger more of a loophole situation...Hawks would rather have had no injury to Kane.

This circumvention talk is nonsense. Kane sustained a legitimate injury that would keep him out long enough to be placed on LTIR. Teams can use the salary cap space of players on LTIR as long as the player is on LTIR. The timing of Kane's injury was fortuitous for the Hawks in that it was before the TDL and Kane was ready to come off LTIR when the playoffs started. If the recovery time was stated 7-8 weeks instead of 12 weeks, the Kane LTIR money could still have been used to acquire Vermette and Timonen. As long as Kane was unable to play he would stay on LTIR and LTIR rules apply.

Where's the circumvention or shady loophole type machination that supposedly needs to be fixed? It isn't there because the system works as designed - the Hawks just got lucky that the timing worked out right for them.

Yes, but Pronger more of a loophole situation...Hawks would rather have had no injury to Kane.
- Al

No injury, no cup. I'm sure they're fine with how it played out.

If they can be 10% over the cap, doesn't that allow them to be about $7M over the cap? With that extra $5M, can't they sign Oduya now and still be okay? Or, does the 10% overage include future performance bonuses, which is about $3.3M? It must, right, as that would put the Hawks over by $5.3M... And we know Kruger and Oduya ain't signin' for $1.8M… Anyone know for sure??
- DMChi2010

I don't think current cap space is the issue. I think the issue is that they need to get Oduya and Kruger signed to deals that will work when the team has to be cap compliant, not just today. And they can't have certainty about what the numbers on those deals can be until Sharp and Bickell (and maybe Versteeg) are moved.

This circumvention talk is nonsense. Kane sustained a legitimate injury that would keep him out long enough to be placed on LTIR. Teams can use the salary cap space of players on LTIR as long as the player is on LTIR. The timing of Kane's injury was fortuitous for the Hawks in that it was before the TDL and Kane was ready to come off LTIR when the playoffs started. If the recovery time was stated 7-8 weeks instead of 12 weeks, the Kane LTIR money could still have been used to acquire Vermette and Timonen. As long as Kane was unable to play he would stay on LTIR and LTIR rules apply.

Where's the circumvention or shady loophole type machination that supposedly needs to be fixed? It isn't there because the system works as designed - the Hawks just got lucky that the timing worked out right for them.
- EbonyRaptor

Also the NHL can have an independent Doctor examine a player on LTIR if they suspect fraud at any time.

No injury, no cup. I'm sure they're fine with how it played out.
- Dunconn_Smythe

Your opinion....If he's healthy everything changes and like I said Vermette is most likely here anyway...Hawks had some room and there was a market for Ben Smith.

Your opinion....If he's healthy everything changes and like I said Vermette is most likely here anyway...Hawks had some room and there was a market for Ben Smith.
- Al

your opinion.