that's similar to TJ Oshie, Datsyuk last year.
If I'm correct, he's 12/26 in his career, that's definitely top 20 in league.

and on the 'fallacy' of him putting up the numbers bc of Kessel and JVR, and when playing on 3rd line he would have way lesser numbers: depends on how Bozak is being used. Since he is good on faceoffs, he gets alot of defensive zone starts (when not with Kessel) so it's obvious his points totals drop.
So it's not just linemates, but as well point drop caused by defensive zone starts (vs offensive zone starts when with Kessel)
- MaximusAurelius

why do you value faceoffs so much?
the difference between 48% and 52% over a season is very small.

that's similar to TJ Oshie, Datsyuk last year.
If I'm correct, he's 12/26 in his career, that's definitely top 20 in league.

and on the 'fallacy' of him putting up the numbers bc of Kessel and JVR, and when playing on 3rd line he would have way lesser numbers: depends on how Bozak is being used. Since he is good on faceoffs, he gets alot of defensive zone starts (when not with Kessel) so it's obvious his points totals drop.
So it's not just linemates, but as well point drop caused by defensive zone starts (vs offensive zone starts when with Kessel)
- MaximusAurelius

Corsi Relative: -4.3
– A Corsi relative score of -4.3 indicates that the Toronto Maple Leafs get 4.3 LESS shot attempts than their opponents when he is on the ice (60 minute measurement) as opposed to when he is off the ice.
– This number ranks Tyler Bozak as the worst Maple Leafs centerman. One can normally argue that Bozak is likely facing the opponents top line but Nazem Kadri has actually been deployed in that role, as evidenced by their quality of competiton:
Nazem Kadri: 0.706 Corsi Rel QoC
Tyler Bozak: 0.471 Corsi Rel QoC

Relative Quality of Competition: 0.471
– Tyler Bozak has the second highest QoC Rel amongst Maple Leafs C, indicating that he is playing against the opposing teams second best lines.
– This is concerning given Bozak’s -31 rating on the season, especially when we take into consideration the fact that Kadri is playing against the oppositions top line and is only a -7.
– Bozak’s possession statistics (-4.3 Corsi Rel) indicate that he is regularly being outmatched by a teams second line. If this continues, that cap hit is going to look much worse in the coming years.

On/Off Ice +/-: -1.63
On Ice +/- per 60 Minutes: -1.71
Off Ice +/- per 60 Minutes: -0.08
– The Toronto Maple Leafs even strength +/- worsened by 1.63 goals per 60 minutes when Tyler Bozak was on the ice as opposed to when he was not.
– Coupling this with the fact that he was playing against the opponents second line, it begins to paint a scary picture about his two-way capabilities.

Corsi Relative: -4.3
– A Corsi relative score of -4.3 indicates that the Toronto Maple Leafs get 4.3 LESS shot attempts than their opponents when he is on the ice (60 minute measurement) as opposed to when he is off the ice.
– This number ranks Tyler Bozak as the worst Maple Leafs centerman. One can normally argue that Bozak is likely facing the opponents top line but Nazem Kadri has actually been deployed in that role, as evidenced by their quality of competiton:
Nazem Kadri: 0.706 Corsi Rel QoC
Tyler Bozak: 0.471 Corsi Rel QoC

Relative Quality of Competition: 0.471
– Tyler Bozak has the second highest QoC Rel amongst Maple Leafs C, indicating that he is playing against the opposing teams second best lines.
– This is concerning given Bozak’s -31 rating on the season, especially when we take into consideration the fact that Kadri is playing against the oppositions top line and is only a -7.
– Bozak’s possession statistics (-4.3 Corsi Rel) indicate that he is regularly being outmatched by a teams second line. If this continues, that cap hit is going to look much worse in the coming years.

On/Off Ice +/-: -1.63
On Ice +/- per 60 Minutes: -1.71
Off Ice +/- per 60 Minutes: -0.08
– The Toronto Maple Leafs even strength +/- worsened by 1.63 goals per 60 minutes when Tyler Bozak was on the ice as opposed to when he was not.
– Coupling this with the fact that he was playing against the opponents second line, it begins to paint a scary picture about his two-way capabilities.
- AdamFrench

Or you could just say "Bozak sucks."

This whole idea that he'd make a great #3 because of his faceoff abilities is so laughable.

His 52% or 53% means he wins one or two more faceoffs a game on average. But since he's such a liability in his own end, it's simply not worth it.

why do you value faceoffs so much?
the difference between 48% and 52% over a season is very small.
- senstroll

Kadri is about 45-46%, and Bozak 53 (had one bad season below 50%, rest all 53%+).
Bozak took around 1700 faceoff last year.
that's about 150 wins difference between both of them (based on the 1700).
that's about 2-4 goal difference. (4 when on special teams, 2 in 'average situations').
1 goal difference is 1/3 point in NHL standings.

basically, the difference between Bozak and Kadri taking those faceoffs is 1 point per season.

As a direct individual statistic, that's quite an impact.

Ok, long time reader, first time posting. I have a question, would you guys trade morgan rielly for the 3rd overall pick? I am having a debate with a couple of emptyheads, lol.

Ok, long time reader, first time posting. I have a question, would you guys trade morgan rielly for the 3rd overall pick? I am having a debate with a couple of emptyheads, lol.
- buttndunn

And then you draft Hanifin to replace Rielly?

Ok, long time reader, first time posting. I have a question, would you guys trade morgan rielly for the 3rd overall pick? I am having a debate with a couple of emptyheads, lol.
- buttndunn

why would we?

why do you value faceoffs so much?
the difference between 48% and 52% over a season is very small.
- senstroll

You also have to factor in that the person with 48% is going to be facing weaker centres. While the one with 52% is going to face stronger ones.

Plus that 4% over the season can mean the difference between getting hemmed in your zone vs hemming the other team in their zone.

Ok, long time reader, first time posting. I have a question, would you guys trade morgan rielly for the 3rd overall pick? I am having a debate with a couple of emptyheads, lol.
- buttndunn

Anyone that enbraces the thought of trading Morgan Rielly also flushes their credibility as a knowledgeable hockey fan down the toilet


So, no pretty much.

Anyone that enbraces the thought of trading Morgan Rielly also flushes their credibility as a knowledgeable hockey fan down the toilet


So, no pretty much.
- t_leafs21

Rielly should get a 6 year deal after this season and then a 6 year deal again after that. Then maybe retire a Leaf too. He's got that much potential, to me anyway

You also have to factor in that the person with 48% is going to be facing weaker centres. While the one with 52% is going to face stronger ones.

Plus that 4% over the season can mean the difference between getting hemmed in your zone vs hemming the other team in their zone.
- KesselRules

So Kadri got the harder matchups..so what does that do?

You also have to factor in that the person with 48% is going to be facing weaker centres. While the one with 52% is going to face stronger ones.

Plus that 4% over the season can mean the difference between getting hemmed in your zone vs hemming the other team in their zone.
- KesselRules

False logic.

Look at the numbers Frenchie posted - Bozak was getting easier draws than Kadri.

You also have to factor in that the person with 48% is going to be facing weaker centres. While the one with 52% is going to face stronger ones.

Plus that 4% over the season can mean the difference between getting hemmed in your zone vs hemming the other team in their zone.
- KesselRules

http://statsportsconsulti.../FaceoffAnalysis12-12.pdf

Kadri is about 45-46%, and Bozak 53 (had one bad season below 50%, rest all 53%+).
Bozak took around 1700 faceoff last year.
that's about 150 wins difference between both of them (based on the 1700).
that's about 2-4 goal difference. (4 when on special teams, 2 in 'average situations').
1 goal difference is 1/3 point in NHL standings.

basically, the difference between Bozak and Kadri taking those faceoffs is 1 point per season.

As a direct individual statistic, that's quite an impact.
- MaximusAurelius

a) Kadri faced tougher competition; and

b) even if what you posted was true, it could all be negated by simply bringing in a better centre who can score 3 more goals/year than Bozak and prevent 3 more opposition goals per year. That would make the Leafs better off, and you could do it for about $2 million less per year, and maybe even develop a young kid instead of plugging up the middle with a guy who will never, ever get any better.

False logic.

Look at the numbers Frenchie posted - Bozak was getting easier draws than Kadri.
- Atomic Wedgie

Also facing the top line centre doesn't always mean facing the best face-off man on that team.

a) Kadri faced tougher competition; and

b) even if what you posted was true, it could all be negated by simply bringing in a better centre who can score 3 more goals/year than Bozak and prevent 3 more opposition goals per year. That would make the Leafs better off, and you could do it for about $2 million less per year, and maybe even develop a young kid instead of plugging up the middle with a guy who will never, ever get any better.
- Atomic Wedgie

http://faceoffs.net/player/nazem-kadri
http://faceoffs.net/player/tyler-bozak

I'm going to leave this here.

Anyone that enbraces the thought of trading Morgan Rielly also flushes their credibility as a knowledgeable hockey fan down the toilet


So, no pretty much.
- t_leafs21

relax. we're not talking about Nik Lidstrom or Scott Neidermayer here.

Also facing the top line centre doesn't always mean facing the best face-off man on that team.
- AdamFrench

Kadri's ability to draw penalties is worth 9+ goals

http://www.tsn.ca/drawing...luable-nhl-skill-1.192784

thats worth noting

Ok, long time reader, first time posting. I have a question, would you guys trade morgan rielly for the 3rd overall pick? I am having a debate with a couple of emptyheads, lol.
- buttndunn

I would. He has been poisoned. Start from scratch. Grab Hanifan and whomever with #4

Corsi Relative: -4.3
– A Corsi relative score of -4.3 indicates that the Toronto Maple Leafs get 4.3 LESS shot attempts than their opponents when he is on the ice (60 minute measurement) as opposed to when he is off the ice.
– This number ranks Tyler Bozak as the worst Maple Leafs centerman. One can normally argue that Bozak is likely facing the opponents top line but Nazem Kadri has actually been deployed in that role, as evidenced by their quality of competiton:
Nazem Kadri: 0.706 Corsi Rel QoC
Tyler Bozak: 0.471 Corsi Rel QoC

Relative Quality of Competition: 0.471
– Tyler Bozak has the second highest QoC Rel amongst Maple Leafs C, indicating that he is playing against the opposing teams second best lines.
– This is concerning given Bozak’s -31 rating on the season, especially when we take into consideration the fact that Kadri is playing against the oppositions top line and is only a -7.
– Bozak’s possession statistics (-4.3 Corsi Rel) indicate that he is regularly being outmatched by a teams second line. If this continues, that cap hit is going to look much worse in the coming years.

On/Off Ice +/-: -1.63
On Ice +/- per 60 Minutes: -1.71
Off Ice +/- per 60 Minutes: -0.08
– The Toronto Maple Leafs even strength +/- worsened by 1.63 goals per 60 minutes when Tyler Bozak was on the ice as opposed to when he was not.
– Coupling this with the fact that he was playing against the opponents second line, it begins to paint a scary picture about his two-way capabilities.
- AdamFrench

Great, now once every GM reads this, Bozak will never be traded.

- Pecafan Fan

Vermette and Gordon

Whole top line needs to go, worst line in hockey at caring about defence...

http://theleafsnation.com...pitals-interest-in-kessel

Kadri's ability to draw penalties is worth 9+ goals

http://www.tsn.ca/drawing...luable-nhl-skill-1.192784

thats worth noting
- senstroll

he can do that at wing as well..
never said bozak is better than kadri.
I'm just saying Bozak is a guy you want to keep as a #3C for crucial faceoffs, and special teams