I was using it to say that given the reports that Buffalo and Toronto offered the same financial package, Babcock actually took less to come to Toronto, and thus it wasn't purely a money decision.

It's still true, but by a much smaller margin than I thought.
- Feeling Glucky?

Assuming the Leafs pay him in Canadian dollars he certainly took less money.

Assuming the Leafs pay him in Canadian dollars he certainly took less money.
- Pierceme69

All contracts are in US dollars.

Assuming the Leafs pay him in Canadian dollars he certainly took less money.
- Pierceme69

I think everything is paid in USD in the NHL

I think everything is paid in USD in the NHL
- Feeling Glucky?

Well then. I got nothing.

So now that this little fiasco is officially over..
Do we go with an underwhelming "proven" coach or roll the dice on a successful AHL coach?

So maybe money has nothing to do with it but the highest paid coach now makes 6.25 million a year while the second highest paid coach makes 2.75.

Its a little about the money and he just finger-banged the coaching market in the ass.
- DynamicThreads

I don't think that really has much in the way of payoff.

so....6.5 million, huh? Is that how we get Scotty Bowman out of retirement?
- seedy

Did Bowman ever coach a team and better yet win with one that wasn't absolutely loaded with talent? Its been a long time and Im getting old but my guess is no.

I've said this time and time again, with or without Babcock, we don't win squat until this roster is loaded with talent, just like every other team that is at the top of the league. Players make the coach, a coach can only mess things up IMO.

So now that this little fiasco is officially over..
Do we go with an underwhelming "proven" coach or roll the dice on a successful AHL coach?
- 50GinosIn07

As I said this morning at 8 am,this was a done deal. I said it was 7 to 8'yeArs,then 15 minuts later,it turned south. He wanted to much control of the roster, it is a recipe for disaster. If Babcock is worth 50 million,Ken holland is worth 500 million. The red wings are Ken holland,not mIke Babcock. Eight years from now ,the LOAFS WILL still be looking for there first stanley cup in over 56 years. He wanted say in roster and he wants to try and win in Toronto,good luck

As I said this morning at 8 am,this was a done deal. I said it was 7 to 8'yeArs,then 15 minuts later,it turned south. He wanted to much control of the roster, it is a recipe for disaster. If Babcock is worth 50 million,Ken holland is worth 500 million. The red wings are Ken holland,not mIke Babcock. Eight years from now ,the LOAFS WILL still be looking for there first stanley cup in over 56 years. He wanted say in roster and he wants to try and win in Toronto,good luck
- Buffalo39

He wanted to tell Murray what to do?

He wanted to tell Murray what to do?
- Punch70

Mike Babcock 100% sticking point with sabres was roster control. He wanted to say who was on roster,who to send down. You can't have that. TED nolan tried to do that with John muckler and that's where it went south. Toronto is in for a big mess. Pegula was in the meeting and agreed to stop anymore negotiating ,that it would t work in buffalo

Mike Babcock 100% sticking point with sabres was roster control. He wanted to say who was on roster,who to send down. You can't have that. TED nolan tried to do that with John muckler and that's where it went south. Toronto is in for a big mess. Pegula was in the meeting and agreed to stop anymore negotiating ,that it would t work in buffalo
- Buffalo39

So Murray was willing to give up some ground, but not all the ground?

Mike Babcock 100% sticking point with sabres was roster control. He wanted to say who was on roster,who to send down. You can't have that. TED nolan tried to do that with John muckler and that's where it went south. Toronto is in for a big mess. Pegula was in the meeting and agreed to stop anymore negotiating ,that it would t work in buffalo
- Buffalo39

For all the comments about Babcock not wanting to be a GM, it sure sounds like he wants to (minus the contract discussions).

For all the comments about Babcock not wanting to be a GM, it sure sounds like he wants to (minus the contract discussions).
- thatsapickle

Who would want to be GM in Toronto now if that is the case. Your basically a contracts admin.

For all the comments about Babcock not wanting to be a GM, it sure sounds like he wants to (minus the contract discussions).
- thatsapickle

This is why TO was a good fit for him all along. They've been saying the GM won't be the same role as it is in other teams, with more of a committee take on decision making.

For all the comments about Babcock not wanting to be a GM, it sure sounds like he wants to (minus the contract discussions).
- thatsapickle

He knew what he was going to make on the open market,so why not ask for it all. He is a good coach,who had a great GM with great talent. With the leafs bad roster and no salary cap,he is in over his head,Ken holland isn't around anymore

For all the comments about Babcock not wanting to be a GM, it sure sounds like he wants to (minus the contract discussions).
- thatsapickle

Or the Sabres are trying to save face for Babcock wanting to coach a Canadian team that hasn't won a cup in forever. I think they qualify as a "new challenge" as Babcock put it

Who would want to be GM in Toronto now if that is the case. Your basically a contracts admin.
- BigStew

That's a great point. It narrows that window significantly. Maybe someone like Dubas or Hunter takes that aspect on?

So now that this little fiasco is officially over..
Do we go with an underwhelming "proven" coach or roll the dice on a successful AHL coach?
- 50GinosIn07

A source close to me says the sabres have already found their man

Or the Sabres are trying to save face for Babcock wanting to coach a Canadian team that hasn't won a cup in forever. I think they qualify as a "new challenge" as Babcock put it
- sbroads24

Possibly. It just seems like the hang up was control as many have stated. The control he seems to be getting is basically having the final say over the GM. That doesn't make sense.

That's a great point. It narrows that window significantly. Maybe someone like Dubas or Hunter takes that aspect on?
- thatsapickle

I guess it really doesn't matter if Shanahan/Babcock handle the hockey side, just need a good lawyer who understands the collective bargaining agreement now.

A source close to me says the sabres have already found their man
- Carubba-Kaleta

I figured that they would be swift to get the coaching position filled in the next week or so. They moved pretty fast as well after Marrone gave his two weeks.

I guess it really doesn't matter if Shanahan/Babcock handle the hockey side, just need a good lawyer who understands the collective bargaining agreement now.
- BigStew

That's true. Maybe Shanahan takes on the contracts/Player personnel side and Babcock has the coaching/Personnel aspect.

As I said this morning at 8 am,this was a done deal. I said it was 7 to 8'yeArs,then 15 minuts later,it turned south. He wanted to much control of the roster, it is a recipe for disaster. If Babcock is worth 50 million,Ken holland is worth 500 million. The red wings are Ken holland,not mIke Babcock. Eight years from now ,the LOAFS WILL still be looking for there first stanley cup in over 56 years. He wanted say in roster and he wants to try and win in Toronto,good luck
- Buffalo39

So wtf changed between 8am and 8:15am that wasn't apparent the night before? Did he all of a sudden try to pull a fast one on Pegula and co. at the last minute? It seems like everyone went to bed last night thinking the deal was done and everyone was happy. Then he wakes up and what, gets a last second phone call from Shanny saying he will be the man in TO for the same amount of term and dollar?

Good god, I really hope this blows up in their face, and not because its Toronto or that he burned us. But because he seems like a sketchy head-case who thinks way too highly of himself.

Possibly. It just seems like the hang up was control as many have stated. The control he seems to be getting is basically having the final say over the GM. That doesn't make sense.
- thatsapickle

We will have to wait and see what kind of control he gets in Toronto. It could go a number of ways.

He could have been using the Sabres the entire time, or Toronto could have given him full control, or Murray wouldn't give him any. It's probably a bit of all 3

So wtf changed between 8am and 8:15am that wasn't apparent the night before? Did he all of a sudden try to pull a fast one on Pegula and co. at the last minute? It seems like everyone went to bed last night thinking the deal was done and everyone was happy. Then he wakes up and what, gets a last second phone call from Shanny saying he will be the man in TO for the same amount of term and dollar?

Good god, I really hope this blows up in their face, and not because its Toronto or that he burned us. But because he seems like a sketchy head-case who thinks way too highly of himself.
- DynamicThreads

Babcocks camp called Toronto right after our deal was set.