You're, a fool BTW.
- sammy87

+1

We have an option that could replace Letang in time. He needs experience. We have nothing close to a top six forward, absent Kapanen maybe in the system. Bennett is a hinderance, not a solution. We are in more dire needs for quality forwards than trying to find a replacement for Letang.
- Oneonta Penguin

You know the prospects in the system better than me, just trying to give an outside looking in opinion. I'm sure someone would take a chance on Bennett if you guys wanted a more experienced foward. Similar to Del Zotto for Klein. Taking a chance on a young player for an established player.

Well 71 admitted he was not injured and healthy when he was on the ice for the playoffs and Spaling had more pts than him.
- sammy87

He said he had a couple minor injuries......

Well first off, you have Nyquist on the 2nd line.. with.. Colin Wilson... Nyquist is a perimeter player that plays with 2 of the better centers in the league in Dats and Z and you expect him to excel with Colin Wilson (who is a good hockey player, but he's not Datsyuk or Zetterberg)? You've severely hindered his ability to produce by taking a playmaking center away from him.

2nd... you have Kapenan on the 2nd line, who even knows if he is ready for the big show? Let the kid develop in WBS. No need to bring him up and crush his confidence if he can't do anything. Especially with Colin Wilson (not a slight, but he is no Malkin.) as his center.

3rd... Why would Buffalo trade Grigorenko for Sutter? Also, he has 6 points in 25 games... so you're going to trade away a 20 goal 3rd line center (albeit with his deficincies.. he does score goals.) for a largely unproven young prospect?

4th... Dupuis? Dude's career might be over, I'm not going to bank on him coming back.

5th... Winnik was awful. Why?


I don't think this lineup is better than our 2014-15 lineup when everyone is healthy.
- j.boyd919

I made up lines in 30 seconds just to get an idea. So throw line combos out the window.

Kapanen is thrown in there but it could be mantha or fiala. At least they are real life top 6 potential and probablyalready an upgrade over comeau at this ppoint.

Dupuis is a solid thrird liner if he can play. If not, keep kunitznor sign a free agent 3rs liner.

3rd...u basically said yourself that sutter is better than grigs, so why wwouldn't buff do it? Grigs has,been developing well these days and will be a cheap replacement with upsode?. This lineup has lotsof guys that could score 20 goals so the loss of sSutter in that regard is moot.

Winnik is perfectly fine on the 4th line. He's proven that over a long career..he looked like poop cause he was in the top 6

I missed the series. Did Pittsburgh trade Letang yet?

Don't forget that mgmt could easily be covering themselves from looking bad. They may not fire JR but he could easily still choose to say he "resigns"

I am starting to think the biggest problem with the Pens is what I originally thought was their biggest strength, the two headed monster.

Hear me out.

After the cup win the leadership unit from that team (Guerin and Roberts) retired and the new leaders became Crosby and Malkin. The problem is they are two very different players, but are also two players that lead by example. So neither is the sole leader of the team, so instead of a single leader to rally around we have two leaders we rally behind. Some may think this is Sids team but I'm not too sure. I rarely hear Pens players refer to Sid as the Captain, he's always referred to as "the best player in the world".

So rather than building a team, I think we have been trying to build the two headed monster. We've been trying to build two lines so much that, that has become our team identity. We aren't the Pens so much as we are Sid and Geno. Look at how other teams talk about us, it's always "when you have two talents like that you are always dangerous" it's never about the team it's always about those two. Even on here all we talk about is how you don't trade away that kind of talent, and how shameful is it that we lose when we have those two. I think it has even trickled down to the rest of the team that if those two cant do it then it's a lost cause.

One of Sid or Malkin should be traded this off season and the team should be built around the one that remains. It come down to who do we want to lead this team?

The mechanical, relentless effort of Crosby or the fluid, creative genius of Malkin.

The team needs a defined identity and it also needs to have new life breathed into it. Now is the time to move away from the two headed monster.

Trade proposal time.

Malkin + Pouliot + 2nd to Colorado for MacKinnin + O'Reilly + 1st

I am starting to think the biggest problem with the Pens is what I originally thought was their biggest strength, the two headed monster.

Hear me out.

After the cup win the leadership unit from that team (Guerin and Roberts) retired and the new leaders became Crosby and Malkin. The problem is they are two very different players, but are also two players that lead by example. So neither is the sole leader of the team, so instead of a single leader to rally around we have two leaders we rally behind. Some may think this is Sids team but I'm not too sure. I rarely hear Pens players refer to Sid as the Captain, he's always referred to as "the best player in the world".

So rather than building a team, I think we have been trying to build the two headed monster. We've been trying to build two lines so much that, that has become our team identity. We aren't the Pens so much as we are Sid and Geno. Look at how other teams talk about us, it's always "when you have two talents like that you are always dangerous" it's never about the team it's always about those two. Even on here all we talk about is how you don't trade away that kind of talent, and how shameful is it that we lose when we have those two. I think it has even trickled down to the rest of the team that if those two cant do it then it's a lost cause.

One of Sid or Malkin should be traded this off season and the team should be built around the one that remains. It come down to who do we want to lead this team?

The mechanical, relentless effort of Crosby or the fluid, creative genius of Malkin.

The team needs a defined identity and it also needs to have new life breathed into it. Now is the time to move away from the two headed monster.

Trade proposal time.

Malkin + Pouliot + 2nd to Colorado for MacKinnin + O'Reilly + 1st
- stackthepads

Hockey message board so I am willing to play ball...

Close but poukiot isa hard throw in...and ROR is fine but rrisky with the contract status...iI'd prefer landeskog or duchene

I am starting to think the biggest problem with the Pens is what I originally thought was their biggest strength, the two headed monster.

Hear me out.

After the cup win the leadership unit from that team (Guerin and Roberts) retired and the new leaders became Crosby and Malkin. The problem is they are two very different players, but are also two players that lead by example. So neither is the sole leader of the team, so instead of a single leader to rally around we have two leaders we rally behind. Some may think this is Sids team but I'm not too sure. I rarely hear Pens players refer to Sid as the Captain, he's always referred to as "the best player in the world".

So rather than building a team, I think we have been trying to build the two headed monster. We've been trying to build two lines so much that, that has become our team identity. We aren't the Pens so much as we are Sid and Geno. Look at how other teams talk about us, it's always "when you have two talents like that you are always dangerous" it's never about the team it's always about those two. Even on here all we talk about is how you don't trade away that kind of talent, and how shameful is it that we lose when we have those two. I think it has even trickled down to the rest of the team that if those two cant do it then it's a lost cause.

One of Sid or Malkin should be traded this off season and the team should be built around the one that remains. It come down to who do we want to lead this team?

The mechanical, relentless effort of Crosby or the fluid, creative genius of Malkin.

The team needs a defined identity and it also needs to have new life breathed into it. Now is the time to move away from the two headed monster.

Trade proposal time.

Malkin + Pouliot + 2nd to Colorado for MacKinnin + O'Reilly + 1st
- stackthepads

What return do you think Sid could generate?

I'm not trying to make excuses, but I don't put all the blame on Johnston.. in his 1st year as head coach, I think he did a pretty solid job. Made adjustments when needed. I wouldn't be mad if they kept him around. But that would likely mean keeping JR... I'd like to lose him. Bring someone else in and that someone else would more than likely want to bring his own coach in too.
- j.boyd919

J Boyd. There is no bigger Pens fan than me, but when they hired these 2 I knew it was a mistake. Rutherford's teams didn't make the playoff for 5 years. When he was relieved of his duties they were awful. How the h*** does he get the job here? Morehouse wanted a YES man so he could get more involved in personnel movements. This is why they interviewed a lot of candidates and I think they were turned down by them. Now Rutherford comes in makes a couple good moves but also made some horrible descisions. To top it off they play 5 games with 5 d-men. To me this is inexcusable. What would of happened if another d-man got hurt?
Injuries should not be used. Bylsma made game 7 vs Tampa Bay without Crosby and Malkin for at least 25 games.

The coach is clueless. He has 2 of the best players in the league yet goes to a defensive system and the team can't score. In training camp, when Bennett got hurt, he said Kapanen ran into him. Kapanen was asked about it and said he wasn't even on the ice. Later in the season he talked about the upcoming series with Washington being important. Problem was they weren't playing Washington for 2 more weeks. I am not defending Bylsma, but I never heard him screw up like that.

What return do you think Sid could generate?
- Johnny Wrath

More than Malkin and Sid is a player than every team would be interested in. Malkin I don't think would have across the league interest.

I do think that both Sid and Geno are open to being traded, as long as it's to a situation where they can succeed I think they wave.

More than Malkin and Sid is a player than every team would be interested in. Malkin I don't think would have across the league interest.

I do think that both Sid and Geno are open to being traded, as long as it's to a situation where they can succeed I think they wave.
- stackthepads

I would take Malkin in a heartbeat. As for Crosby, I wouldn't touch him with a 10' pole. Why would any team want a whining primadona that has no concept of team. Everything would have to be about him.

More than Malkin and Sid is a player than every team would be interested in. Malkin I don't think would have across the league interest.

I do think that both Sid and Geno are open to being traded, as long as it's to a situation where they can succeed I think they wave.
- stackthepads

What if Pittsburgh traded both of them? Would either want to be the guy left to pick up the pieces?

Hockey message board so I am willing to play ball...

Close but poukiot isa hard throw in...and ROR is fine but rrisky with the contract status...iI'd prefer landeskog or duchene
- YouMeAndDupuis9

I prefer ROR over Duchene for the second line. Top end shut down centers are tough to find, and I think ROR fits the Crosby team format. There would need to be a sign and trade, I don't take him if he wants to hit free agency.
MacKinnon is Crosbys friend, and would be the sniper on the top line. And I think acquiring MacK re-energizes Sid.

I would like to see a team built on how Crosby and Hornqvist play.

I would take Malkin in a heartbeat. As for Crosby, I wouldn't touch him with a 10' pole. Why would any team want a whining primadona that has no concept of team. Everything would have to be about him.
- DJBAKER0513

Didn't your best player hold out on contract negotiations to get his way?

Didn't your best player hold out on contract negotiations to get his way?
- stackthepads

He did not holdout. he was not under contract and the club told him he could not be in the facility. He did not get what was reported that he wanted. He doesn't go crying to the refs anytime he gets hit on the ice.

What if Pittsburgh traded both of them? Would either want to be the guy left to pick up the pieces?
- Johnny Wrath

I don't think it's a good idea to trade both. And I also don't think there will be ma h pieces left to pick up. The team is going to be almost brand new next year.

Defense all new names except Letang. Scuds will be bought out.
Bottom six can be all new with trading Sutter.
Top six will be all new (horny + Perron are still pretty new)
Kunitz and Dupuis may be back. Both of them are Sid type players.

It's as close as a fresh start as you can probably get without completely starting over.

He did not holdout. he was not under contract and the club told him he could not be in the facility. He did not get what was reported that he wanted. He doesn't go crying to the refs anytime he gets hit on the ice.
- DJBAKER0513

He had one good season and the team wanted him to sign a bridge like almost every other player in his position. He wanted a big pay out and refused to play until he got it.
But hey thanks for stopping by with your tired Crosby is a whiner narrative.

I would take Malkin in a heartbeat. As for Crosby, I wouldn't touch him with a 10' pole. Why would any team want a whining primadona that has no concept of team. Everything would have to be about him.
- DJBAKER0513

Of course you wouldn't want him. Then who would Dubinsky cheap shot every chance he gets?

He had one good season and the team wanted him to sign a bridge like almost every other player in his position. He wanted a big pay out and refused to play until he got it.
But hey thanks for stopping by with your tired Crosby is a whiner narrative.
- stackthepads

Get your facts straight. If you are not under contract you can't play! By the way he did sign a bridge deal. He is still an RFA when this contract is up.

And the Pens could have had Boone Jenner, but we got Joe Morrow instead.
- sammy87

its comical who we could have had instead of Joe Morrow.

Think how most would feel about this team if we had Jenner or Saad on our roster right now.

Question to all though. Would you rather how Flip Fosberg or Pouliot?

Of course you wouldn't want him. Then who would Dubinsky cheap shot every chance he gets?
- acdc1206

Since when is covering a player and not letting that player skate freely around the ice cheap shotting him. Crosby is one of the dirtiest players in hockey because he knows the refs will not call a penalty on him. have watch many cheap shots by him.

Get your facts straight. If you are not under contract you can't play! By the way he did sign a bridge deal. He is still an RFA when this contract is up.
- DJBAKER0513

The club offered him a two-year bridge contract worth $3-million a year but Overhardt countered with a request for $13-million over the same period, the team said.

John Davidson, the team’s director of hockey operations, was clearly agitated when he spoke at the Blue Jackets media day three weeks ago. He repeatedly said he had negotiated in good faith — also offering Johansen $32-million for six years and $46-million over eight — but had referred to Johansen’s demands as “extortion.”

Sounds like a real team player to me.

I would take Malkin in a heartbeat. As for Crosby, I wouldn't touch him with a 10' pole. Why would any team want a whining primadona that has no concept of team. Everything would have to be about him.
- DJBAKER0513

Such one, that all Crosby does is charity work like crazy, does a ton of off ice stuff for hospitals, for kids and just about anything else. He was the face of the NHL from the age of 18 and has never one time been in any kind of trouble. I mean, I have never even heard of him getting one speeding ticket. It cracks me up, coming from a jackets fan, after their guy held out like a baby to get his way.

The team needs to accept that we're not going to be competitive next year and cut the dead weight already. Accept a down year while guys like Dumo, Pouliot, Bennett, Kapa develop and don't sign guys to multi-year deals just to stay "competitive" unless they permanently address a need (I've looked, there aren't any real top 6 guys out there).

Trade Kunitz, Sutter (I would think 2nd rounder or prospect-level returns for each)

Dump Scuderi, Lovejoy for whatever you can get (or buy out Scuds). That's not to say that Lovejoy can't be a serviceable bottom pairing guy, just that he's in the way of Pouliot, Dumoulin, Harrington developing in a suitable role. Him being really average as a #4 is an example they don't need.

Re-sign Winnik (if he's expecting <2.5M), Bennett, maybe Comeau if he accepts <1.3M. Winnik was good all the way up to the playoffs and has a long career of being good, you'd have to assume he was injured (or has a Toronto curse).

Try and re-sign Perron while he's cheap. He has a career of being good, he's going to bounce back in a big way.

Let the following walk:
Ehrhoff (wasn't as bad as some of you think, but he was never utilised properly anyway), Martin (can't believe guys are poopting on him after he was our best defenseman for at LEAST 2 years while Letang was working through kinks), Adams (yay!), Lapierre (he may be better in the playoffs but he's not what we need), Downie (does us no favours with the ref, definitely underrated by many offensively though), Chorney (yeah he was NHL calibre in the playoffs, but he doesn't have the upside to make it worth blocking a better prospect).

If Duper isn't ready to go, find a bounceback UFA with enough hands to possess the puck that can PK on a 1 year deal. Ideally we get back something from trades that fits this need.

Sign a 1Y stopgap for the spot next to Sid and a 1Y stopgap for the top 4 D.

Let the WBS guys fight out for the remaining spots.

STOPGAP - CROSBY - HORNQVIST
PERRON - MALKIN - BENNETT/DUPUIS/WBS
WINNIK - SUNDQVIST/SPALING - BENNETT/DUPUIS/WBS
WBS/TRADE - SPALING/SUNDVIST - WBS/TRADE
WBS

MAATTA - LETANG
POULIOT/DUMOULIN - STOPGAP
POULIOT/DUMOULIN - COLE/HARRINGTON
COLE/WHOEVER

FLEURY
ZATKOFF

Let the young guys develop on D and wait a year for real top 6 solutions to appear for trade/signing.