I'm all for using both first rounders to draft the BPA
- nastyflyergirl

If you keep making sense on this board, someone might follow your lead and then we'd have TWO people being sensible. And what pray tell would happen if others chose to join in? The entertainment value of this board would plummet, that is what would happen.

Cut it out.

Now.

If you keep making sense on this board, someone might follow your lead and then we'd have TWO people being sensible. And what pray tell would happen if others chose to join in? The entertainment value of this board would plummet, that is what would happen.

Cut it out.

Now.
- Doc_Sarcasm

Not that it's any of my business but last night I took your side on a subject but now it's time for me to take MJL's side.

It isn't Vinny fault he took what was offered by the Philadelphia Flyers. It's the Philadelphia Flyers fault for offering what they did to Vinny. Clearly in the beginning they wanted Vinny. Clearly (like many) the Flyers thought Vinny would be good enough to honor his contract. Right now things haven't worked out. In my personal opinion, I think Vinny has gone beyond the call of duty last summer to remove himself from this situation. Vinny and his agent have spoke to other teams to see if there would be any takers (As far as we know), when it really should be up to the Flyers to find a trade a partner. Now there is odd speculation that Vinny should do the Flyers a solid at age 34 by shortening his career and retire early. I don't know how anyone can suggest with a straight face.
- SuperSchennBros

hmm. but on a serious note, if any of you do actually convince Vinny to retire, can you pull the same mind tricks on ryan howard?

please and thank you.

hmm. but on a serious note, if any of you do actually convince Vinny to retire, can you pull the same mind tricks on ryan howard?

please and thank you.
- stayinthefnnet

You're preaching to the choir my man.

Is it Selk or Selky?

hmm. but on a serious note, if any of you do actually convince Vinny to retire, can you pull the same mind tricks on ryan howard?

please and thank you.
- stayinthefnnet

What do you mean, he hit a home run the other night!

Not that it's any of my business but last night I took your side on a subject but now it's time for me to take MJL's side.

It isn't Vinny fault he took what was offered by the Philadelphia Flyers. It's the Philadelphia Flyers fault for offering what they did to Vinny. Clearly in the beginning they wanted Vinny. Clearly (like many) the Flyers thought Vinny would be good enough to honor his contract. Right now things haven't worked out. In my personal opinion, I think Vinny has gone beyond the call of duty last summer to remove himself from this situation. Vinny and his agent have spoke to other teams to see if there would be any takers (As far as we know), when it really should be up to the Flyers to find a trade a partner. Now there is odd speculation that Vinny should do the Flyers a solid at age 34 by shortening his career and retire early. I don't know how anyone can suggest with a straight face.
- SuperSchennBros

Vinny did reportedly turn down more money up front because he wanted more years. He would be tradable right now if not for thag. It can't just be only one party in the wrong. Both are to blame.

I just don't know what else the Flyers can do at this point. They gave him free reign to seek a trade and no one wants him. Do you really want him here for the remainder of the deal? Do you really want Hextall to retain max salary to get a deal done? I can only assume that the latter doesn't even apply given the unconfirmed reports that Vinny is willing to retire sooner of it will help a trade.

Give him the preseason and 15 games under the new coach. If he doesn't produce something of value to this team in that time then I'm done with him entirely and I can only assume that the coaches and front office will be too. Sit him. Pay him. Repeat until its over. Flyers miserable. Vinny miserable.

I just can't put much blame on Hextall going forward. He can eat money but he can't just force a trade. Vinny needs to come down to earth too and realize that the NHL as a whole has zero interest in that contract.

hmm. but on a serious note, if any of you do actually convince Vinny to retire, can you pull the same mind tricks on ryan howard?

please and thank you.
- stayinthefnnet

Just Ryan?

I would love to see the team sold and ownership buy a small market team and move them here.

Vinny did reportedly turn down more money up front because he wanted more years. He would be tradable right now if not for thag. It can't just be only one party in the wrong. Both are to blame.

I just don't know what else the Flyers can do at this point. They gave him free reign to seek a trade and no one wants him. Do you really want him here for the remainder of the deal? Do you really want Hextall to retain max salary to get a deal done? I can only assume that the latter doesn't even apply given the unconfirmed reports that Vinny is willing to retire sooner of it will help a trade.

Give him the preseason and 15 games under the new coach. If he doesn't produce something of value to this team in that time then I'm done with him entirely and I can only assume that the coaches and front office will be too. Sit him. Pay him. Repeat until its over. Flyers miserable. Vinny miserable.

I just can't put much blame on Hextall going forward. He can eat money but he can't just force a trade. Vinny needs to come down to earth too and realize that the NHL as a whole has zero interest in that contract.
- hereticpride

I think your chasing gold at the end of a rainbow. I don't really agree with how you view the situation at all.

Vinny did reportedly turn down more money up front because he wanted more years. He would be tradable right now if not for thag. It can't just be only one party in the wrong. Both are to blame.

I just don't know what else the Flyers can do at this point. They gave him free reign to seek a trade and no one wants him. Do you really want him here for the remainder of the deal? Do you really want Hextall to retain max salary to get a deal done? I can only assume that the latter doesn't even apply given the unconfirmed reports that Vinny is willing to retire sooner of it will help a trade.

Give him the preseason and 15 games under the new coach. If he doesn't produce something of value to this team in that time then I'm done with him entirely and I can only assume that the coaches and front office will be too. Sit him. Pay him. Repeat until its over. Flyers miserable. Vinny miserable.

I just can't put much blame on Hextall going forward. He can eat money but he can't just force a trade. Vinny needs to come down to earth too and realize that the NHL as a whole has zero interest in that contract.
- hereticpride

It's a catch 22 full of suckdom. Lecavalier has to prove that he can still play, the Flyers didn't have the right situation to play him in, and his play didn't warrant more icetime.

It's a catch 22 full of suckdom. Lecavalier has to prove that he can still play, the Flyers didn't have the right situation to play him in, and his play didn't warrant more icetime.
- MJL

I still feel like there was a point where the fourth line was really clicking. At this point Lecavalier was leading the charge for that line. When the offense began to fade, I thought there was an opportunity to at least try Vinny with more talented players but Berube stayed stubborn to his lines. Other players moved around (Including Rinaldo seeing regular shifts on others lines, with arguable more talented players) to keep Lecavalier, Bellemare and Vandevelde together. This is one of the issues that I had with Berube.

It's a catch 22 full of suckdom. Lecavalier has to prove that he can still play, the Flyers didn't have the right situation to play him in, and his play didn't warrant more icetime.
- MJL

That's pretty much it. Either they're stuck together now or one side makes a drastic change.

It's a catch 22 full of suckdom. Lecavalier has to prove that he can still play, the Flyers didn't have the right situation to play him in, and his play didn't warrant more icetime.
- MJL

Bullseye!

I still feel like there was a point where the fourth line was really clicking. At this point Lecavalier was leading the charge for that line. When the offense began to fade, I thought there was an opportunity to at least try Vinny with more talented players but Berube stayed stubborn to his lines. Other players moved around (Including Rinaldo seeing regular shifts on others lines, with arguable more talented players) to keep Lecavalier, Bellemare and Vandevelde together. This is one of the issues that I had with Berube.
- SuperSchennBros

I think the situation is on Lecavalier, not the coach. He has to either play better, or change his game. Not sure if either is possible.

I think the situation is on Lecavalier, not the coach. He has to either play better, or change his game. Not sure if either is possible.
- MJL

I think the situation was very much on the Coach. Umberger played with more talented players, further up in the line up, played regularly both in ice time and consecutive games before getting hurt and produced less.

Just Ryan?

I would love to see the team sold and ownership buy a small market team and move them here.
- hereticpride

as long as amaro and his scouting staff goes, im game.

just conveniently leave ken giles behind. never thought id see the day where my favorite player was an above average 7th/8th inning guy.

Was Lecavalier used right? No. Did he do enough to deserve a bigger role? No.

The trouble with Vinny is, he's pretty much useless unless he's producing offense. The brief run of success with VandeVelde & Bellemare could have encouraged Berube to try him with better players or on a secondary scoring line, but there's enough other issues to understand the reluctance.

It's a bad situation for both team and player. If I was Hextall, I'd be trying like Hell to trade him and I'd be willing to eat money. If that's impossible, they have to consider a buy out, as distatseful as carrying 6 years of dead Vinny space is

Was Lecavalier used right? No. Did he do enough to deserve a bigger role? No.

The trouble with Vinny is, he's pretty much useless unless he's producing offense. The brief run of success with VandeVelde & Bellemare could have encouraged Berube to try him with better players or on a secondary scoring line, but there's enough other issues to understand the reluctance.

It's a bad situation for both team and player. If I was Hextall, I'd be trying like Hell to trade him and I'd be willing to eat money. If that's impossible, they have to consider a buy out, as distatseful as carrying 6 years of dead Vinny space is
- Jsaquella

I can't disagree with this. I'm not arguing that he's still a star. I understand the importance of removing him from the roster but I'm not gonna sit here and agree Berube did Vinny any favours whether he deserved it or not.

I can't disagree with this. I'm not arguing that he's still a star. I understand the importance of removing him from the roster but I'm not gonna sit here and agree with Berube did Vinny any favours whether he deserved it or not.
- SuperSchennBros

I don't think Berube did him any favors, but I also don't think he was owed any favors. Sucks for him, but it also sucks for the team. I'm not blaming anyone, they just have to fix the situation however they can

I don't think Berube did him any favors, but I also don't think he was owed any favors. Sucks for him, but it also sucks for the team. I'm not blaming anyone, they just have to fix the situation however they can
- Jsaquella

Blame Holmgren

I don't think Berube did him any favors, but I also don't think he was owed any favors. Sucks for him, but it also sucks for the team. I'm not blaming anyone, they just have to fix the situation however they can
- Jsaquella

blame everyone

blame everyone
- wilsonecho91

Confirmed: Everyone traded for noone

I still feel like there was a point where the fourth line was really clicking. At this point Lecavalier was leading the charge for that line. When the offense began to fade, I thought there was an opportunity to at least try Vinny with more talented players but Berube stayed stubborn to his lines. Other players moved around (Including Rinaldo seeing regular shifts on others lines, with arguable more talented players) to keep Lecavalier, Bellemare and Vandevelde together. This is one of the issues that I had with Berube.
- SuperSchennBros

This is EXACTLY my issue. And when Vinny was left on the "4th" line even after Umberger and Simmonds went down, I was left shaking my head.

I'm not advocating buying out Vinny this summer. Maybe next summer, you have to give a chance to realize that he just can't compete at this level anymore. After this summer, I believe his actual money to be received goes down. If he comes back, I think it has to be explained to him that is role is going to the 13th forward. It sucks, but it is what it is.

Maybe if the Flyers eat half his contract, there might be some interest. However, I don't want a premium asset added to the trading of Vinny and eating half his salary to make a trade happen.

I'm not advocating buying out Vinny this summer. Maybe next summer, you have to give a chance to realize that he just can't compete at this level anymore. After this summer, I believe his actual money to be received goes down. If he comes back, I think it has to be explained to him that is role is going to the 13th forward. It sucks, but it is what it is.

Maybe if the Flyers eat half his contract, there might be some interest. However, I don't want a premium asset added to the trading of Vinny and eating half his salary to make a trade happen.
- ravishingone

Even if we have to eat half his salary, it's better than buying him out. The buyout penalty will be dead weight on the cap for 4 more years at that point, half his salary will only be deadweight for two more.