it's time to think outside the box for HC


- wilsonecho91

well, if you trade him for brandon sutter you wont have to retain anything.
- stayinthefnnet

Sorry.

If we trade him for a legitimate hockey player, how much can we retain?

(Sutter goes on to score a hat trick tonight)

It is probably just me, but I feel a different coach handles Vinny differently. If you want specifics I cant say how, other than my own opinion that Berube seemed to go out of his way to embarrass Vinny by not only using him the way he did, but giving him a much shorter rope than he gave other players with much less pedigree.

There was a personal issue there in my opinion.
- MBFlyerfan

I don't think it was personal at all. Vinny simply can't handle the 200-foot pacing and is too much of a defensive liability. Last season, he was tried at second-line center, second-line right wing, first-line left wing, third-line right wing, fourth-line center and fourth-line RW. He was not sufficiently effective in any of the roles.

This season, after Lecavalier got off an OK start at second-line center and then struggled after returning from injury, Berube probably figured he had no interest in doing the same thing as last season and expecting a different outcome. So he shuttled Lecavalier between the 4th line RW spot and the healthy scratch list.

Hextall made a point yesterday that I think is valid: If Vinny thought he deserved to be moved back up in the lineup again, he could have converted more of the scoring chances he did get and he'd have at least given the club pause to consider increasing his ice time and role again.

Unless the Flyers bring in a new coach who has a system in which Lecavalier is well suited and is willing to overlook his defensive/skating shortcomings -- and I don't think that will be the case -- there is no need to prolong this any further.

Lecavalier has had a tremendous career and is a really nice guy who conducts himself with class and dignity. He deserves a clean slate somewhere else but he also has to accept that it wasn't simply a matter of Berube not using him the right way. He has to play better.

I don't think it was personal at all. Vinny simply can't handle the 200-foot pacing and is too much of a defensive liability. Last season, he was tried at second-line center, second-line right wing, first-line left wing, third-line right wing, fourth-line center and fourth-line RW. He was not sufficiently effective in any of the roles.

This season, after Lecavalier got off an OK start at second-line center and then struggled after returning from injury, Berube probably figured he had no interest in doing the same thing as last season and expecting a different outcome. So he shuttled Lecavalier between the 4th line RW spot and the healthy scratch list.

Hextall made a point yesterday that I think is valid: If Vinny thought he deserved to be moved back up in the lineup again, he could have converted more of the scoring chances he did get and he'd have at least given the club pause to consider increasing his ice time and role again.

Unless the Flyers bring in a new coach who has a system in which Lecavalier is well suited and is willing to overlook his defensive/skating shortcomings -- and I don't think that will be the case -- there is no need to prolong this any further.

Lecavalier has had a tremendous career and is a really nice guy who conducts himself with class and dignity. He deserves a clean slate somewhere else but he also has to accept that it wasn't simply a matter of Berube not using him the right way. He has to play better.
- bmeltzer

Fair enough.

He has to play better.
- bmeltzer

Given the wear and tear of his career and his age, is this a realistic possibility?

i hope someone headshots pk subban into next season after his cheap ass shot yesterday

Couturier and BSchenn added to the World Champs roster.

http://www.broadstreethoc...e-giroux-on-canadas-world

i hope someone headshots pk subban into next season after his cheap ass shot yesterday
- 2Real

Yay for messing with someone's brain!!!

Even better, why not have someone take a 2-handed baseball swing at his head and turn him into a vegetable? That'll learn him.

i hope someone headshots pk subban into next season after his cheap ass shot yesterday
- 2Real

USA is losing 2-1 after 2 despite outplaying Russia for most of the game. This is without Eichel, Hanifin, and Werenski.

Sorry.

If we trade him for a legitimate hockey player, how much can we retain?

(Sutter goes on to score a hat trick tonight)
- jmatchett383

thats fine.

he scores a hat trick tonight ill acknowledge that he doesnt blow.

granted, goals arent the only measure that matter, but i do believe he outscored coots this year

Given the wear and tear of his career and his age, is this a realistic possibility?
- Scoob

It's all relative. Can he be a 20-goal scorer (ala 2013-14) if a team accepts his limitations? Possibly. Can he get enough ice time on a contending-caliber team to be a one-dimensional player who can pop a few timely goals with sufficient use? Iffy, and it really depends on the system they play.

I have to be honest: For all the talk about how Laviolette was the reason Vinny came here, I have a feeling (and we never got to find out) that even Laviolette would not have quite so enthralled by Lecavalier after the back injury last season.

Couturier and BSchenn added to the World Champs roster.

http://www.broadstreethoc...e-giroux-on-canadas-world
- Feanor

maybe they could get some speed skating lessons while there

i hope someone headshots pk subban into next season after his cheap ass shot yesterday
- 2Real

That is a lucid, intelligent, well thought-out comment.

Couturier and BSchenn added to the World Champs roster.

http://www.broadstreethoc...e-giroux-on-canadas-world
- Feanor

I love the last line of that article

Yay for messing with someone's brain!!!

Even better, why not have someone take a 2-handed baseball swing at his head and turn him into a vegetable? That'll learn him.
- jmatchett383

Yay for messing with someone's brain!!!

Even better, why not have someone take a 2-handed baseball swing at his head and turn him into a vegetable? That'll learn him.
- jmatchett383

actually, after such activity, he may have a hard time learning anything.

Yay for messing with someone's brain!!!

Even better, why not have someone take a 2-handed baseball swing at his head and turn him into a vegetable? That'll learn him.
- jmatchett383

There's very few players that I actually don't mind seeing get hurt... guys like Avery, John Scott, Domi... There's players I don't like, like Crosby and many others, but I don't hope they get hurt. Subban falls into the first category for me. I wouldn't shed a tear if that piece of garbage never plays another game again. Added bonus for me would be, there would be 0% chance of the Flyers ever getting him.

I know.. I'm a horrible person.

There's very few players that I actually don't mind seeing get hurt... guys like Avery, John Scott, Domi... There's players I don't like, like Crosby and many others, but I don't hope they get hurt. Subban falls into the first category for me. I wouldn't shed a tear if that piece of garbage never plays another game again. Added bonus for me would be, there would be 0% chance of the Flyers ever getting him.

I know.. I'm a horrible person.
- WarriorHockey21

Yeah. You are. Wishing possible long-term injury on someone simply because you don't like the way he plays a game is pretty awful.

If anything, Chris Pronger was the player who deserved it most.

It's all relative. Can he be a 20-goal scorer (ala 2013-14) if a team accepts his limitations? Possibly. Can he get enough ice time on a contending-caliber team to be a one-dimensional player who can pop a few timely goals with sufficient use? Iffy, and it really depends on the system they play.
- bmeltzer

Talk about being between a rock and a hard place. Both sides (player and team) are in a tough spot.

My guess is that a buyout will happen and he'll try to find a spot elsewhere. I just can't see the Flyers paying full fare next season for a repeat of this season. Nor can I see VL agreeing to a mutual termination.

Yeah. You are. Wishing possible long-term injury on someone simply because you don't like the way he plays a game is pretty awful.

If anything, Chris Pronger was the player who deserved it most.
- jmatchett383

I'm not saying I wish long term injury anyone, per se.. just that I enjoy when they aren't in the game. Especially the dirtbags who have made a career out of doing the exact thing. Kind of an irony thing, in a way. I love watching games when you don't have to worry about John-icantplayhockey-Scott hopping off the bench to jump a 5'8" player... or Sean Avery and his d-bagness...

And yes.. Pronger played most of his career edgy and dirty. (again, not saying I'm happy he lives with the side affects, by any means)

I'm not saying I wish long term injury anyone, per se.. just that I enjoy when they aren't in the game. Especially the dirtbags who have made a career out of doing the exact thing. Kind of an irony thing, in a way.

And yes.. Pronger played most of his career edgy and dirty. (again, not saying I'm happy he lives with the side affects, by any means)
- WarriorHockey21

But you're happy he's out of the game. Noted.

But you're happy he's out of the game. Noted.
- Scoob

He wasn't as bad towards the end of his career. Earlier on - yeah.. I hated him and some of the shots he took on guys.

I'm not saying I wish long term injury anyone, per se.. just that I enjoy when they aren't in the game. Especially the dirtbags who have made a career out of doing the exact thing. Kind of an irony thing, in a way.

And yes.. Pronger played most of his career edgy and dirty. (again, not saying I'm happy he lives with the side affects, by any means)
- WarriorHockey21

There's a difference between a guy breaking a leg/arm and a guy having his brain scrambled. Sure, with some of Tie Dom's antics and the injuries he caused, I wouldn't shed a tear if he woke up every day and had limited mobility in his arm to a severely fractured shoulder or something. But to hope a guy is taken out with a head injury? Come on.