Agreed... its like rating a pitcher based on how many strikes he throws... clearly means very little on the 2014-15 penguins
- Brianandr1

If the Penguins play like that every night, they'll win more often than not. Unless it's against the Flyers...or Henrik Lundqvist.

If the Penguins play like that every night, they'll win more often than not. Unless it's against the Flyers...or Henrik Lundqvist.
- jmatchett383

That's the problem though, the Penguins have been routinely outshooting/chancing/possessing opponents and are still losing. Obviously it is ideal to have that going for the team, but this is results time now. No one wants to hear the excuses of "not getting the bounces" that we've heard for most of the last half decade.

That's the problem though, the Penguins have been routinely outshooting/chancing/possessing opponents and are still losing. Obviously it is ideal to have that going for the team, but this is results time now. No one wants to hear the excuses of "not getting the bounces" that we've heard for most of the last half decade.
- jfkst1

I don't look at raw possession/shot data. But from what I watched yesterday, the Penguins were totally dominating the Flyers in the first, and it was only semi-miraculous goaltending by Mason that kept it close. That won't happen every game.

I don't look at raw possession/shot data. But from what I watched yesterday, the Penguins were totally dominating the Flyers in the first, and it was only semi-miraculous goaltending by Mason that kept it close. That won't happen every game.
- jmatchett383

I agree but this has been the case so many games the last few months. I've seen amazing goal tending performances in so many games vs the Pens this season. Even the games against Arizona the Pens won, Smith was standing on his head.

I don't look at raw possession/shot data. But from what I watched yesterday, the Penguins were totally dominating the Flyers in the first, and it was only semi-miraculous goaltending by Mason that kept it close. That won't happen every game.
- jmatchett383

It has happened for the last month. And it happens every postseason. Pretty sure the last elimination series the Penguins didn't outshoot their opponent they won the SC. So outshooting their opponents is of zero consolation to Pens fans. We get the try-hard medal in the special olympics. It's irrelevant. Their shooting percentage the last month is 3.5%. Nearly impossible to win any games if the opposing goalie is saving 95+% of the shots.

Thanks Gunner. So how do you beat a hot goalie? How do you get shots to go in? I think a more detailed analysis of the types and quality of shots is interesting and worth discussing.

As far as offensive depth, we traded our best asset for Lovejoy, another D man. This tells us a lot of the managements grasp of our lack of more scoring. Get more D, right.

I don't look at raw possession/shot data. But from what I watched yesterday, the Penguins were totally dominating the Flyers in the first, and it was only semi-miraculous goaltending by Mason that kept it close. That won't happen every game.
- jmatchett383

I know it seems silly to argue but we have made every goalie in the league look like Patrick Roy, the second half of the season. No offense because Mason is solid and has been for two years now.

Thanks Gunner. So how do you beat a hot goalie? How do you get shots to go in? I think a more detailed analysis of the types and quality of shots is interesting and worth discussing.

As far as offensive depth, we traded our best asset for Lovejoy, another D man. This tells us a lot of the managements grasp of our lack of more scoring. Get more D, right.
- powerhouse

Run into him, knock him through the posts, and injure him.. The NYR way

Somebody please remind Perron to NOT emulate Neal's play or the current Kunitz (doesn't hit anymore). He should be going after Hörnqvist for advice.. Jeez.

I see what Ryan and a lot of others are saying and I agree. The Penguins are playing good hockey right now. Their numbers like possession and shots indicate that. The eye test also shows that. I thought they played pretty well yesterday. And I think in the long run, this trend of playing well and losing would be corrected into winning more games.

However, when you're talking short term and a game-by-game basis, these kinds of things go out the door to an extent. You need to find ways to win these games down the stretch. It's like what Yohe said on Twitter, you can hold the puck 80% of the game. However, if that other team manages to score more than you in that 20% than you do in that 80%, that's a serious problem.

Penguins need to keep playing the way they are and I think the wins will come. And if we're being honest, I think I'd rather play Montreal or TB than the Rangers or Islanders.

Somebody please remind Perron to NOT emulate Neal's play or the current Kunitz (doesn't hit anymore). He should be going after Hörnqvist for advice.. Jeez.
- Barnaby36

Perron has looked bad lately. Wondering if it has anything to do with the mystery illness he sat out for then next game was used under 10 mins.

Run into him, knock him through the posts, and injure him.. The Jayson Megna way
- Guile

Agreed.

Thanks Gunner. So how do you beat a hot goalie? How do you get shots to go in? I think a more detailed analysis of the types and quality of shots is interesting and worth discussing.

As far as offensive depth, we traded our best asset for Lovejoy, another D man. This tells us a lot of the managements grasp of our lack of more scoring. Get more D, right.
- powerhouse

Better forwards consistently have higher shooting percentages and really good ones will carry higher on-ice shooting percentages usually reflected in a sustainably higher PDO too. Penguins have four legitimate top 6 forwards: Perron, Hornqvist, Crosby, Malkin. And Perron isn't playing well and Malkin has missed a lot of games. Kunitz is too old and Comeau isn't a top 6 forward and is playing injured. It wouldn't be such a major issue if the forward depth were good, but obviously that is not the case either. It'll have to be addressed this off-season again. When the new tracking system comes into the league hopefully next year, analysis will get much more in-depth.

Thanks Gunner. So how do you beat a hot goalie? How do you get shots to go in? I think a more detailed analysis of the types and quality of shots is interesting and worth discussing.

As far as offensive depth, we traded our best asset for Lovejoy, another D man. This tells us a lot of the managements grasp of our lack of more scoring. Get more D, right.
- powerhouse

This is the next step in the statistical approach to hockey stats. The data is only as good as the sample; thus far the sample is 'shots'. Data is not consistent through the NHL, as you know, including the distance from which a shot is taken.

There are a few metrics which use a 'home plate' (area between the circles/slot and the goal posts) filter to try to draw a difference between a shot that nearly every goalie is going to stop 99% of the time and a shot which is under the reaction time of the average goalie.

That metric is best used, however, to make a case for how good a goalie is. 'Home plate save %', in other words.

I want to see something like this measured: goalie displacement per save, or, how much distance the goalie has to cover before making the save. My theory on why the Penguins have all of these shots and can't score is that they do not influence the goalie to move laterally in his crease.

The puck tends to stay on one side of the ice and the goalie is not being fatigued, losing his angles, or needing to move laterally very much to exploit holes. Even home plate shots to a goalie who is already set are going to be easy saves.

I've noticed too that the Penguins almost never use the net as a shield to set up a pass-to-shot play. Screening is essential but there are a few ways to make sure the goalei either cannot see the puck or cannot track open forwards or read the play.

Would you rather have two A+ centers, a C- center, and one D center, or one A+ center, 2 B centers, and a C+ center?

You see Pen's fans, if you struggle to make the playoffs it means your ready for the playoffs.

It has happened for the last month. And it happens every postseason. Pretty sure the last elimination series the Penguins didn't outshoot their opponent they won the SC. So outshooting their opponents is of zero consolation to Pens fans. We get the try-hard medal in the special olympics. It's irrelevant. Their shooting percentage the last month is 3.5%. Nearly impossible to win any games if the opposing goalie is saving 95+% of the shots.
- jfkst1

So maybe we need quality over quantity. Or bigger bodies in front of the net to screen the goalie. We try to generate a lot of offense from the point in this system and if goalies are seeing it clearly, then its an easy save.

Yeah, the NHL is ruining the game with too many penalties. Downie should be able to take the ice carrying a metal folding chair instead of a stick and bash in Karlsson's achilles without a penalty.
- jfkst1

LMAO

Would you rather have two A+ centers, a C- center, and one D center, or one A+ center, 2 B centers, and a C+ center?
- jmatchett383

The wingers the same in both scenarios?

Agreed.
- jmatchett383

When did we bring back Megna? o_O

Would you rather have two A+ centers, a C- center, and one D center, or one A+ center, 2 B centers, and a C+ center?
- jmatchett383

What kinds of centers are they? Skill guys? Two-way? Match-up?

Would you rather have two A+ centers, a C- center, and one D center, or one A+ center, 2 B centers, and a C+ center?
- jmatchett383

The former is basically what the Penguins have now, with perhaps a generous rating for Lapierre, so I'd probably take the latter.

Would you rather have two A+ centers, a C- center, and one D center, or one A+ center, 2 B centers, and a C+ center?
- jmatchett383

Two A+, an A-, and a C...just like when we get Staal back this offseason lol

The wingers the same in both scenarios?
- Guile

Yes.

When did we bring back Megna? o_O
- Guile

The third-to-last game of last season, I believe.