Thats what I think too, so many better ways to handle it, couldn't have handled it much worse, could he?
- walshy66

My guess is that E. Kane requested a trade during the summer, Winnipeg stated they would move him if the deal was right, and its been in limbo ever since w/ the Jets saying the weren't getting a good enough package for him & E. Kane still wanting out.

E. Kane finally just decided to force the Jets hand, albiet in a very unprofessional manner.

I dont know enough about Santa. Could he be a good 3rd line center? Winnik is an ideal 4th liner but not sure he's good enough to be a 3rd liner.

(this is based on cup contending standards, not simply "better than what Pit currently has")
- YouMeAndDupuis9

Santi is a upgrade over Sutter. Decent 2 way player and I agree with winnik. Great 4th liner but not much finish for a 3rd liner

did you seriously just refer to your wife that way?
- stayinthefnnet

He's just being a ridiculous human being to try and get out of Winnipeg his marriage.

I read an article that said the Pens were looking to add a veteran dman too, why? I get that we have injury issues but we have serviceable ones that can fill-in in the mean time.
- gershall13

Unless its a guy that has 1-2 years of term left on his contract that would allow us to comfortably let Martin and Hoff walk after this season. Not too comfortable with a top 4 of

Letang-Maatta
Despres-Scuderi

when our bottom two are probably gonna be Dumoulin and Pouliot. Its young and cheap with the potential to be amazing, but its not that good as of now.

Unless its a guy that has 1-2 years of term left on his contract that would allow us to comfortably let Martin and Hoff walk after this season. Not too comfortable with a top 4 of

Letang-Maatta
Despres-Scuderi

when our bottom two are probably gonna be Dumoulin and Pouliot. Its young and cheap with the potential to be amazing, but its not that good as of now.
- Victoro311

Cody Franson, Jeff Petry, Scott Hannan, Jan Hejda and possibly Marc Methot. Honestly I think those are more of opinions rather than rumors. I know it's not going to happen or popular but rather than letting both walk why not try and trade Martin or Hoff? Hoff most likely won't with his concussion and Martin's NTC limits possible trades.

He's just being a ridiculous human being to try and get out of Winnipeg his marriage.
- BulliesPhan87

couldnt take the cold and lack of nightlife?

Cody Franson, Jeff Petry, Scott Hannan, Jan Hejda and possibly Marc Methot. Honestly I think those are more of opinions rather than rumors. I know it's not going to happen or popular but rather than letting both walk why not try and trade Martin or Hoff? Hoff most likely won't with his concussion and Martin's NTC limits possible trades.
- gershall13

Because it makes our team worse right now. I understand the idea, but Martin is better for this team's cup run than anything he'd fetch us in a trade. When this team is healthy, we can't give up on winning the cup this year. We're one competent 3C away from having a good shot.

Cody Franson, Jeff Petry, Scott Hannan, Jan Hejda and possibly Marc Methot. Honestly I think those are more of opinions rather than rumors. I know it's not going to happen or popular but rather than letting both walk why not try and trade Martin or Hoff? Hoff most likely won't with his concussion and Martin's NTC limits possible trades.
- gershall13

Ehrhoff has a full NMC and Martin has a limited NTC so good luck getting decent value out of them unless you are giving up on the season and are just looking for picks/prospects.

Because it makes our team worse right now. I understand the idea, but Martin is better for this team's cup run than anything he'd fetch us in a trade. When this team is healthy, we can't give up on winning the cup this year. We're one competent 3C away from having a good shot.
- Victoro311

Yeah I think the performance last night swayed me towards not giving up Martin and wanting the cup more than losing him for nothing. Plus it's not a total loss if they both walk, we get cap space out of it.

couldnt take the cold and lack of nightlife?
- stayinthefnnet

Apparently he couldn't take my ESPN article link, either

(I don't blame him, I generally can't stand ESPN either)

Its not carrying them, there are your 4 pairs, if you want a vet presence then they are already carrying dead weight in Scuderi for that purpose.

Rotate the bottom two pairs into that 3rd pairing however you want but that back 6 will be fine.

I think Harrington is a more mobile version of what they think Scuderi provides. Difference being Harrington can hit his outlet pass and not treat the puck like a grenade.

As flawed as Pouliot is in his own end, and he is, he gets the puck out of the zone quickly and on the tape. I will take that with his errors ahead of, Scuderi and Bortuzzo who do not have the ability to hit an outlet pass on the tape with forechecking pressure.
- walshy66

Its not so much a veteran presence; its that I would want as much a very strong top-6 D. Letang, Petry (or comparable UFA Dman), Maatta, & Despres would be a very, very good Top-4. Add in Pouliot, Harrington, & Dumoulin as a 5/6/7 mix & i see a Cup contending D. Bortuzzo, OK; as a 7th/8th in a pinch as he's cheap & a RFA, but certainly not as a regular Top-6 if it can be helped

But then what to do with Scuderi? I pray to God that they can trade him or, failing that, buy him out, but I just don't see it happending. Scuderi is going to push someone out of that top-6 D group as managment seems set on him being part of the team going forward. I don't agree with it, but it just seem inevitable that he will be on the ice no matter how bad he is. I mean, if he hasn't been scrtached yet for a game, what is it going to take?

So does he push out? If its Petry (or comparable UFA Dman) then that means you are pushing Pouliot up to a Top-4 role next season. Not sure he is/will be ready for that.

Ehrhoff has a full NMC and Martin has a limited NTC so good luck getting decent value out of them unless you are giving up on the season and are just looking for picks/prospects.
- jfkst1

Wasn't aware of Ehrhoff's full NMC

Because it makes our team worse right now. I understand the idea, but Martin is better for this team's cup run than anything he'd fetch us in a trade. When this team is healthy, we can't give up on winning the cup this year. We're one competent 3C away from having a good shot.
- Victoro311

Not a fan of Martin all the time (he constantly hears footsteps in the corners) but he does give the team 20+ minutes a night which is tough to replace. I agree if only GMJR could find a 3C we'd be in a lot better position

Wasn't aware of Ehrhoff's full NMC
- gershall13

F NMCs

Penguins should trade for Brandon Sutter.
- jmatchett383

#POTD

F NMCs
- Johnny Wrath

From a players perspective i see why they exist but from a teams, I can only see it as a way to close the deal on signing a player you want. Really, for a team, it could do more harm than good (ie rob scuderi)

Its not so much a veteran presence; its that I would want as much a very strong top-6 D. Letang, Petry (or comparable UFA Dman), Maatta, & Despres would be a very, very good Top-4. Add in Pouliot, Harrington, & Dumoulin as a 5/6/7 mix & i see a Cup contending D. Bortuzzo, OK; as a 7th/8th in a pinch as he's cheap & a RFA, but certainly not as a regular Top-6 if it can be helped

But then what to do with Scuderi? I pray to God that they can trade him or, failing that, buy him out, but I just don't see it happending. Scuderi is going to push someone out of that top-6 D group as managment seems set on him being part of the team going forward. I don't agree with it, but it just seem inevitable that he will be on the ice no matter how bad he is. I mean, if he hasn't been scrtached yet for a game, what is it going to take?

So does he push out? If its Petry (or comparable UFA Dman) then that means you are pushing Pouliot up to a Top-4 role next season. Not sure he is/will be ready for that.
- s0rcerer1984

What is your definition of 'strong' though?

half way through next year 47 and 51 will be legit top 4 and Maatta could be a top 2 if not a great top 3.

So you end up with an elite 1 and 3 players to rotate through. Even if Letang needs to 'carry' any of them, none of the 3 mentioned get stuck in their own zone.

From a players perspective i see why they exist but from a teams, I can only see it as a way to close the deal on signing a player you want. Really, for a team, it could do more harm than good (ie rob scuderi)
- gershall13

They exist because there's Edmonton. I can't think of a recent ufa that is worth a nmc. Maybe Fedorov when he signed in Anaheim.

What is your definition of 'strong' though?

half way through next year 47 and 51 will be legit top 4 and Maatta could be a top 2 if not a great top 3.

So you end up with an elite 1 and 3 players to rotate through. Even if Letang needs to 'carry' any of them, none of the 3 mentioned get stuck in their own zone.
- walshy66

My definition of "strong" would be a 7th Dman you would not be afraid to play as part of 5/6 in the Conference or Cup finals for the full series. Depth at D always seems to come I to play as goals become harder and harder to come by.

I agree a top-4 of Despres, Maatta, Letang, and Pouliot would be a solid top-4 . But it leaves Dumoulin and Harrington as a 5/6. Scuderi or Bortuzzo as a 7th. Scuds as regular part of a Cup contending D scares the hell out of me and Bortuzzo is not ideal in my mind.

I may be a luxury on some level, but with $9M in Cap Space freeing up via Martin and Ehrhoff, I'd be ok adding a $4.5M/ yr Dman so long as the player matches the price tag in value (ie, Petry). Roll the other $4.5M into the 3rd/4th line plus any cap rise & go from there.

[quote=stackthepads]I can't believe the trade proposals I am seeing for Vermette, he isn't an upgrade over Sutter. He isn't faster, he isn't gritty, he is always injured.

Look at what worked last night.
- Hard forecheck
- Hard to the net
- Hard along the boards

Vermette, Tlusty, Bergenheim do not bring this. They are finesse players who are useful play makers if you don't have a Crosby or a Malkin. We have both a Crosby and a Malkin.

It sounds like everyone wants to replace soft players like Sutter and Bennett, which I'm completely for. But then we're looking to replace them with the exact same thing and we expect something different.

We need bigger, heavier players or players who play bigger like Hornqvist. Not more butterflies like Bennett.
- YouMeAndDupuis9[/quote

See your point, but think youre wrong on Bergenheim. He plays very similarly to Comeau and I wouldnt consider Comeau finesse/perimeter.

Ill give you Bergenheim, he does play feisty but he isnt cheap and florida doesnt want Sutter or Bennett.
Here is my list of targets that I think may be available:

Jagr - name one player harder to knock off the puck, and dammit I want to see him retire a pen and his number in the rafters beside 66.
Marcus Foligno - 6'3" - 225 lbs plays straight and hard, goes to the net. Doubtful he is available though.
Daniel Winnik - Everyone know what hes about
David Booth - He can be had for nothing, big and fast and has scored 30. Injury prone so will fit right in.


Sutter for Winnik + Booth + 2nd
Bennett for Jagr + pick

My definition of "strong" would be a 7th Dman you would not be afraid to play as part of 5/6 in the Conference or Cup finals for the full series. Depth at D always seems to come I to play as goals become harder and harder to come by.

I agree a top-4 of Despres, Maatta, Letang, and Pouliot would be a solid top-4 . But it leaves Dumoulin and Harrington as a 5/6. Scuderi or Bortuzzo as a 7th. Scuds as regular part of a Cup contending D scares the hell out of me and Bortuzzo is not ideal in my mind.

I may be a luxury on some level, but with $9M in Cap Space freeing up via Martin and Ehrhoff, I'd be ok adding a $4.5M/ yr Dman so long as the player matches the price tag in value (ie, Petry). Roll the other $4.5M into the 3rd/4th line plus any cap rise & go from there.
- s0rcerer1984

If we run with your rostered players

Letang
Maatta
Despres
Pouliot
Dumoulin
Harrington
Bortuzzo
Scuderi

There are 8 players there that will be more than capable of playing NHL mins. If one gets injured the line up is going to drop, no doubt.

But I am not comfortable with the volume of mins that Scuderi is getting at the moment and we are hoping this current roster is going to get to the Conference Finals right now.

Sutter for Winnik + Booth + 2nd
Bennett for Jagr + pick
- stackthepads

I'll admit that I think some front office is grossly overvaluing Sutter (kind of like ours does), but Toronto is asking for a 2nd rounders for Winnik and Santorelli. If in full rebuilt as they claim to be, doubt they want Sutter. Even less likely would they be willing to give up picks.

Jagr carries a significant salary so someone with more salary than Bennett must be going back to NJD to compensate.

Ill give you Bergenheim, he does play feisty but he isnt cheap and florida doesnt want Sutter or Bennett.
Here is my list of targets that I think may be available:

Jagr - name one player harder to knock off the puck, and dammit I want to see him retire a pen and his number in the rafters beside 66.
Marcus Foligno - 6'3" - 225 lbs plays straight and hard, goes to the net. Doubtful he is available though.
Daniel Winnik - Everyone know what hes about
David Booth - He can be had for nothing, big and fast and has scored 30. Injury prone so will fit right in.


Sutter for Winnik + Booth + 2nd
Bennett for Jagr + pick
- stackthepads

Foligno was off the table in the Kane according to Dregs and Bob McKenzie so he isn't going anywhere. Is that a 2nd for both or per player?

Yeah Sill is back!
Sill > Downie

Foligno was off the table in the Kane according to Dregs and Bob McKenzie so he isn't going anywhere. Is that a 2nd for both or per player?
- usethe1-2-2

LeBrun said Toronto is asking for 2nd rounders for each of Santorelli and Winnik. I guess teams are waiting for that price to decline. Seems high for UFA 3rd liners so not sure they'll get that for either.