Consistently missing the playoffs too, I love the guy but I don't think anybody realized how soft he is and easy to play against in his own end. You get the good with the bad with Kessel IMO.
- Garnie

We heard some of the same with Briere, the guy is a monster in the playoffs, great scorer, but he couldn't tell you who his own goalie is in a given game.

honestly, it should be, teams that tank, usually do it for financial reasons.

The Leafs, & Flyers have too much money, fan base, & pride to just suck on purpose.
People do forget how long, & grueling a rebuild takes, thats 4-5 years off your life.
And look at the Oilers, sometimes it backfires
- puckhead17

i wouldn't count them out. Add a mcdavid or eichel to:

RNH
hall
nurse
drasitil
eberle (whom id deal)

and id say they'll be just fine. I'm not even counting yak. rebuilds are super painful and long. Id rather be edmonton now than TO anyday. How sad that was to type, but true.

i will die with this team...but how could you be some incompetent for so long.

I do have faith in shanny though, he is a winner.
- Lee Denault

Time will tell with Shanny.

i will die with this team...but how could you be some incompetent for so long.

I do have faith in shanny though, he is a winner.
- Lee Denault

Lets (frank)ing hope, I want to ask my Uncle for his Bday gift back ( my Kessel jersey )

honestly, it should be, teams that tank, usually do it for financial reasons.

The Leafs, & Flyers have too much money, fan base, & pride to just suck on purpose.
People do forget how long, & grueling a rebuild takes, thats 4-5 years off your life.
And look at the Oilers, sometimes it backfires
- puckhead17

true, but that cant deter them from trying it, they never have before.

i will die with this team...but how could you be some incompetent for so long.

I do have faith in shanny though, he is a winner.
- Lee Denault

i agree with everything here..im old and not even mad as some think. Im excited that what needs to be done should begin soon. How ppl can be happy with status quo is beyond me. But i will never find another team.

and i think shanny knows what needs to be done

Time will tell with Shanny.
- puckhead17

for sure, but i do think it is a good start.

honestly, it should be, teams that tank, usually do it for financial reasons.

The Leafs, & Flyers have too much money, fan base, & pride to just suck on purpose.
People do forget how long, & grueling a rebuild takes, thats 4-5 years off your life.
And look at the Oilers, sometimes it backfires
- puckhead17

They don't have to be. Tampa did it in 2 years. They dropped down and grabbed Stamkos first, then the next year Hedman. After that, their franchise took off. Leafs could do the same, if they can get into the bottom 5, this year. Moving core assets can get you younger, already drafted prospects, that are already into their development stage. Add to that, a couple more later first round picks and you can turn it around relatively quickly. Looking at the usual characters in Buffalo and Edmonton, once you make the youth off limits, there is no prime core players to deal for top end drafted players.

i wouldn't count them out. Add a mcdavid or eichel to:

RNH
hall
nurse
drasitil
eberle (whom id deal)

and id say they'll be just fine. I'm not even counting yak. rebuilds are super painful and long. Id rather be edmonton now than TO anyday. How sad that was to type, but true.
- clark_griswold

Yeah, TODAY, you'd rather be Edmonton.
They suffered for a long while, being competitive, vs completely sucking, there is a difference, (I think).
After getting my ball$ kicked at work all day, at least I can find solace in 4/5 molsons, & a competitive Flyers game.
VS a rebuilding one totally sucking, & expecting it for 5 years?
Not easy either!

i agree with everything here..im old and not even mad as some think. Im excited that what needs to be done should begin soon. How ppl can be happy with status quo is beyond me. But i will never find another team.

and i think shanny knows what needs to be done
- clark_griswold

ive been let down before.

but i do have a good feeling about this one. he knows what a winner looks like.

They don't have to be. Tampa did it in 2 years. They dropped down and grabbed Stamkos first, then the next year Hedman. After that, their franchise took off. Leafs could do the same, if they can get into the bottom 5, this year. Moving core assets can get you younger, already drafted prospects, that are already into their development stage. Add to that, a couple more later first round picks and you can turn it around relatively quickly. Looking at the usual characters in Buffalo and Edmonton, once you make the youth off limits, there is no prime core players to deal for top end drafted players.
- PrinceLH

im on board with all your views currently. Im just preparing for a 5 year minimum. I doubt it's cured in less time. We don't have the assets to get the prime prospects/high picks and currently don't own many high end prospects. It's gonna suck my friend.

true, but that cant deter them from trying it, they never have before.
- Lee Denault

I think they are about to tear it apart IMO.

Phaneuf
Kessel 80%
Lupul if any takers
Franson's gone
Bozak if a taker
Reimer if a taker

Even a full tear down, keeping key parts goalie/Kadri/JVR/Rielly/Nylander/Polak/Winnik/Santo we could still be solid in a few years. IMO especially if you can grab another key player or 2 from a team with salary cap problems.

Lets (frank)ing hope, I want to ask my Uncle for his Bday gift back ( my Kessel jersey )
- Garnie

might need the name changed. We will see.

1 of dion or kessel is gone next year. IMO it should be both.

Do this thing correctly.

true, but that cant deter them from trying it, they never have before.
- Lee Denault

No, I have to go back & check, they were like us, traded away young talent to succeed now.
Only to backfire later

Yeah, TODAY, you'd rather be Edmonton.
They suffered for a long while, being competitive, vs completely sucking, there is a difference, (I think).
After getting my ball$ kicked at work all day, at least I can find solace in 4/5 molsons, & a competitive Flyers game.
VS a rebuilding one totally sucking, & expecting it for 5 years?
Not easy either!
- puckhead17

Meh, after thinking about it...Edm. is built backwards high end talent forwards and zero on the back end. They are still nowhere near being a contender...without moving a couple. IMO

Leafs>Edm even when we have this quick sell off

I think they are about to tear it apart IMO.

Phaneuf
Kessel 80%
Lupul if any takers
Franson's gone
Bozak if a taker
Reimer if a taker

Even a full tear down, keeping key parts goalie/Kadri/JVR/Rielly/Nylander/Polak/Winnik/Santo we could still be solid in a few years. IMO especially if you can grab another key player or 2 from a team with salary cap problems.
- Garnie

JVR will fetch a good return.. a really good return and no one is talking about it

6'2 mid 20's 30 goal scorer great contract.

We have many guys on this team that would fetch a first. Franson is rumored to might bring a 1st back. im not holding my breath though.

Yeah, TODAY, you'd rather be Edmonton.
They suffered for a long while, being competitive, vs completely sucking, there is a difference, (I think).
After getting my ball$ kicked at work all day, at least I can find solace in 4/5 molsons, & a competitive Flyers game.
VS a rebuilding one totally sucking, & expecting it for 5 years?
Not easy either!
- puckhead17

here's the thing. In 3 of the past 4 years (im including this) weve barely finished above them. 8th overall pick, 5th overall pick, this year?

we are competitive at times but the final standings are the measuring stick. We have a cap mess to worry about, they don't. They have better young players and tradeable assets than us. They have sucked for a long time, like we should have. I see brighter days ahead and if they get mcdavid...wow....BUt that's hindsight and i was a retooler too...but i've 'seen the light'. It's TNT time pal.

They don't have to be. Tampa did it in 2 years. They dropped down and grabbed Stamkos first, then the next year Hedman. After that, their franchise took off. Leafs could do the same, if they can get into the bottom 5, this year. Moving core assets can get you younger, already drafted prospects, that are already into their development stage. Add to that, a couple more later first round picks and you can turn it around relatively quickly. Looking at the usual characters in Buffalo and Edmonton, once you make the youth off limits, there is no prime core players to deal for top end drafted players.
- PrinceLH

Tampa sucked for a while didn't they?
I have to check, but they did get lucky on some of those 2nd, & 3rd rounders.
That helped make them into a powerhouse, the depth on the lucky picks.

I don't see Nash making any deal like that.
- Iggysbff

The Thrill and Santorelli for Jones, Wilson a 1st in 2015 and a second in 2016

No, I have to go back & check, they were like us, traded away young talent to succeed now.
Only to backfire later
- puckhead17

it always backfires down the road.

Tampa sucked for a while didn't they?
I have to check, but they did get lucky on some of those 2nd, & 3rd rounders.
That helped make them into a powerhouse, the depth on the lucky picks.
- puckhead17

and thats the ticket right there.

scouting

development

i agree with everything here..im old and not even mad as some think. Im excited that what needs to be done should begin soon. How ppl can be happy with status quo is beyond me. But i will never find another team.

and i think shanny knows what needs to be done
- clark_griswold

If your old, I'm ancient. I have history with this club, going back to their last Cup. I met Tim Horton, before his untimely death. I met Harold Ballard, one ignorant SOB. I saw the last two Leafs/Habs playoff series and got to meet many of the 1978 Habs players, outside of Maple Leafs Gardens after a playoff game. Old enough to remember being at the first exhibition game, for the Buffalo Sabres, being a 4 - 4 tie against the Rangers and Ed Giacomin, in Peterborough. Saw Vancouver's first goal, live on TV. Saw the '72 Summit Series live on the tube. I was in the Corel Centre, to see Ottawa's first ever playoff game versus Buffalo. What I'm trying to say here is, I've seen allot of hockey. What I've witnessed with this putrid team is a lack of leadership at all levels of the organization. The corporate end is only concerned with the season ticket holders and entertaining them, to keep the coffers full. They would never consent to a total rebuild. An enhanced rebuild, in two years, maybe. Does Shanahan have the balls to go down the road and move Dion and Kessel, this year?

Meh, after thinking about it...Edm. is built backwards high end talent forwards and zero on the back end. They are still nowhere near being a contender...without moving a couple. IMO

Leafs>Edm even when we have this quick sell off
- Garnie

we are also built backwards...strong on the wings is not a hockey team properly built.

proper team/what leafs have: Strong goaltending (i believe so) Strong up the middle (nope). Strong defense (nope). Wingers are least important.

They can get alot for one of their young guys and like i said, they should get eichel or mcdavid. Edmonton's pain will pay off.

JVR will fetch a good return.. a really good return and no one is talking about it

6'2 mid 20's 30 goal scorer great contract.

We have many guys on this team that would fetch a first. Franson is rumored to might bring a 1st back. im not holding my breath though.
- Lee Denault

I'd keep JVR, I really like Franson..but he's got to go..I think he'll get a good pick back...he should...if he'd sign under $5 I'd almost keep him...tough call IMO.

If your old, I'm ancient. I have history with this club, going back to their last Cup. I met Tim Horton, before his untimely death. I met Harold Ballard, one ignorant SOB. I saw the last two Leafs/Habs playoff series and got to meet many of the 1978 Habs players, outside of Maple Leafs Gardens after a playoff game. Old enough to remember being at the first exhibition game, for the Buffalo Sabres, being a 4 - 4 tie against the Rangers and Ed Giacomin, in Peterborough. Saw Vancouver's first goal, live on TV. Saw the '72 Summit Series live on the tube. I was in the Corel Centre, to see Ottawa's first ever playoff game versus Buffalo. What I'm trying to say here is, I've seen allot of hockey. What I've witnessed with this putrid team is a lack of leadership at all levels of the organization. The corporate end is only concerned with the season ticket holders and entertaining them, to keep the coffers full. They would never consent to a total rebuild. An enhanced rebuild, in two years, maybe. Does Shanahan have the balls to go down the road and move Dion and Kessel, this year?
- PrinceLH

seems like the older fans are the ones calling for a complete teardown. Too much pain for too long i guess