I think the current staff are hamstrung by his 700K counting even if he is in the minors. We are so close to the cap ceiling we simply cannot afford 700K not on the roster.
- stackthepads

Then they can put him in the press box. They chose not to.

I never said that.



Then why do you think two coaching staffs have continued to play him night in and night out? His skating? His puck skills? For shootouts?



I don't think the coaching staff really cares about 5 on 5 with the 4th line. Goc does nothing well except kill penalties and take faceoffs, Sill is Sill, Adams is Adams. Adams is getting 6 minutes of even strength TOI a night. They don't care.



Who are the others? Comeau is an okay penalty killer. Kunitz can PK in a pinch. Downie, Perron, Hornqvist and Bennett aren't really PKers. They're what, 2nd in the league? Why mess with that if it's working, just to get a marginally better 5 on 5 guy on the ice for 6 minutes a night?
- hardnosed

Maybe not specifically Crosby, but you sure as hell implied the general concept with your "star players are star players and don't have to work like Adams" comment.

As to the two coaching staffs? Bylsma, well we all know that story. Johnston has yet to be a convicted Adams lover though. Look, at the beginning of the season, obviously you play Adams over a rookie like Rust and underpreformers like Megna. However, with all the injuries, Rust proved himself capable. Adams hasn't come out of the line up yet because he can't. Too many injured forwards. Once we're healthy, we'll see if the Johnson regime is truly infatuated with him.

Disagree on Goc. Goc has been a solid player his entire career. I'd hazard to say that after coming to the Pens is when he's played the worst hockey of his career. Last season he got injured right off the bat. This season, he's been playing with sub-standard line mates. If I remember correctly, he played very well with Spaling and Comeau during the preseason. If we can get just one of those on his line, Goc should be able to pick it up. But right now, I think his problem is who he's skating with: Sill, Ebbett, Farnham...... Adams.....

Our PK did just fine while Adams was out. I have more proof to back up my claim that we don't need Adams on our PK than you do for yours that our PK will die without him. Just saying, Rust was a monster on the PK for ND. We haven't seen much of him shorthanded yet.


Listen man, if you're argument is that for better or for worse, Shero resigned Adams and we're stuck with him and that's not the end of the world because he's on a minimum contract and plays minimal minutes, that's fine. I'll even grant you that Adams's experience may be a better option than Rust's skill, even though I don't necessarily agree with it.

But if you're argument is that Adams plays some integral irreplaceable roll on this team and that it was a good idea for Shero to extend him two years ago and that his recent behavior is excusable because of this, then that is just a train I cannot get on.

My opinon.

These hits were prob nothing, Adams and the Russian had a dust up recently, the boards sounded loud and media had a story. Why is Adams able to layout a "superstar" and a very skilled prospect while practicing special teams? Maybe they should be trying harder if the worse player in history is able to lay solid checks on them 5 on 4?

No one actually involved in the NHL cares about fancy stats. They hire a guy because someone else hired a guy and that's about it. Fancy stats are for those who need to feel that their opinion is justified or supported by some sort of data. I and NHL coaches are not those kind of people. I, like them trust my own judgement and that of trusted colleagues.

I do like Adams, intangibles are real and are what separates hockey from little league baseball, or what others call NFL,MLB,NBA and whatever they call soccer.

By the way, Adams probably isn't going anywhere.

Listen man, if you're argument is that for better or for worse, Shero resigned Adams and we're stuck with him and that's not the end of the world because he's on a minimum contract and plays minimal minutes, that's fine. I'll even grant you that Adams's experience may be a better option than Rust's skill, even though I don't necessarily agree with it.

But if you're argument is that Adams plays some integral irreplaceable roll on this team and that it was a good idea for Shero to extend him two years ago and that his recent behavior is excusable because of this, then that is just a train I cannot get on.
- Victoro311

I'm closer to the first one than the second one. I would LOVE to have someone better than him that can bring the intangibles he provides. But the Penguins don't have that guy right now.

The only thing I differ with is the last part of the second statement - I could care less about these practice dustups with Geno. Maybe it's the football fan in me - I love a good training camp fight. Makes practice matter. And I don't get the idea that Adams has been dirty with Geno, just playing him hard. Good, as long as it's within reason.

Folks used to complain that Bylsma ran lazy practices and lazy camps. If Johnston is encouraging them to practice hard, I'm all for that.

Then why do you think two coaching staffs have continued to play him night in and night out? His skating? His puck skills? For shootouts?

- hardnosed

Could it be out of a false sense of loyalty?

He's a plug. He's been a plug for year. Rutherford traded him to Chicago for NOTHING. Okay, a conditional pick. That was seven years ago.

Chicago put him on waivers. That was six years ago.

Can he really have gotten better since then?

There's being a plug, and then there's only scoring 55 goals in over 900 games.

He brings nothing to the table. Rutherford knows that. He saw it almost a decade ago. Does he have some character? Sure. But that doesn't out-weigh the fact that he drags your team down while he's on the ice.

He's a scrub who's living off the luck of being a member of two Stanley Cup winning teams, and I say that as a person who used to be a fan of his.

Adams is simply taking a roster spot from one of the younger players. Where guys like rust, ebbett, and Farnham can possibly get better with more NHL experience, Adams has been on the decline for quite some time. The PK is all about positioning. Give these players more practice at the PK and they will be more effective due to them being 10xs faster
- drummer829

No on Ebbet, he is just a younger Adams with slightly better offensive skills. But I do agree. I would take Farnham EASILY over Adams and Ebbet. Rust should play as well

Then they can put him in the press box. They chose not to.
- hardnosed

There isnt really another option. Who did they sit in the press box last game? They had Pouliot in there and which forward? Obviously not a very good one since we we had Ebbett and Sill on the ice and Farnam was sent down. It could also be that they cant afford another forward call up since Pouliots cap is 900K in the press box.

My opinon.

These hits were prob nothing, Adams and the Russian had a dust up recently, the boards sounded loud and media had a story. Why is Adams able to layout a "superstar" and a very skilled prospect while practicing special teams? Maybe they should be trying harder if the worse player in history is able to lay solid checks on them 5 on 4?
No one actually involved in the NHL cares about fancy stats. They hire a guy because someone else hired a guy and that's about it. Fancy stats are for those who need to feel that their opinion is justified or supported by some sort of data. I and NHL coaches are not those kind of people. I, like them trust my own judgement and that of trusted colleagues.

I do like Adams, intangibles are real and are what separates hockey from little league baseball, or what others call NFL,MLB,NBA and whatever they call soccer.

By the way, Adams probably isn't going anywhere.
- Grinder47

Because in a PP/PK drill you aren't expecting a player on your team to take a run at you. They are working on movement timing.

These hits were prob nothing, Adams and the Russian had a dust up recently, the boards sounded loud and media had a story. Why is Adams able to layout a "superstar" and a very skilled prospect while practicing special teams? Maybe they should be trying harder if the worse player in history is able to lay solid checks on them 5 on 4?
- Grinder47

Bingo.

No one actually involved in the NHL cares about fancy stats. They hire a guy because someone else hired a guy and that's about it. Fancy stats are for those who need to feel that their opinion is justified or supported by some sort of data. I and NHL coaches are not those kind of people. I, like them trust my own judgement and that of trusted colleagues.

- Grinder47

Exactly. This past offseason the teams that hired metrics gurus turned right around and signed or traded for players with terrible metrics. Those signings were likely short-lived, and were done to placate fans who have hopped onto the fad.

I do like Adams, intangibles are real and are what separates hockey from little league baseball, or what others call NFL,MLB,NBA and whatever they call soccer.

- Grinder47

I like all of the Penguins. I'm a fan. Maybe that's old school, but about the only kind of players I dislike when it comes to the teams I support are the guys who don't maximize their talent or the guys who don't buy into the team concept. Doesn't mean I don't think they can improve upon Adams for next season, they should be able to, which leads to...

By the way, Adams probably isn't going anywhere.
- Grinder47

...the fact that he's going to continue to play. This coaching staff has shown no signs otherwise.

No on Ebbet, he is just a younger Adams with slightly better offensive skills. But I do agree. I would take Farnham EASILY over Adams and Ebbet. Rust should play as well
- znagle

The point is that ebbett is still young enough where he could possibly get better and become a decent 4th line guy. We won't know because Adams is in that spot

Could it be out of a false sense of loyalty?

- BINGO!

That was the rationale last year - Bylsma's pet. New FO, new coaching staff. He still plays.

Because in a PP/PK drill you aren't expecting a player on your team to take a run at you. They are working on movement timing.
- stackthepads

Have you watched a Johnston practice? Have you read that they're strictly no-contact? Because I've done neither, so I just don't know what the expectation was.

I know that when Bennett was skating a couple weeks ago Johnston talked about wanting to see him get knocked around, for what that's worth.

The point is that ebbett is still young enough where he could possibly get better and become a decent 4th line guy. We won't know because Adams is in that spot
- drummer829

Andrew Ebbett is 31.

That was the rationale last year - Bylsma's pet. New FO, new coaching staff. He still plays.
- hardnosed

Loyalty is not limited to the coaching staff. Craig Adams is that ratty old t-shirt that doesn't really function like it should anymore and is kind of embarrassing but you keep him around because it feels kind of disrespectful not to.

Andrew Ebbett is 31.
- hardnosed

Well never mind then.

Could it be out of a false sense of loyalty?

He's a plug. He's been a plug for year. Rutherford traded him to Chicago for NOTHING. Okay, a conditional pick. That was seven years ago.

Chicago put him on waivers. That was six years ago.

Can he really have gotten better since then?

There's being a plug, and then there's only scoring 55 goals in over 900 games.

He brings nothing to the table. Rutherford knows that. He saw it almost a decade ago. Does he have some character? Sure. But that doesn't out-weigh the fact that he drags your team down while he's on the ice.

He's a scrub who's living off the luck of being a member of two Stanley Cup winning teams, and I say that as a person who used to be a fan of his.
- BINGO!

I believe the reason he's still on the roster is because you have a new coach and GM coming on board and taking time to evaluate everything. He's played a couple of decent games this year and our forward depth is woefully thin. I mean if Zac Sill is in the lineup, it's hard to argue that Adams is worse than him. If Adams didn't present somewhat reasonable PK skills he's gone by now....plain and simple.

I used to admire his ability to block some of those point blank shots and come back for more. I remember a playoff game a few years ago when he flat out took two point blank slapper right to the chest and didn't miss a shift. That takes stones.

Unfortunately, he's terrible 5v5 and I'm not a believer in keeping guys that can't give you a regular shift.

Its obvious guys, he has coffee with the coaches, and whatever hockey MJ played he was a fourth liner and sees himself as Adams. Its all rational and we can all breathe. Now here's a chart.

Have you watched a Johnston practice? Have you read that they're strictly no-contact? Because I've done neither, so I just don't know what the expectation was.

I know that when Bennett was skating a couple weeks ago Johnston talked about wanting to see him get knocked around, for what that's worth.
- hardnosed

Well first off there had better be contact, you want to replicate the game as much as possible. But there is a difference between laying a hockey check and laying the hardest check you can in practise.

Now you and I are arguing from two different premises. Im arguing under the pretense that the hit was over the top for a normal practise hit, you are taking the other side that it was a hit that is delivered all the time in practise.

Well first off there had better be contact, you want to replicate the game as much as possible. But there is a difference between laying a hockey check and laying the hardest check you can in practise.

Now you and I are arguing from two different premises. Im arguing under the pretense that the hit was over the top for a normal practise hit, you are taking the other side that it was a hit that is delivered all the time in practise.
- stackthepads

Well, I wasn't there. So all I can go by is what I read:

Thursday's practice didn't lack for physicality. During power-play work, penalty killer Craig Adams delivered hits on Evgeni Malkin and defenseman Derrick Pouliot, the latter sending Pouliot crashing hard into the boards.

[url]Read more: http://triblive.com/sports/penguins/7501862-74/johnston-letang-practice#ixzz3OMuGbmV1

I can't read in between those lines. I will say that if Adams had run Malkin in a bad way, Yohe wouldn't sugar coat it, because that's less likely to become click-bait, which is the goal of modern journalism. If not for the scrum last week, it's likely this "hit" on Malkin would have never been reported.

Its obvious guys, he has coffee with the coaches, and whatever hockey MJ played he was a fourth liner and sees himself as Adams. Its all rational and we can all breathe. Now here's a chart.
- Grinder47

Has anyone else been getting random pop ups and page redirects on here lately?

So... really all I wonder seeing this is if Craig Adams is gonna get dumped somewhere? I get he does a lot of the gritty poop during games not everyone is jumping for joy to do. But AHL players we bring up ARE willing to do that, Farnham specifically for my Adams replacement. Can't have him going at Malkin AGAIN. One time... poop does happen, can let it slide once. Now Malkin and our #1 D prospect... I don't think our new regime should let this kind of thing stand from any player. Adams would be the way to send a message if they wanted to do so.

Personally, I was ok with just letting Adams finish out this season. If he was our biggest issue player wise, as a 4th line winger, I think that would say your team is pretty solid.

Scuds... just given up on that fight, hes playing fine, just costing too much. Whatever.

Has anyone else been getting random pop ups and page redirects on here lately?
- thickman1178

Yep.

Yohe talking about the impact of his two line blurb about Malkin and Adams from yesterday (29:40 mark):

http://filesource.abacast...m/tribtotal/109PENS15.mp3

Quick hits:

1. Says that bloggers and the twitterverse took his blurb and "blew it out of proportion."

2. Says that it was an ordinary hit in the course of a physical practice, and that their practices get pretty physical. Hit wasn't something "abnormal."

3. Says that most things written about Adams over the past 24 hours are "off the charts." Says Adams wasn't "out to assassinate anybody."

4. "It wasn't a big deal at all really."

Maybe Craig wants out and would accept a trade, or even a termination of contract. He doesn't seem happy
- usethe1-2-2

I was going to say something very similar - he wants the coach to bench him & is giving him every reason to.