We got burned in the Patric Sharp trade also.

- MJL

Yes we did, but that was 9 years ago. The last 3 years we have lost 2 top six LW which is where we are weak.
We are left with nothing to show for it.

Most def.

I just hope this new GM will stop the Flyers from doing this so often:


- Tomahawk

Most def.

I just hope this new GM will stop the Flyers from doing this so often:


- Tomahawk

Being able to give BSchenn time on the 1st line and top PP unit was another reason to move Hartnell.
- Feanor

Well, they certainly made a strong commitment to that early this season.

This is my overall problem with the team. They seem to lack direction and the coach and GM seem to pull in different directions quite a bit

Yes we did, but that was 9 years ago. The last 3 years we have lost 2 top six LW which is where we are weak.
We are left with nothing to show for it.
- 3flyerkids

What can be done about that now? I've moved on.

Well, they certainly made a strong commitment to that early this season.

This is my overall problem with the team. They seem to lack direction and the coach and GM seem to pull in different directions quite a bit
- PhillySportsGuy

I don't see how that is the case. One poster suggested that it allows Schenn to play on the top line, so that indicates that they GM and coach aren't in sync, and that they lack direction? That's pretty weak in my opinion. Lines change in hockey.

Another former Flyer leads the league in minors with 19.

http://www.nhl.com/ice/pl...alties&viewName=penalties
- Feanor

well that can be deceiving really. They list minor penalties but how many lead to PP's for the opposition?

We will never know. Maybe Hextall didn't look hard enough? Maybe Hextall and Berube wanted Zombieburger in particular..( God knows why)
Hartnell was a character guy on the team there may have been a " culture" issue but for a guys who is " patient" like Hextall.. He should have been able to get a better deal, even if it was a 3 Rd and a prospect
- 3flyerkids

I don't work as a GM or in the front office but I have to think Hextall put it out there to all 29 teams that Hartnell was available and remember Hartnell was going to have to buy into where he was being sent because of the NMC.

Umberger is a better skater and takes less penalties than Hartnell. Obviously, Hartnell is better offensively...
- Streit2ThePoint

He's more agile, but that's about it. He's not what you'd call "fast" or "strong" or "good at crossing over" or "able to change direction easily" when you compare his skating to Hartnell.

We got burned in the Patric Sharp trade also.

- MJL

you know the day that trade happened I emailed a Blackhawk beat writer asking about Ellison being I never saw him play and the beat writer told me he thought we would be very happy with him and he was a solid player. The Seravelli of Chicago. but hey, the dude is a point per game player in the KHL

He's more agile, but that's about it. He's not what you'd call "fast" or "strong" or "good at crossing over" or "able to change direction easily" when you compare his skating to Hartnell.
- jmatchett383

Well he doesn't fall down as much as Hartnell let's put it that way

This is my overall problem with the team. They seem to lack direction and the coach and GM seem to pull in different directions quite a bit
- PhillySportsGuy

Soon to be remedied.

I don't work as a GM or in the front office but I have to think Hextall put it out there to all 29 teams that Hartnell was available and remember Hartnell was going to have to buy into where he was being sent because of the NMC.
- nastyflyergirl

I read this in the "most interesting man in the world" voice
Completely wrong I know....

Yes we did, but that was 9 years ago. The last 3 years we have lost 2 top six LW which is where we are weak.
We are left with nothing to show for it.
- 3flyerkids

The Flyers were burned on the JVR for Schenn trade for sure, but I don't think the same thing is true for the Hartnell/Umberger trade. It's true that the Flyers would have been better off getting a 7th round pick for Hartnell instead of acquiring Umberger, but I think a good case can be made that Raffl has played just as well with Giroux and Jake as Hartnell would have played, but WITHOUT the bad penalties. IMHO the JVR trade stings far worse than the Hartnell trade. They can deal with losing Hartnell much more easily than losing JVR.

well that can be deceiving really. They list minor penalties but how many lead to PP's for the opposition?
- nastyflyergirl

You are right it can be, but I would think the percentages would still put your team shorthanded more so than what a Raffl has done for the Flyers. Plus, Hartnell's history makes you think he takes bad penalties that put his team down a man, since that is what he did when he was here.

Between being forced into a salary dump or signing a guy to a silly extension, neither put the team in spot to get fair trade value.

No idea if it was the best deal avail... I'm sure Hexy/Chief wanting Umby played into it.

I'm just really, really glad they got out from under that contract. Better one year too soon, than a year too late.
- Tomahawk

Exactly -- two years from now when Umberger's gone and Columbus still has two years left of a 34-year-old Hartnell, we'll see how that deal looks then. Getting out from under that contract was short-term pain for long-term gain, and it's what a forward-thinking manager has to do

I'd bet an upcoming paycheck that it won't look bad for the Flyers then, but as always, time will tell

Well he doesn't fall down as much as Hartnell let's put it that way
- Streit2ThePoint

Exactly. He's more agile. But really, if that's the barometer of a "good skater", not falling down more than than Hartnell, then I guess I'm an NHL-caliber skater.

Soon to be remedied.
- Tomahawk

But they're all really well conditioned. Shouldn't that make surer Berube keeps his job for a decade or two?

Easy shorter term, less PIMS, better defensively, cheaper buyout option. How many more years before Hartnell becomes worse than Umberger? Once he hits that level he is literally useless. 5 years left I say he has a good year or 2 left before he is an anchor.
- xShoot4WarAmpsx

Rare is the power forward who ages well -- Hartnell's a good player who did some good things with the Flyers

But the NHL doesn't change -- a 35-year-old Hartnell is very likely to be something no Flyers fan wanted to see

Flyers have CLB then NJ, CAR, TB, and FL.

I could see them winning tonight and then winning 3 of 4 of those home games.

Treads fall off Tank Nation.

Problem is they could also go 1 for 5 here, and the Tank picks up steam.
I think they win 4/5 with some stellar play from Mase.

Flyers have CLB then NJ, CAR, TB, and FL.

I could see them winning tonight and then winning 3 of 4 of those home games.

Treads fall off Tank Nation.

Problem is they could also go 1 for 5 here, and the Tank picks up steam.
I think they win 4/5 with some stellar play from Mase.
- Marc D

They're getting three of those

Don't know which three, but they're getting 'em

Per yesterday's discussion, in response to hammarby: Lindros was not a very good fighter. He was able to rough up guys like Lee Norwood and Joe Reekie because he was just that much stronger. He never had great technique, which is why a guy like Lyle Odelein could fight him to at least a draw. If he had the technique of even maybe Brad May, he would have been unbeatable.

Flyers have CLB then NJ, CAR, TB, and FL.

I could see them winning tonight and then winning 3 of 4 of those home games.

Treads fall off Tank Nation.

Problem is they could also go 1 for 5 here, and the Tank picks up steam.
I think they win 4/5 with some stellar play from Mase.
- Marc D

I can see them winning CLB, CAR. Florida possibly. NJ and TB no

Per yesterday's discussion, in response to hammarby: Lindros was not a very good fighter. He was able to rough up guys like Lee Norwood and Joe Reekie because he was just that much stronger. He never had great technique, which is why a guy like Lyle Odelein could fight him to at least a draw. If he had the technique of even maybe Brad May, he would have been unbeatable.
- jmatchett383

Lindros lost decisively to Marty McSorley but didn't lose that many.

Lindros lost decisively to Marty McSorley but didn't lose that many.
- bmeltzer

You wouldn't want a player of Lindros's caliber fighting too often anyway.